Slide out question.

[Frankp877]

New to this group as well as new to Keystone products. Have had many campers over the years but this is the first Keystone.
My wife and I purchased a 2025 Cougar 25FKD last September and are very happy with the layout as well as the size. Our other campers had slide outs so we're not new to the operation, but I do want to know if Cougar in general does not add slide out skis to the slides?

We are seeing a slight bit of water on the floor of the left side of the large slide. When I first mentioned this to the dealer they said I probably did not close the slide all the way, and I disagreed but decided it could be a possibility. Upon opening the camper after this past winter we once again found a small amount of water on the floor.

I have looked at the ceiling and walls for any sign of leaks as well as the windows and have found nothing. When I lift the vinyl flooring of the slide out I find water a small amount of moisture in between the flooring and the floor. Seems the flooring is not glued down, just on the edges?

My thought is without the skis could the water be coming in from underneath?

Definitely going back to the dealer on Monday with this but just curious if anyone has had a similar issue.

Thanks for listening to my ramble.

Frank

 

[DutchmenSport]

Congrats on getting your new Cougar and I hope you can get your issues figured out. But, here's one bit of food for thought .... Water rolls down hill. Having skies under the camper should not cause water intrusion from "under" the floor upwards. Your water is coming in from the top down. Most likely, the rubber seals are not aligning correct, or one could be installed crooked, or one could even be torn or ripped.

Another observation? Does the water intrusion happen ONLY when it rains? Or do you experience water intrusion when it's dry outside?

Another question? If the weather IS dry, do you experience the water intrusion when the Air Conditioner is running, or do you have water intrusion even when the Air Conditioner is running and it's dry outside too? Your AC creates condensation too and that water will drip off the roof. If there is a leak somewhere on the roof, it's possible the water on your floor is working it's way inside the camper.

If dry outside, and no AC running, it's possible, the water is being caused by simple condensation collecting on the walls of the slide and pooling on the floor. So, to help solve your mystery, what's the weather conditions when this happens and the use of heat or AC inside the camper?

 

[Frankp877]

Thank you Dutchmen, appreciate the help.

Both times we have found water in the camper has been when we are taking it out of storage and getting ready for a trip. That eliminates the AC runoff as a culprit. Small amount of water, no more than a cup on the left side of the large dining slide out.

Funny part is it seems to be coming in from between the floor and the floor material. I can lift up the leading edge of the slide flooring and there is moisture along the edge of the floor itself.

I can't imagine that much condensation but I guess it is possible.

The most recent trip we encountered rain and saw no leaks anywhere which leaves me thinking it may be a seal issue when closed or the slide not closing completely. Either way it's going to be a dealer problem to solve since we're still on warranty.

 

[JRTJH]

What do you mean when you say, "We are seeing a slight bit of water on the floor of the left side of the large slide." Is that the "left side" when outside looking at the slide, or the "left side" when inside looking at the slide??? If you mean the "forward end of the slide" then I believe your city water connection, water heater and probably the water pump all located "in the cabinet next to that end of the slide. You could have some sealant leakage in one of those multiple "wall openings" or you could easily have a fitting leaking in that area. Also, condensation from cold water in an uninsulated PEX tube entering the trailer "could contribute" to water dripping in that area, although that shouldn't happen while the trailer is in storage.

Then, when you open the slide, along the bottom of each end wall is a metal "joiner strip" that has been an issue for a lot of owners. That joiner strip is about 3/8" thick and if any water sheds off the end wall, if the slide is not "leaning out" or is there is any "leaning in" that water can run along the top edge of that strip and into the trailer. The slide seals don't conform completely along that strip and that small gap can lead to water intrusion.

Also, looking at your model, the front end of the slide sits DIRECTLY under the cap/roof/sidewall joiner. There is a plastic "rain gutter spout" at that 3 way union, but there is also a tremendous amount of sealant on the roof in that area. It is possible that the rain gutter spout is blocked by sealant and any water running off the roof, if the trailer is "nose low" would run toward that gutter spout, but roll out of the gutter and down the sidewall rather than into the spout. That would put water running over the closed top flange of the slide and directed at the end flange of the slide.... If the "D-seal" on the top of that slide flange is leaking at the end corner, water could be running into the inside of the flange and down to the floor where that "joiner strip" is located, and then into the trailer....

