magic electronic gizmo ups mpg and power?

[wiredgeorge]

Reading in an RV blog how a gizmo you connect to your engine control module will give you amazing power boosts and 2-4 mpg better mileage and won't affect your warranty as it leaves no indication on the truck's computer. It is also "plug and play". This is the unit for the 6.0L Ford but they have a module for most diesel trucks. Is this legit? I already have a "tune" on my old 6.0L (a tow tune) that was supposed to add 50hp and keep the idiot light off my dash for the EGR delete. These type tuners are impossible to find these days as the Fed cracked down on those that kept to idiot light from lighting. The one from Diesel Modules doesn't appear to have any ability to modify the set performance. My tune was added via the OBD2 port and not a physical gizmo.

Ford Power Stroke - 6.0L (2003.5-2007) - #62000 - Diesel Modules

2003.5 2004 2005 2006 2007 6.0 Liter Power Stroke Excursion

dieselmodules.com

 

[Notanlines]

I wouldn’t be buying into promises like this. If it seems too good to be true…..

 

[NH_Bulldog]

When I had my Ram 2500 a friend "gifted" me a JET Performance module that plugs into the truck's computer. It was supposed to spoof the computer into thinking the sensor parameters were different and therefore giving more performance out of the Hemi (which was factory tuned-down to meet EPA rules at the time). The reason he gave it to me was because his computer "learned" and reverted back to factory specs, making the module useless. I discovered the exact same thing and "thanked" him appropriately.

When my friend bought a new Ram 3500 diesel (this is why he gave me the JET Module, he added a Banks Power module which did in fact tune the truck for towing purposes. However, he messed with the settings a bit too much and literally melted two of his pistons pulling his 5th wheel up a long 3 mile grade causing a catastrophic engine failure that was not covered under any warranty.

I look at all of these things like snake oil. There is no shortcut. If you want a tune, take it to a tuning shop and leave it at that.

 

[Viper02]

Keep the air filter clean, fuel filter clean and leave the engine and exhaust stock... in the long run your truck will be much happier.. That diesel will last a long time and give decent performance and MPG is just kept in good stock condition.

 

[JRTJH]

I am a firm believer that there is a "happy median" between not enough and too much. Ford, GM and Fiat+ all have automotive engineers that design these engines and then work with the computer engineers to build in two things, Efficiency and reliability. They tune their designs to be as efficient as possible while not tuning them to the "verge of self destruction"... In other words, while power is important, reliability is the key to a reasonable reputation with buyers.

That said, if you ignore emissions, a "GOOD engineer" can tweak the computer to get a little more power out of it without adversely affecting reliability. But there is that "happy median" that starts to turn gray and get wider...

There's lots of "NOT SO GOOD engineers" out there that can/will "push that median" and cross it in some categories to achieve more power. Most any "joe schmuck with a laptop, an OBD cable and a little internet access" can modify a diesel to get more power.

All that said, as that "happy median" gets wider, lots of "cement blocks" land there. The more those "schmucks" push up the power, the more dangerous it becomes to maintain reliability, especially when someone always seems to be "close to that median the faster they go"...

Any tune that pushes the power up also pushes the reliability down and usually pushes emissions "out the window".... Diesels are "forgiving in some ways" but are "finicky beasts" in others. As posted above, ignoring some parameters in reliability to gain more power can "feel good" going up that hill while passing everything on the highway, but if you "melt two pistons" on the journey, all those "everything on the highway" are going to pass you as you sit in "that big beautiful beast disabled in that happy median".....

Choose your vehicle wisely, choose your "tune to squeeze a little extra out of it" even more wisely. Those factory engineers aren't getting paid as much as they do to build junk. They're experts in merging all the factors together and squeeze out the most power while maintaining reliability in the face of emissions....

NOTHING COMES WITHOUT A PRICE TO PAY (somewhere).....

