Do I need a dually?

[NewtoTowing]

So I am looking to buy a new truck and toy hauler. The toy hauler will be a Keystone Raptor. I'm not yet sure which configuration but I am working off the heaviest to be safe. The Raptor 423 has a shipping weight of 15,358lbs, carrying capacity of 3642lbs, and hitch of 3390lbs. I'm looking at a Chevy Silverado 3500HD single rear axle. I believe that it tows up to 17,200lbs with a payload of 7742lbs. Will this configuration be enough or should I switch to the dually???

[wiredgeorge]

Originally Posted by NewtoTowing

So I am looking to buy a new truck and toy hauler. The toy hauler will be a Keystone Raptor. I'm not yet sure which configuration but I am working off the heaviest to be safe. The Raptor 423 has a shipping weight of 15,358lbs, carrying capacity of 3642lbs, and hitch of 3390lbs. I'm looking at a Chevy Silverado 3500HD single rear axle. I believe that it tows up to 17,200lbs with a payload of 7742lbs. Will this configuration be enough or should I switch to the dually???

The published hitch weight will not be a real world weight. If your prospective camper is in the 18K lbs gross weight range, your real world pin weight will be north of 4000 lbs and add in hitch weight and weight of cargo and passengers in the truck and you will be moving up towards 4700 lbs or more. No single wheel 1 ton can handle that payload. You are definitely in dually territory. When you see a prospective truck purchase, open the driver door and check out the yellow/white placard which will tell you the specific payload for that truck. Don't rely on sales brochures, salemen or any source except the payload placard. Any one ton or even a 3/4 ton will have enough engine to drag the 18K camper but only a dually will have sufficient payload. My one ton has 4K lbs payload and I wouldn't think of towing an 18K gross weight camper.

[chuckster57]

Your in DRW territory for sure.

“Tows up to” doesn’t mean squat, remember that Toyota that towed the space shuttle?

[notanlines]

Newby, your figure of 7742 is about 3000 pounds off the real number. Keep in mind that maximum weight can be 14,000 pounds for a dually. That truck would have to weigh 6,258 pounds. Not even close. Your SRW you have in mind is not the correct choice for that RV. What George said is on the money. You need a dually.

[jasin1]

Yes likely the 7742 is the actual weight of the srw 1ton Chevy 3500hd

[wiredgeorge]

Payload placard in door frame looks like the image below. This trucks payload is 3420 lbs combined passengers and cargo. It is from a one ton truck, single axle.

[NewtoTowing]

So I should go with a dually. Does the gas vs diesel make a big difference in towing ability?

Originally Posted by notanlines

Newby, your figure of 7742 is about 3000 pounds off the real number. Keep in mind that maximum weight can be 14,000 pounds for a dually. That truck would have to weigh 6,258 pounds. Not even close. Your SRW you have in mind is not the correct choice for that RV. What George said is on the money. You need a dually.

[jasin1]

Originally Posted by NewtoTowing

So I should go with a dually. Does the gas vs diesel make a big difference in towing ability?

Choice is up to you with gas vs diesel but I think “ most” dually s are ordered diesel and that’s what I have …very solid towing platform..gas engines have come a long way but a diesel exhaust brake is hard to beat

[chuckster57]

Originally Posted by NewtoTowing

So I should go with a dually. Does the gas vs diesel make a big difference in towing ability?

I towed my previous fiver with both a big block V8 gasser and current diesel… night and day difference, diesel all the way.

[JRTJH]

According to the Chevrolet Towing Guide, Here's the diesel/gas specs for a 2022 crew cab dually 4x4:

Diesel max trailer 20.000 Combined truck/trailer (GCWR) 40,000
Gas max trailer 15,240 Combined truck/trailer (GCWR) 24,000

Both have a truck GVWR of 14,000

https://www.chevrolet.com/trucks/sil...ngineThree=L8T

The gas truck "gives up 16,000 pounds of combined capability and 4760 pounds of trailer capacity.

Both will "drag your chosen trailer forward, but one will do it with power/capability to spare and one will be "huffing and puffing at maximum capability every time you hitch the trailer. I'd suspect some "premature vehicle failures would follow the choice of buying a gas dually for a trailer that size.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by NewtoTowing

So I should go with a dually. Does the gas vs diesel make a big difference in towing ability?

For that trailer a dually is mandatory to be anywhere close to safe. As far as gas vs diesel, that can become a very "spirited" conversation - but not with a proposed 19k trailer, it's diesel all the way....and that's from a gas truck person. A gas powered HD truck (SRW) is out its element at anything over probably 13k with the newer engines, transmissions AND a higher rear axle ratio (4.10 up). Add a dually, which is required for this trailer, into the mix (weight) and that manageable tow weight drops 8-900 lbs. I'm a Ram guy so the only option I see is the 6.7 Cummins HO with Aisin, GM and Ford have comparable options.