So look inside that kitchen cabinet where all the plumbing is located, look at the joiner strip, look at the rain gutter spout and check the D-seals along the top and sides of the slide flange... It could be something as simple as the D-seal at the top doesn't cover the side D-seal but is "cut short" so the edge is on top rather than on the side of the rubber's corner...

 

[Frankp877]

Sorry for the confusion. I'm talking about the slide from "inside" the camper. The seating and dining area are on the larger slide out. When looking at the slide from inside, the water is on the left.

I can almost say with certainty that the water is between the flooring (vinyl) and the actual floor of the slide. Almost as if it is "wicking" in from the outside.

I checked the seams outside of the slide and all look to be intact.

 

[{Tpc}]

Look in the wheel well area, below the slide room. Its hard to tell from the photos I've seen but look for any open gaps in the flooring of the slide room that may be exposed to the wheel well. My slide room had a gap (I honestly still don't know why the gap even existed to this day) but it was large enough that when traveling if we encountered any rain, it would wick up into the carpet. The dealer fixed the issue, and no problems since, but it could be something like that happening.

At first I thought you mean the left side of the room while on the outside which would be near your water ports and HW tank, but I guess its the other side. There isn't a bathroom or kitchen near that area by chance? I've seen issues before where the lack of water pressure regulator would overcome a joint or union in the plumbing and create an issue not normally seen.

 

[Frankp877]

We had a wheel well issue on an older camper and that was one of my first areas I checked, all good.
As for a pressure regulator, we haven't used the city water hook up as yet, only running the on board pump.

We are in the middle of a two day rain right now so I'm anxious to check and see if I can locate an entry point.
Either way, it goes to the dealer next week.

 

[Frankp877]

Got it back from the dealer and they insisted they sprayed water on the slide out, checked all the seals and can find no water leak anywhere.

After an overnight rain I went to the camper in our storage lot and found a small puddle of water on the slide out floor right in front of the sofa ,not very much water but water just the same.

I've checked the walls for any sign of water stains as well as the floor, and can not find any water trails.

There are no roof penetrations above the area of the water so have ruled that out.

Dealer was pushing "condensation" but I'm not sure I buy that as a source of the water

 

[{Tpc}]

Was the puddle there after "moving" the trailer? Did you check prior to the last time dropping off at the storage lot? Just wondering if it is something that could be coming from the bathroom and settling in that spot?

Not the same thing, but I had an instance where I was hooked up to water, but without the pressure reducer. Kept finding puddles around the toilet in the morning, couldn't figure it out. What was actually happening is that the pressure was so strong that the spray ports in the bowl were spraying up under the seat and it was running down the sides of the bowl and puddling on the floor. Apparently, when the bathroom was used at night with the lights off. I put the reducer on, problem solved.

I've also left too much water in the bowl on the way home from a trip. The water splashed out, and I had a wet floor when i dropped it off at storage.

Not saying this is happening to you, but maybe there is water coming from somewhere inside and trickling down to a low point in the floor and puddling. You might try your own water spray test at home, and see if you get a puddle. Then you can demonstrate it to the dealer.

 

[Frankp877]

I did check when put in storage. Had the slide open in order to put a few things away and while open checked and all was dry.

The location of the water is what is baffling to me. If it were migrating from the bath area or the kitchen I can't see how it would be on the top of the slide floor. It would have to get on top the slide somehow without getting the floor wet under the leading edge of the slide which has been dry.

This may be a long shot, but I noticed the sofa is actually held in place on the slide floor with screws into the floor. Could it be possible that water is running down the outside of the slide, and finding a way in through the holes of the screws?

I sent a message to Keystone Customer Service asking for help, hopefully they'll have some answers.

Thanks

 

[jxnbbl]

Sorry long reply so it is understandable - So I had the same experience and couldn't solve it until we were sitting in Florida in a crazy storm and saw trickling water. Although a different trailer, same location the large slide. The bottom line for us is that the holes for the windows were cut larger. Where you could get on a ladder and look at the windows from the exterior....the sealing seemed to be fine, but it was not. The upper lip/seal of the windows covered the opening and it looked nice there really was not enough coverage of that lip.

