Do I need to change out my power converter for solar?

[Desertdave-KEY]

I want convert to Lithium batteries in my Keystone Crossfire Bullet 1700BH, My power converter (WFCO WF8955PEC) does not support Lithium properly is what I've read. If I install solar panels and a charge controller for boondocking, do I need to swap out the power converter or just leave it in place and let the Victron charge the batteries?

 

[NH_Bulldog]

Food for thought:

The WFCO WF8955PEC is a lead-acid-optimized converter/charger. While it can technically charge lithium batteries, it doesn't provide the proper charging profile (especially the higher constant voltage and no float stage) that lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) batteries require for optimal performance and longevity.

You have two main options:

Option 1: Leave the WFCO in Place (with Caution)
Pros: No extra cost or installation.
Cons: The WFCO may not fully charge the lithium batteries or could reduce their lifespan over time.

Best Practice: Disconnect or turn off the WFCO when using shore power, and rely on the Victron for charging. Some users install a switch or breaker to manually disable the WFCO when not needed. However, depending on your solar production and system draw, your solar alone will not likely be able to keep up.


Option 2: Replace the WFCO with a Lithium-Compatible Converter
WFCO now makes a WF8955LIS model that is lithium-compatible and a direct swap.
Pros: Proper charging from both shore power and solar.
Cons: Additional cost and installation effort, plus you are now locked to lithium-only charging. Last word of advice, DO NOT buy a converter that has "Auto Detect", it conflicts with the solar and reverts to lead acid charging, putting you back to square one.

 

[chuckster57]

If you’re using flooded batteries, I would stay with your current converter. If you changing to lithium batteries then the advise above is spot on.

 

[Bandit12]

"Cons: Additional cost and installation effort, plus you are now locked to lithium-only charging." From what I read on that charger, it provides for a remote switch that allows you to switch between lead acid and LiFeP04 batteries. Or did I misunderstand the information I read?

 

[ObiRich]

I just did the lithium conversion and had an older WFCO converter. For less than $200, I got the same WFCO but in the auto detecting, and it was a straight up direct swapout.

 

[kehoe-KEY]

I want convert to Lithium batteries in my Keystone Crossfire Bullet 1700BH, My power converter (WFCO WF8955PEC) does not support Lithium properly is what I've read. If I install solar panels and a charge controller for boondocking, do I need to swap out the power converter or just leave it in place and let the Victron charge the batteries?

I have changed over 2 different RV”s to LIP04 battery banks with solar. I opted to leave the original converter as is and simply disconneced the charger portion. This of course only works if you have added another charger. I added an inverter/charger/transfer switch. I then rerouted the incoming AC to it, which then feeds the original ‘convetter’ panel so that the RV is powered both on shore power and when not plugged in and the inverter is on.
On the first RV istarted with a bigger lead acid bank and added a breaker to the ‘conveter’ panel for the battery charger circuit. This I just turned off most of the time as the inverter/charger was far superior. Now with lithium, I just taped the breaker in the off position.

 

[Desertdave-KEY]

"Cons: Additional cost and installation effort, plus you are now locked to lithium-only charging." From what I read on that charger, it provides for a remote switch that allows you to switch between lead acid and LiFeP04 batteries. Or did I misunderstand the information I read?

No switch, its only good for lead acid batteries.

 

[jimupnord]

No switch, its only good for lead acid batteries.

Retired Electrical Engineer here.
The 8955LIS model has a switch on the connection board to enable or disable lithium charging profile without auto detect..
I have used this on multiple campers to convert to Lithium batteries.
LIS = Lithium Switch.

 

[Desertdave-KEY]

Retired Electrical Engineer here.
The 8955LIS model has a switch on the connection board to enable or disable lithium charging profile without auto detect..
I have used this on multiple campers to convert to Lithium batteries.
LIS = Lithium Switch.

I was referring to the converter that I currently have in my unit, not the 8955LIS.

 

[jimupnord]

I was referring to the converter that I currently have in my unit, not the 8955LIS.