 

[sourdough]

Modified quite a few engines back in the day and you actually could make mods that made big difference....then came computers.

Bought a 4x4 and was going to rebuild the engine but it had the early EFI throttle body - not a lot to do to hop it up. Talked to some shops about alternatives and the consensus was to move back to the old style carbureted engine - crate engine, that would require a new wiring harness and lots of "stuff" - worked with the existing EFI. Tried again on a 2002 hemi. Chip, cold air intake, revised exhaust etc. - nothing helps because the computer adapts....I did get a louder exhaust/intake noise and less mpg.

The new computers, calibrations etc. are, as has been said, set up for max performance and max reliability. Not much
you can do to one without harming the other. IMO trying to "tune" a modern engine already "tuned" for your benefit is not only pointless but possibly detrimental. Solution? But what you need/want from the factory.

 

[Badbart56]

I have had the Banks Power tune on my truck for 7 years and about 60K miles now. It was recommended by some tech friends at the Ford dealership that I worked at briefly. They too were using Banks on their own trucks and advised that it was a well researched tune that was safe, BUT! They did say, use it according to Bank's guidelines! There are multiple settings that you can choose, just don't choose the highest performance when you are towing over 6000 pounds. It's very explicit about this. It added 100 hp and 250 ft/lbs of torque to my 6.7 which is pretty amazing for a cost of under $400.

Back in the day before computers we had to do a lot of extensive mechanical work to achieve horsepower gains. It is amazing what can be done with computers, but that said, I still prefer the old pre-computer days. I do like simplicity and seeing how so many parts are discontinued for vehicles that really aren't that old is discouraging. One of the ABS modules for my 2011 F-350 is no longer in production and the Ford dealership had to source a used one.

I sold my 2004 CTS V last year. So many parts were no longer available. I actually had bought a few dealer only parts in anticipation of them being not available. I still have two Delco body control modules for it that are now discontinued. Who knows what they'll be worth in 20 years!

I went to a car show a few years ago and spoke with a guy there who had a very nice 74 Dodge Charger. I asked him if it was hard finding parts for it and he said that NAPA had pretty much everything he needed for mechanical issues. Interior parts and body parts were the hardest to find. But with all the electronics on the cars built from 84 and up, I seriously doubt any of those parts will be found anywhere for anyone trying to restore them to a stock condition.

 

[Peto]

Anything with the word in it or near it that states "magic" gets a hard pass from me.

driving an '02 power stroke and it will remain stock. I don't need any more power.

 

[JRTJH]

... NAPA had pretty much everything he needed for mechanical issues. Interior parts and body parts were the hardest to find. But with all the electronics on the cars built from 84 and up, I seriously doubt any of those parts will be found anywhere for anyone trying to restore them to a stock condition.

That's my greatest fear with parts for our 2002 TBird. My experience has been that mechanical parts are easier to find for 50/60 era TBirds than for the brief 2002/2005 run. Even the mechanical parts of the engine are "limited availability" as the engine was only used in Jaguar, Lincoln and TBird and only for a limited time. So, things like water pumps, gaskets, etc are virtually "non-existent" and you can forget finding a front or rear computer module or most of the sensors to keep the computer happy. They simply don't exist except for "overly expensive internet sites" which are really nothing more than a high priced junk yard where someone buys wrecked TBirds, disassembles them and puts the parts on a shelf, waiting for the opportunity to be greedy with someone in need of a part. There weren't enough cars produced for the aftermarket manufacturers to start producing and Ford stopped stocking them "years ago"...

As for the Banks recommendations on limiting the "higher output tunes" when towing, that's where the truck manufacturers "idiot-proof" the engine by designing it to be "reliable in nearly every owner use profile" and the aftermarket tunes are "built without regard for "stoopid or aggressive users".... So, run on the edge and risk the inevitable, or so it seems for those who still feel "the immortality of youth"...