The quick fix was to put electrical tape all along the top of the two large windows and 1/2 way down each side and continue the trip.

The real fix since I didn't want to bring it to the dealer (too long for them to fix...and needed trailer) was to a new seal kit, take the windows out, use some "shims" on the bottom frame of the window so that it was centered in the hole and reinstall/seal the windows. My wife and I did this in one afternoon and it has been fine since.

Whenever in storage I actually strategically put the "mouse repel bags" around the edge of that slide. If they get any water on them, they stain and indicate something is wrong....nothing in about 2 years.

I believe it you use a hose with someone inspecting the inside at the same time I would have discovered this before this Florida trip but I didn't have a clue there was a problem.

 

[JRTJH]

...

I sent a message to Keystone Customer Service asking for help, hopefully they'll have some answers.

Thanks

I don't believe that Keystone is going to be of any help in this situattion. They are in Goshen, 400 miles away and unable to inspect the trailer. Historically, in this kind of situation, their response is to request you take the trailer to your dealership for inspection and when they receive the "dealer's report" Keystone's warranty section will make a decision on what to do next. Since your dealership says that they've sprayed water on the area and could not identify a leak, chances are very good that returning to the dealer will result in similar findings. Although you "might get lucky" with a return trip to the dealer, I'd suspect, as Jay posted above, taking the "diagnostic regimen" into your own hands will probably lead to a faster and less frustrating solution. Either way, good luck finding the source of the leak.

In other words, don't expect much (if anything) in the realm of a solution from Keystone. Their only source of information is either from you or from the dealer. They can't diagnose the fix at the CS department.

 

[Frankp877]

Well JRTJH, you got that right. Got an email from Keystone saying to go back to the dealer. Makes sense I guess.
I'll start my own search and see where it goes from there. I'm still going to push the dealer as I don't want the warranty to expire and still have this issue unresolved.
Thanks everyone

 

[jxnbbl]

Personally I would do my own investigation to find the problem and then bring to the dealer. In my case, I knew they would hold my trailer for a month. Additionally in our case, if you sprayed a hose on the top of the window the resulting trickle on the floor was 5 ft away.

 

[flybouy]

I had a similar experience as Jay reported in post #11. We would randomly find a small trace of water on the floor just past the end of the kitchen cabinet, and under the a/c unit. No staining anywhere, just a small (couple of inches in diameter) puddle without a trace of how it got there.

One camping trip a very violent thunderstorm rolled in. We buttoned down the hatches and water tv as the rain on the curb side wall looked and sounded like it was being sprayed with a fire hose. I noticed a drip off the end of the kitchen counter. Upon investigation found a very small trail of water leading back to the kitchen windows.

Upon returning from that trip I pulled out the windows, applied new sealing tape and installed the windows and sealed the perimeter. Haven't seen any water intrusion in the 10+ years since. Sometimes you just have to be at the "right place at the right time".

 

[Frankp877]

Hate to appear to be beating a dead horse, but I think I might have an idea as to what may be the sporadic leak in our slide out.

When opened all the way the slide out floor is not flush with main floor. It sits about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch higher and is not level.

There is a noticeable slant from the inside to the outside wall.
My guess is the slide is not in the correct position and thereby not sealing correctly.

Older campers we've had the floors of the slides were all fairly flush with the main floor. Are Keystone floors different or do I hopefully have a possible solution?

 

[chuckster57]

Depending on the type of slide mechanism, it may go “down a “ramp” to be flush, or sit higher than the main floor.

 

[workinonit]

The floors can't be flush or the slide won't slide. Like chuck said, some of them have ramps that flush them when they are extended. My floors aren't flush. They have a flap that runs the full length that makes them appear flush.

 

[Frankp877]

I previously owned two campers, both Open Range, and the slide floors did indeed extend out and were flush with the main floor.
This being my first Keystone product I was asking if the slide outs were similar regarding being flush.
Thank you all for the input.