The converter you have now will work mostly. I directly swapped in an EPOCH 100AH Lithium battery with no problems after the Lead Acid battery in a new to us Class C worked poorly on the first night of dry camping returning home from picking it up. It had the 8955 version you have.

But I recommend the 8955LIS. Youtube videos are out there to walk you thru the install.

Anyhow, you want the converter on when on shore power.

I connect 200W of solar suitcase panels with Victron MPPT 20 amp charge controller set for Lithium when not on shore power. I don't do anything to disconnect the converter while doing that.

I also added a Renogy 20 amp DC to DC charger set for Lithium to use the power from the tow vehicle to charge while towing as the Lithium battery has different voltage profile needs than the tow vehicle main battery. These DC to DC chargers can increase the voltage to the Lithium battery compensating for lower voltage coming into the charger. I leave that wired in all of the time. But disconnect 7 pin plug when not towing or install a switch to disable. I used outside marker lights as a signal to enable instead.

I don't have an inverter which keeps things simpler.

I did have a case where a substantially drained down lithium battery was drawing about 55 amps from the converter tripping the self resetting 40 amp breaker on my slide in pickup camper, cycling on and off with some audible clicks. Ended up upgrading the charge wiring and breaker size to fix, but then the battery happened to have a 50 amp continuous charge rating so the the BMS on the battery kept shutting down every 30 seconds or so until the charge current went down. So also look at continuous charge current rating on your battery you select. Of course if you parallel 2 batteries they will be able to handle more current by each taking about half.

My 2016 26RLS Cougar 5th wheel did not exhibit breaker tripping. Probably because of additional length of wire run losses from the converter limiting charging voltage to the same Lithium battery and the battery consequently not sucking in as much current.

Jim

 

[Desertdave-KEY]

Option 2: Replace the WFCO with a Lithium-Compatible Converter
WFCO now makes a WF8955LIS model that is lithium-compatible and a direct swap.
Pros: Proper charging from both shore power and solar.
Cons: Additional cost and installation effort, plus you are now locked to lithium-only charging. Last word of advice, DO NOT buy a converter that has "Auto Detect", it conflicts with the solar and reverts to lead acid charging, putting you back to square one.

But I recommend the 8955LIS. Youtube videos are out there to walk you thru the install.

Can you guys tell me where one can purchase this converter? I've googled it every way possible and can not find it anywhere. All I come up with is the AD version.

Dave

 

[NH_Bulldog]

I did some digging and despite one of my previous posts, I am pretty sure that the WF-8955LIS is an obsolete model. WFCO went from a model that could only charge lead acid to a model with a selector switch, and then to a model with auto-detect. They should have stuck with the model you can switch. I sent them my auto-detect converter and they added a plug-in jumper inside the case to make it only charge lithium. It is the only battery I will ever use, and I have a warning label on my battery box that says "Lithium Batteries Only". I can easily open the case on my converter to remove the jumper if I want, but don't ever see that happening.

That being said, since the switchable version is obsolete and no longer widely available, and the auto-detect doesn't live up to it's hype, I would simply get a current Progressive Dynamics model (they still have the ability to manual select battery type). Progressive is arguably a better product than WFCO anyway.

 

[Desertdave-KEY]

I did some digging and despite one of my previous posts, I am pretty sure that the WF-8955LIS is an obsolete model. WFCO went from a model that could only charge lead acid to a model with a selector switch, and then to a model with auto-detect. They should have stuck with the model you can switch. I sent them my auto-detect converter and they added a plug-in jumper inside the case to make it only charge lithium. It is the only battery I will ever use, and I have a warning label on my battery box that says "Lithium Batteries Only". I can easily open the case on my converter to remove the jumper if I want, but don't ever see that happening.

That being said, since the switchable version is obsolete and no longer widely available, and the auto-detect doesn't live up to it's hype, I would simply get a current Progressive Dynamics model (they still have the ability to manual select battery type). Progressive is arguably a better product than WFCO anyway.

Is this the one you are referring too?