 

[Badbart56]

That's my greatest fear with parts for our 2002 TBird. My experience has been that mechanical parts are easier to find for 50/60 era TBirds than for the brief 2002/2005 run.

That's what I was seeing with my CTS V. In 2004 (first year model run) they only built 2461 of them and they used the Corvette Z06 engine, the LS-6. They made another 3508 in 2005 with that engine but they moved to an LS-3 for the 2006 and 2007 models so the LS-6 only had a two year period in the Cadillac application. When I got the car in 2010 I found a network of GM dealers that would sell me parts at employee cost (40% off retail) and I could get practically any part or assembly from these dealers, right up to a complete transmission and complete engines. Over the next 10 years the catalogs were deleting many, many parts for these vehicles.
Today you have a better chance of finding OEM parts on Rock Auto than you will at a GM dealer. Ebay, and other websites have many used parts as you alluded to, but that's pretty much all that's available now. And used electronic parts I fear will not withstand the test of time as a used mechanical part would.
With such a low production number I had planned on holding onto the CTS V, but I didn't park it and look at it, I drove it and enjoyed it. And I was looking at upgrading/modding it, but between renovating the house we bought in Georgia and what with working 3-4 days a week in the trucking industry, there's just not enough money or time left to spare.

 

[JRTJH]

That's what I was seeing with my CTS V.

When we bought the TBird in 2018 from the original owner, it had just under 10K miles on it. It turned over 10K on the way home from their house (about 30 miles away). Our first trip was to Fort Wayne to see our new great grand. On the way back, there were 4 or 5 cars broken down on the side of the interstate. That got me to thinking, so I went to the Ford dealership the next day and asked the parts department if they stock any parts for a 2002 TBird. NOPE. next question: How long does it take to get parts? We don't have availability for anything more than maintenance parts, fluids and a few things like brakes and such... OK, what if I need a water pump? You'd get it faster from NAPA if they can get it. Spark plugs? Same, try NAPA. But you're the manufacturer. Yes, and we stopped stocking parts in the warehouse at the 10 year mark, so we don't carry much any more.... OK, thanks....

So, like you, it got me to thinking: If I drive this thing and it breaks down on the way to Fort Wayne, we're walking or calling a taxi to get home.... It is nice to own, but it gathers dust in the pole barn and I take it out for our grand nephew's or grand niece's home coming parade or for the local "antique car show weekend"... It's going on the market pretty soon. I bought a 2017 Mustang GT convertible and so far, it looks like Ford will have parts for at least the next 5 or 6 years, plus there's a much larger aftermarket parts industry for Mustangs. We drive it and leave the TBird sitting under cover except for special occasions. It's a shame, but I don't want a "4,000 pound paperweight" if I can't find a computer module if one of the two happen to let the smoke out. And both control modules have to be fully functional for even the key to turn the ignition on.

 

[sourdough]

Guys the above comments underscore how I approach vehicles these days - I used to say I would not own a vehicle over 2 years (all vehicles bought new) - that was in the olden days. These days they are extremely reliable if you don't try to mess with them so I've moved to about 5 years or so - sure saved me a lot of money but decreased my time constantly looking at new models...which I love (but I still walk the lots every couple of weeks).

Going to buy a new truck in the next year. Mine has 60k or so but don't need the worry of what "might happen". Holding on to older vehicles (and I've bought a few toys to rebuild) has become a nightmare for parts accessibility and these days....costs. These days and times are a changin.

 

[Badbart56]

Yes, times are a changin. Not happy about it but here we are.

Oh, back to the original subject, upon advice from my tech friends. In the Ford camp anyway, if you're going to use a power adder of any provider, do not adjust the transmission shift points. My guys advise that while they had not seen any transmission failures on the 6 speed automatic that weren't the result of low fluid conditions (leaks), changing the factory parameters could result in failure.

Actually I'm amazed at the factory maintenance schedule calling for the first transmission service at 150K miles but that's when I had it done and I'm at 207K miles now and it still is trouble free. They did use full synthetic fluid though.

