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Old 08-03-2020, 09:55 AM   #21
CWtheMan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongoose9400 View Post
Iím sure itís a classic china bomb scenario.

Until you can prove it was a China problem it's a classic tread separation; probable cause, over loaded oar under inflated or both.
How do I determine if I can safely upgrade and run 235/85r16 tires?

First, ask Keystone.

There are zero LT235/85R16 of any load range, qualified as replacements for your LRF tires.

Obviously the best replacement is any ST235/80R16 LRF or LRG with a maximum load capacity equal to or greater than your OE tires.

Again, standard LRF tires all have a maximum PSI rating of 95 PSI. What you will have to watch if using like sized replacement tires is the load index number. Most like yours should have a load index of 127. Other brands at 95 PSI will have a load index of 126 which does not qualify to replace a 127.
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Old 08-03-2020, 12:22 PM   #22
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The best way to determine if you can up size from ST 235/80x16 to ST235/85x16 is measure existing clearance of the current installed tires ... the 235/85 series is about 1/2 inch taller... your tire spacing would be reduced accordingly...


On my Alpine it came with TK 235/80x16 E rated ten ply... I yanked those off and went to 235/85x16 14 ply G rated... my wheels are stamped for 110 psi so no issues upgrading wheels

Valve stems are all metal high pressure... I run 105 psi cold and have for the last 4 seasons... starting my 5th season... no clearance issue and no frets about an under rated tire blowing out...

My next set will be Sailun S637 when the Les Schwab Geo Stars show evidence of needing replacing. My tires are always covered when not towing to protect against UV degradation
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Old 08-03-2020, 01:51 PM   #23
CedarCreekWoody
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I can't help you with the tire issue just wanted to say we most likely walked past you last week in Gulf State Park. Beautiful park but hot in the summertime.
We were fortunate with no blown tires although I had one go flat as we were preparing to depart.
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Old 08-03-2020, 02:10 PM   #24
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I believe one possible reason that some brands of ST tires never get bad comments in RV forums is that no one has heard of them or uses them. I looked up ST tires in my camper's approximate size (15" rim) and Trailer King RST ST225/75R15 was the Walmart "Best Seller". Stands to reason more them are out there and more people will experience failures if for no other reason is that they are used as OEM tires and a popular replacement. If you start scrolling through the more than 50 pages of tires in my approximate size (I didn't) you will see there are dozens and dozens of off brand tires that no one has ever reviewed negatively probably because they don't sell many. Just a theory. I am also not claiming Trailer Kings are good tires. I have owned ONE Trailer King; it was on the spare tire rim mounted on my current trailer rear bumper and developed a "knot" and one day just blew up with rubber all over the place with the tire mounted to the carrier and had never been used by the look of it. Not sure how old it was but it obviously had not seen use. BANG.



https://www.walmart.com/search/?query=trailer%20tires
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Old 08-03-2020, 03:04 PM   #25
Mongoose9400
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http://www.gosailun.com/MRT/Tire/S637T

It appears the Sailun S637T ST235/80R16 is a good contender and I think I am leaning towards them based on the advice of the forum.

Insurance claim is filed and appointment set to get it in for repair. Next, to get some new tires order.
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Old 08-03-2020, 03:47 PM   #26
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You are leaning toward a very good tire with the S637 series... now “lean” a bit more and step the size up to 235/85x16 for increased load capacity...

You are pulling a heavy toy hauler and need all the load capacity headroom you can get short of upsizing to 17.5 size wheels and an H series Sailun....
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Old 08-03-2020, 03:50 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongoose9400 View Post
http://www.gosailun.com/MRT/Tire/S637T

It appears the Sailun S637T ST235/80R16 is a good contender and I think I am leaning towards them based on the advice of the forum.

Insurance claim is filed and appointment set to get it in for repair. Next, to get some new tires order.

I put 5 new Sailuns of the size you mention above on my 2020 MHC. I can give you a short term assessment; approx. 3k miles on them. They are LRG. Considerably heavier than the Ranier tires I pulled off before leaving the lot (LRF). Stiff and appear tough. I have a lot of confidence in them. I will add a couple of comments/observations;

