12 v systems not working but slide does?

[mikehoyt]

Hello again

Passport 221BH

Trailer is parked for winter with 12v fridge turened off, slide in, switch at giggy box in off position. The other day when was finally a decent amount above freezing I decided to put out the slide. I turned the giggy box switch to ON and stepped in the trailer. No lights working, nothing on radio, gauges, etc ... even the pumps and awning not working. However the slide went out and back in with no issues at all.

Victron shunt and Victron MPPT controller both show the battery is fully charged.

I also tried plugging in to shore power with no change in the 12v systems

Am wondering if there is a main fuse that I should check (and where it is located) or if there is something inside the giggy box I should check

Current configuration is 2 x 6v lead acid batteries with 220 Amp hours, Renogy 1000watt inverter (switched off), solarflex 200 (no disconnect to PV panels yet installed).

Am interested to hear thoughts on this. Mostly a Springtime project but would like to get a head start

Thanks
Mike Hoyt

 

[Stumpy75]

There's usually two circuit breakers on the frame near the battery. One is for high amp things, like the slide, and the other feeds the other 12v things. I have a feeling that one of those breakers may have a problem, or maybe some corrosion?

Breakers

 

[mikehoyt]

There's usually two circuit breakers on the frame near the battery. One is for high amp things, like the slide, and the other feeds the other 12v things. I have a feeling that one of those breakers may have a problem, or maybe some corrosion?

Breakers

Thank you Chris

Are these in the Giggy box? I opened that but saw nothing that looks like it has a reset

You may be on to something though. The electric stabilizer jacks, tongue jack and slide are all functioning. Nothing else 12 volt is

Thanks
Mike Hoyt

 

[JRTJH]

Thank you Chris

Are these in the Giggy box? I opened that but saw nothing that looks like it has a reset

You may be on to something though. The electric stabilizer Jack's, tongue jack and slide are all functioning. Nothing else 12 volt is

Thanks
Mike Hoyt

The 12VDC "circuit breakers" are auto reset type. They have a thermal fuse inside them, when the amperage is too high, they "trip off" and then when they cool down, they automatically reset. There are either 3, 4 or 5 inside the Giggy Box along the bottom. While they don't have a "button to push to reset" there is a good likelyhood of a loose connector crimped on a power wire, a loose electrical contact nut on a "Circuit breaker can" or even corrosion inside one of the canisters, causing the thermal fuse not to reset because of the corrosion.... So, check for anything loose or disconnected on the connectors on all of those little cans and then check to make sure you have 12VDC on EVERY screw type connector to a known good ground at each of those canisters inside the Giggy Box..

I can't begin to count the number of these "crimp connectors" that I've found bad through the years... Check every one of them !!!!!

 

[DDuncan51]

I'm not sure what a giggy box is, but my 2012 Keystone has a power shut off switch. When off, the landing gear and slide works. Nothing else. Is it possible your giggy box got stuck in the off position?

 

[JRTJH]

I'm not sure what a giggy box is, but my 2012 Keystone has a power shut off switch. When off, the landing gear and slide works. Nothing else. Is it possible your giggy box got stuck in the off position?

The Giggy Box (called a Brock Box in fifth wheels) is nothing more than an "organized replacement" for the older "rats nest of wires" where the umbilical cable connects to the trailer 12 volt electrical system. In the old days, that "rats nest" was typically contained in a metal 4x4 electrical junction box. The Giggy Box is a plastic water tight replacement for that metal junction box and includes all (or most) of the 12 VDC circuit breakers that were screwed to the trailer front bulkhead. It also contains a "battery cutoff switch" that removes ALL battery power, even the safety phantom drains.

It's nothing more than an "upgraded rats nest" that's sort of "cleaned up and better organized".... Here's the old and the new:

 

[JDNewman]

All this talk about a "Giggy Box". My 2021 Montana does NOT have one of these. It has the "rat's nest" of wires connected to buss bars with a plastic shield that does little else than prevent wires from touching each other. No enclosure.

 

[JRTJH]

All this talk about a "Giggy Box". My 2021 Montana does NOT have one of these. It has the "rat's nest" of wires connected to buss bars with a plastic shield that does little else than prevent wires from touching each other. No enclosure.

That may be. My 2014 does not have a Giggy Box either.... However, the Original Poster, MikeHoyt does have a Giggy Box, has said that he's turned it on and still no power inside the trailer, but that his slide is still working. So that's the "direction of this thread"...

 

[mikehoyt]

This is the inside of our giggy box and the diagram. Interestingly the problem occurred when battery switch had been off for three months and temps well below freezing. Today was well above freezing for two days and when i turned on battery swich with cover off all 12 volt circuits were functioning.

Mike

 

[JRTJH]

This is the inside of our giggy box and the diagram. Interestingly the problem occurred when battery switch had been off for three months and temps well below freezing. Today was well above freezing for two days and when i turned on battery swich with cover off all 12 volt circuits were functioning.

Mike

With that information and using your Giggy Box schematic, you "COULD HAVE" corrosion on one of the connections at the individual 12VDC circuit breakers or a corroded 12VDC circuit breaker even if those connections are all clean and tight. The circuit breakers I'm referring to are the four "squares with tapered ends next to the #4 on the schematic (2 are dark lines and 2 are dotted lines) and the connections are at the buss bar that connects #3 to each of those squares and the connections: 6/7, 8/9, 10 and 11. I think what you have is that one of those 12VDC circuit breakers is the problem, but it could be a wire connection to that individual breaker. In your photo, there is what looks like corrosion between the schematic #1 and #5 as well as around the bottom connections AND evidence of water being inside the Giggy Box based on the dried dirt/dust on many of the components. The rubber seal on the cover may not be seated correctly or may even be missing. Anyway, determine which of those circuit breakers protects the 12 VDC trailer circuits and you'll probably find your culprit. It may be working today, but could fail again, probably when you're either preparing for a trip or trying to break camp to return home.... Those things never seem to fail when they're in the shop for other repairs...

 

[mikehoyt]

Thanks John

While investigating this problem I noted that the cover was cracked at one end. The crack was not really visible before I unscrewed the cover but it was there. Likely cause the seal to fail somewhat.

Based on what was working and what was not I believe it is the 30AM breaker 8/9. It has multiple wires of the gauge I would expect for lights, radio, pumps and awning. The 50 amp breaker 6/7 has a much heavier gauge wire running from it so likely powers the slide and stabilizing jacks.

I will clean the contacts (esp on 8/9) and already have ordered a replacement giggy box cover. Should likely see about a spare 30 am circuit breaker just in case as well

Thanks all. This has been very helpful

Mike
2022 Keystone Passport 221BH
1987 Carol Marine Frers 33 Sailboat (other toy that consumes time)

 

[mikehoyt]

Does anyone know what the replacement part is for the 30AMP auto reset fuse (8/9 in the diagram). I am hoping to buy a spare to have on hand

 

[mikehoyt]

Problem resolved. Nut securing wires to post on 8/9 in diagram was very loose. Kind of tight in there behind battery boxes so not immediately apparent

On a related topic. Keystone DIY group sent me a replacement Giggy box cover at no charge. This was our second interaction with them and they have been excellent

Regards

Mike Hoyt
2022 Passport 221 BH

 

[chuckster57]

Good to hear its fixed and Keystone DIY stepped up

 

[flybouy]

^^^ X2 on that!