 

[jsb5717]

Vehicle tuners have been around for several years. But because of what they do I certainly wouldn't buy one that isn't well known and widely used. There's really nothing "Magic" about them. They are small computers overwriting OEM computer code. There are tested, reliable models made by Superchips, Edge, MinMax, Bullydog, Banks, etc., that can provide a benefit without damaging the vehicle if used within the OEM spec. There's no way I would use a no-name brand promising miracles.

I do think that the need for tuners has greatly diminished in recent years with the OEM increase in HP and torque as well as increased gears in the tranny.

My 2000 Ford with the 7.3 diesel benefited by using a Superchips tuner. The 7.3 came from the factory regulated well below its capabilities. The tuner provided a small bump in HP but the real help was the slight change in shift points in the OEM 4-speed tranny. With only 4 speeds the rig had a bad habit of trying to upshift at inopportune times when pulling a load uphill. The tuner solved that and really improved the towing experience.

My 2012 RAM 6.7 diesel came from the previous owner with a MinMax tuner. With the 6 speed tranny it seemed to handle uphill towing quite nicely without changing shift points. But the 60 HP bump made a very nice difference in the ease of uphill towing.

On the newer trucks with 8 and 10 speed trannys I wouldn't bother with a tuner. If the load being towed is within the spec'd range of the truck then the trucks seem for perform well on their own. With all of the increased electronics it only increases the possibility of damaging something.

Reliable companies still provide tuners for new trucks but they seem targeted at the off-roading, racing crowd where other aftermarket mods are also being made. IMHO not worth the risk for the average RVer just pulling his 5er over the mountain.

 

[firestation12]

Reading in an RV blog how a gizmo you connect to your engine control module will give you amazing power boosts and 2-4 mpg better mileage and won't affect your warranty as it leaves no indication on the truck's computer. It is also "plug and play". This is the unit for the 6.0L Ford but they have a module for most diesel trucks. Is this legit? I already have a "tune" on my old 6.0L (a tow tune) that was supposed to add 50hp and keep the idiot light off my dash for the EGR delete. These type tuners are impossible to find these days as the Fed cracked down on those that kept to idiot light from lighting. The one from Diesel Modules doesn't appear to have any ability to modify the set performance. My tune was added via the OBD2 port and not a physical gizmo.

Ford Power Stroke - 6.0L (2003.5-2007) - #62000 - Diesel Modules

2003.5 2004 2005 2006 2007 6.0 Liter Power Stroke Excursion

dieselmodules.com

Sounds like the Rv blogger has found the fountain of youth. As others have stated, Gale Banks is the only source for performance enhancing that is fully compliant with epa and tested. His products if installed correctly and used as directed for different driving conditions, are reliable. This assumes no other pre-existing conditions are existing and user discretion. Caveat Emptor

 

[jasin1]

Vehicle tuners have been around for several years. But because of what they do I certainly wouldn't buy one that isn't well known and widely used. There's really nothing "Magic" about them. They are small computers overwriting OEM computer code. There are tested, reliable models made by Superchips, Edge, MinMax, Bullydog, Banks, etc., that can provide a benefit without damaging the vehicle if used within the OEM spec. There's no way I would use a no-name brand promising miracles.

I do think that the need for tuners has greatly diminished in recent years with the OEM increase in HP and torque as well as increased gears in the tranny.

My 2000 Ford with the 7.3 diesel benefited by using a Superchips tuner. The 7.3 came from the factory regulated well below its capabilities. The tuner provided a small bump in HP but the real help was the slight change in shift points in the OEM 4-speed tranny. With only 4 speeds the rig had a bad habit of trying to upshift at inopportune times when pulling a load uphill. The tuner solved that and really improved the towing experience.