 

[NH_Bulldog]

Based on your original post, you do not have a deck mount converter, yours is a power center model. That being said, you would want to go with a PD4600 series PD4600-Converter - Progressive Dynamics

 

[Desertdave-KEY]

Based on your original post, you do not have a deck mount converter, yours is a power center model. That being said, you would want to go with a PD4600 series PD4600-Converter - Progressive Dynamics

Thank You Sir! You are absolutely correct.

Dave

 

[jimupnord]

Thank You Sir! You are absolutely correct.

Dave

Some current offers I found for for 8955LIS:

Arterra WF-8955LIS-MBA Power Converter, 8900 Series, 55 Amp DC Output

Tweetys RV Parts and Accessories is your source for Everything RV, Camper or Motorhome Related. In our Hitch and Towing Center you will find everything needed to outfit your tow vehicle. Lowest prices and fastest shipping guaranteed.

tweetys.com

WFCO 8900 Series Main Board Assembly - WF-8955LIS-MBA

Replacement Main Board Assembly

www.dyersonline.com

Jim

 

[Desertdave-KEY]

Some current offers I found for for 8955LIS:

Arterra WF-8955LIS-MBA Power Converter, 8900 Series, 55 Amp DC Output

Tweetys RV Parts and Accessories is your source for Everything RV, Camper or Motorhome Related. In our Hitch and Towing Center you will find everything needed to outfit your tow vehicle. Lowest prices and fastest shipping guaranteed.

tweetys.com

WFCO 8900 Series Main Board Assembly - WF-8955LIS-MBA

Replacement Main Board Assembly

www.dyersonline.com

Jim

Awesome.

 

[Desertdave-KEY]

So I was given some additional advice on this situation. Instead for spending $300+ for a new converter, Invest that $$ in additional solar panels. His reasoning was, let the converter on shore power charge the lithium batteries (which will only get to about 90%) and then let the charge controller from solar finish topping off the batteries to 100%. Any flaws in this advice?

 

[JRTJH]

Everyone will have "their opinion" about that workaround. I tend to agree with larger solar panels and using the OEM converter/charger "IN YOUR LOCATION"... You'll have enough sunlight on a daily basis to "top off the batteries using solar"... However, I wouldn't offer that same advice to someone living in Michigan who "full times in their trailer"... Why? In the winter, when the solar panels are covered with 70" of snow, that part of the "battery charging system" is essentially disabled completely. So, without a lithium capable battery charger, all winter the batteries would not be fully charged....

Others may address "charge profile differences" and what that might do to a lithium battery. They might address "other differences" either to the batteries or with the "interface between the solar and WFCO charging profiles"... IMO, that's getting "way out in the tall weeds" for most people who want to maintain a simple lithium charging system for a travel trailer with one or two lithium batteries. It would be a completely different situation if you were living off the grid with thousands of watts of solar panels and an extensive lithium battery bank that fills a shed with large quantities of batteries intended to power a house with all its "high consumption appliances"....

 

[Desertdave-KEY]

Everyone will have "their opinion" about that workaround. I tend to agree with larger solar panels and using the OEM converter/charger "IN YOUR LOCATION"... You'll have enough sunlight on a daily basis to "top off the batteries using solar"... However, I wouldn't offer that same advice to someone living in Michigan who "full times in their trailer"... Why? In the winter, when the solar panels are covered with 70" of snow, that part of the "battery charging system" is essentially disabled completely. So, without a lithium capable battery charger, all winter the batteries would not be fully charged....

Others may address "charge profile differences" and what that might do to a lithium battery. They might address "other differences" either to the batteries or with the "interface between the solar and WFCO charging profiles"... IMO, that's getting "way out in the tall weeds" for most people who want to maintain a simple lithium charging system for a travel trailer with one or two lithium batteries. It would be a completely different situation if you were living off the grid with thousands of watts of solar panels and an extensive lithium battery bank that fills a shed with large quantities of batteries intended to power a house with all its "high consumption appliances"....

Very true, I live in sunny Arizona and will most likely boondock for most of my adventures. But I will visit RV parks that have shore power. I just wanted to make sure the Lead acid battery converter would not damage my lithium batteries for the occasional shore power hook up. Also when hooking up my generator to the shore power outlet to charge the batteries while boondocking.