[jsb5717]

Welcome aboard! First I have to say that I think it's great that you are actually asking for advice before making the purchase...too many make an ill-advised purchase then try to seek affirmation.

You've received very sound advice. Dually is no doubt you're only safe option. I'm also a 'diesel all the way' kind of guy. And if Danny (Sourdough), who is a gas engine guy, says you need a diesel, then you should take that to the bank.

Dually/diesel - that's your combo. Choose your favorite brand.

[gearhead]

Dually.
Diesel.
With an optional higher capacity fuel tank.

[jasin1]

Originally Posted by gearhead

Dually.
Diesel.
With an optional higher capacity fuel tank.

YES on the 50 gallon factory tank!

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by NewtoTowing

So I am looking to buy a new truck and toy hauler. The toy hauler will be a Keystone Raptor. I'm not yet sure which configuration but I am working off the heaviest to be safe. The Raptor 423 has a shipping weight of 15,358lbs, carrying capacity of 3642lbs, and hitch of 3390lbs. I'm looking at a Chevy Silverado 3500HD single rear axle. I believe that it tows up to 17,200lbs with a payload of 7742lbs. Will this configuration be enough or should I switch to the dually???

Originally Posted by NewtoTowing

So I should go with a dually. Does the gas vs diesel make a big difference in towing ability?

Yes, definitely you need a DRW!

The important number you need to know is Payload!
A SRW will top out around 4,000, most DRW top out at about 5,500# nicely equipped Diesel. If you do a bit of research you will find gas ability to pull tops out about 16,000#, my Ram pulling ability is listed at 25,225#. Understand that the towing number is derived by pulling a goose neck flat bed trailer with the weigh placed such that the tongue weight is within the GVWR and rear axle rating.

It trailer requires a big truck, we full time and our 2016 Ram crew cab long bed is our only vehicle, I go where I want, not many places I don’t fit.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by rhagfo

Yes, definitely you need a DRW!

The important number you need to know is Payload!
A SRW will top out around 4,000, most DRW top out at about 5,500# nicely equipped Diesel. If you do a bit of research you will find gas ability to pull tops out about 16,000#, my Ram pulling ability is listed at 25,225#. Understand that the towing number is derived by pulling a goose neck flat bed trailer with the weigh placed such that the tongue weight is within the GVWR and rear axle rating.

It trailer requires a big truck, we full time and our 2016 Ram crew cab long bed is our only vehicle, I go where I want, not many places I don’t fit.

At 16k you have to have a dually AND diesel. With a dually, or any truck, a gas truck cannot adequately perform with a 16k RV no matter what some graph says - btdt for many years - it can't get out of its own way with that weight.

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by sourdough

At 16k you have to have a dually AND diesel. With a dually, or any truck, a gas truck cannot adequately perform with a 16k RV no matter what some graph says - btdt for many years - it can't get out of its own way with that weight.

Just stating gas top out at about 16,000# doesn’t matter SRW or DRW. I was referring to pull ability not carry at that point.

The facts a gas 350/3500 may have enough payload to carry a 16,000# TH, but sure would not be enjoyable to pull with!

[Jmhughes9]

You are definitely in Dually territory. Great video below explaining all the aspects of 5th wheel towing from Changing Lanes on Youtube. We have a dual axle 12,700 lb. toy hauler (2018 Impact 367) with a SWR Silverado Duramax and we are close to maxed out on specs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87runDszXLQ&t=2032s

________________________________________________
2018 Keystone Impact 367
2020 Silverado Duramax High Country 8' SRW

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by Jmhughes9

You are definitely in Dually territory. Great video below explaining all the aspects of 5th wheel towing from Changing Lanes on Youtube. We have a dual axle 12,700 lb. toy hauler (2018 Impact 367) with a SWR Silverado Duramax and we are close to maxed out on specs.

________________________________________________
2018 Keystone Impact 367
2020 Silverado Duramax High Country 8' SRW

Well have you weighed your Impact?
Here are the weight specs on your TH;
Technical Specifications:

Length 39'
Dry Weight 12,825#
Payload Capacity 4,175#
GVWR 17,000#
Hitch Weight (dry) 2,970#

You might want to double check your weights. You list the dry weight of your TH not the actual scaled weight. I assume the listed payload on your 2020 3500 SRW is in the 4,000# range, leaving you about 1,000# for passengers, equipment and hitch.
I chose a DRW, because some math as to our pin weight, in bed tool box, hitch, and passengers, came to about 4,200# which was too close to the payload of a SRW.

[wiredgeorge]

We will just have to wait and see if the OP who signed off the forum yesterday after posting the initial post in this thread returns.