My 2012 RAM 6.7 diesel came from the previous owner with a MinMax tuner. With the 6 speed tranny it seemed to handle uphill towing quite nicely without changing shift points. But the 60 HP bump made a very nice difference in the ease of uphill towing.

On the newer trucks with 8 and 10 speed trannys I wouldn't bother with a tuner. If the load being towed is within the spec'd range of the truck then the trucks seem for perform well on their own. With all of the increased electronics it only increases the possibility of damaging something.

Reliable companies still provide tuners for new trucks but they seem targeted at the off-roading, racing crowd where other aftermarket mods are also being made. IMHO not worth the risk for the average RVer just pulling his 5er over the mountain.

I am a firm believer that there is a "happy median" between not enough and too much. Ford, GM and Fiat+ all have automotive engineers that design these engines and then work with the computer engineers to build in two things, Efficiency and reliability. They tune their designs to be as efficient as possible while not tuning them to the "verge of self destruction"... In other words, while power is important, reliability is the key to a reasonable reputation with buyers.

That said, if you ignore emissions, a "GOOD engineer" can tweak the computer to get a little more power out of it without adversely affecting reliability. But there is that "happy median" that starts to turn gray and get wider...

There's lots of "NOT SO GOOD engineers" out there that can/will "push that median" and cross it in some categories to achieve more power. Most any "joe schmuck with a laptop, an OBD cable and a little internet access" can modify a diesel to get more power.

All that said, as that "happy median" gets wider, lots of "cement blocks" land there. The more those "schmucks" push up the power, the more dangerous it becomes to maintain reliability, especially when someone always seems to be "close to that median the faster they go"...

Any tune that pushes the power up also pushes the reliability down and usually pushes emissions "out the window".... Diesels are "forgiving in some ways" but are "finicky beasts" in others. As posted above, ignoring some parameters in reliability to gain more power can "feel good" going up that hill while passing everything on the highway, but if you "melt two pistons" on the journey, all those "everything on the highway" are going to pass you as you sit in "that big beautiful beast disabled in that happy median".....

Choose your vehicle wisely, choose your "tune to squeeze a little extra out of it" even more wisely. Those factory engineers aren't getting paid as much as they do to build junk. They're experts in merging all the factors together and squeeze out the most power while maintaining reliability in the face of emissions....

NOTHING COMES WITHOUT A PRICE TO PAY (somewhere).....

Ford makes tuners standard on some of their vehicles ….my 2023 Ford Transit van has 4 modes i can choose…regular,eco,snow/slippery and towing mode…i imagine it’s just a factory tuning module also as i mentioned in the past i almost purchased a 2012 or 13 Laguna Seca edition Boss 302 Mustang that came with two separate ignition keys…one was for the street and one for the track that when used changed the tune for more aggressive launch control and specific engine tuning for performance on track days…you can literally hear the engine changing its exhaust note as the tune makes changes

 

[JRTJH]

Pretty much all of us have a "form of tuner" in our trucks. It's the "Tow/Haul" function. That said, my Mustang GT has a "built in tuner" similar to what your Transit van has, but in the Mustang line it's called "Track Apps" features.... Just a quick "have you heard" comment about the "engine changing its exhaust note"... I'm not sure if you're aware or not, but Ford uses the vehicle sound system to "enhance" the exhaust performance in many of their vehicles... And, you can buy a "tuner" to turn that enhancement off. It makes for a much nicer "long trip cabin sound level"... The tuner for that is a OBD dongle that you insert, deactivate the exhaust enhancement and when you want to "roar again" you reinsert the dongle and reactivate the stereo to go "rrrrrrrrr" LOL

ADDED: Come to think about it a bit longer, if I recall correctly, many (maybe most) electric vehicles use the sound system and an external speaker to "mimic" an internal combustion engine to "warn pedestrians" that the vehicle is near. Apparently in the early days, there were several pedestrians who walked out in front of electric vehicles because they were nearly silent as they "sneaked up on the surprised walkers"....