I have no concerns whatsoever about the tires, very confidence instilling. They are STIFF. My trailer gvw os 14,5xx. I didn't have time to weigh it before we left but it should be in the realm of 13k or so if the dry weight is anywhere close. The LRG tires carry much more weight than what my trailer is, especially if you discount the pin weight (I don't). Even at full gvw the tires are overkill....but I like that. But, they are stiff; did I say that? My other trailer at 10k gvw and LRD tires and MorRyde suspension just "rolled, floated" over road bumps etc. I heard the big bump from the stiff truck suspension then the trailer just sort of "floated" along behind and made no discernible noise or feel. Not so with these. I aired them down to 100psi for the return trip and when I hit expansion joints etc. I feel and hear it with the hard truck tires and then I feel the same impact from the trailer tires unlike before. Not a bad thing. Causes no problems or issues; they're just stiff and probably still a little too much pressure....but I love the things. At this point I wouldn't change them for any other brand.
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Old 08-03-2020, 03:59 PM   #28
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As to where to get them? I ordered mine from Walmart in March for 125 each, free shipping, showed up in three days. How can you beat that? Date code on all was 4919, only a few months old.
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Old 08-05-2020, 05:13 PM   #29
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I ended up ordering 5 Carlisle tires since they had a better speed rating, load capacity, and weighed more (I assume more weigh = more material = stronger tire). Tires will carry 4,400 lbs at 110 psi, 81 mph speed rating and are the same size as my stock tires. I double checked my rims and they say max 120 psi. Tires should arrive tomorrow and Iíll get them mounted over the weekend.
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Old 08-05-2020, 05:24 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Mongoose9400 View Post
I ended up ordering 5 Carlisle tires since they had a better speed rating, load capacity, and weighed more (I assume more weigh = more material = stronger tire). Tires will carry 4,400 lbs at 110 psi, 81 mph speed rating and are the same size as my stock tires. I double checked my rims and they say max 120 psi. Tires should arrive tomorrow and Iíll get them mounted over the weekend.

Keep us apprised on how you like them. I like Carlisles as well.
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Old 08-06-2020, 07:29 AM   #31
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Here is another vote for Sailuns 14 ply as I installed them on my triple axle 15k T/H last year and have been very happy. Would highly recommend.
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Old 08-06-2020, 07:34 AM   #32
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Old, multi year China Bombs with milage. It is time to replace ALL tires with higher quality trailer tires. Best investment you can make....and could save you lots of money in costly repairs to the undercarriage.

I just bought brand new 2020 Keystone Travel Trailer. I plan to replace all tires at 1 yr mark after less than 15,000 miles.
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Old 08-06-2020, 08:06 AM   #33
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I always ran Carlisle on lighter TTs but would run nothing but Sailun on anything they fit on.
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Old 08-06-2020, 08:08 AM   #34
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After the tread and belts separate like that itís difficult to totally be sure of an underlying issue.
Under or over inflation can lead to unusual performance and failures.
Letís say I turn short and one tire hits a curb, or I drop a tire off the pavement on a sharp curve.
I stop and look at it, but only see a tire sidewall scrubbed. Next day I check tire pressure and visually inspect tires and undercarriage not seeing anything unusual to my untrained eyes.
Another 500 miles I didnít notice anything, maybe I overlooked it also.
Then a blow out on tires with less than 1200 miles on them. And no country of manf has nothing to do with tires getting unusual treatment.
After examining the remaining separated tread by tire shop they see inside tread had been wearing heavy and began tire failure scenario.
Changing tire was not enough, I would have eat up another tire.
Sometimes a seemingly gentle curb bump or rough hole can warp a rim, put unusual side load on the bearings and get them out of round, or bend axle just enough to gave one tire not track straight, wearing more, heating more as it drags slightly.
Running at or near max or over gross just accelerates the issue.
A professional can spot axle, rim or bearing issues. I could not. Bent axle ended up the ultimate culprit in my tire failure.
An axle or bearing out of alignment from factory could lead to tires blowing.
My words come from ďbeen there, done thatĒ experience.
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Old 08-06-2020, 08:12 AM   #35
Beemer Phil
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So many variables but the common would be tire pressure or age. Trying to figure the exact cause would be like trying to figure out which tooth of the saw blade hits the log first.
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Old 08-06-2020, 08:32 AM   #36
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I drive between 60 and 65 MPH and it has help reduce my tire problems. I have TST tire monitor and I watch the tire pressure increase 10 to 18 pounds more when driving on hot roads. If i drive faster the tire gets hotter.

Just saying.
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Old 08-06-2020, 09:04 AM   #37
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Well tires are subjective. My toy hauler is 43ft triple axial. I knew about the China bombs as they have been well documented and warned about. Not sure why everyone seems to have to learn the hard way. I was on a short trip probably around 100 miles when I had a blowout around the one year mark. The tire tread wrapped around the axial and ripped the brakes out for two wheels on that side. Tore out the undercarriage protection as well and locked up the rim. Pieces flew every where. Was traveling around 60 mph when it happened (south west of Houston Texas in june). We put two spares on because the tire next to it was also bulged out on the tread and about to go. Made it to the nearest discount tire and asked them for recommendations. They put 6 Goodyear endurance tires on the trailer almost two years ago. We just got back from a two week trip over 3k miles traveling up from Houston to the west entrance of Yellowstone in Idaho. We drove back in three days of straight driving 14-15 hours each day. Exhausted, but between two toy haulers with the same tires we didn't have a single issue the entire trip. Tires held the same pressure the whole way. Thats about as good as we could expect. Even though now we both carry an extra spare just in case. 6 tires on the trailer and two spares.
Hope this information helps someone.
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Old 08-06-2020, 09:21 AM   #38
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Go buy Goodyear Endurance tires. I had 5 foreign made tires blow. They look good but canít depend on them. I am a slow learner. Let your insurance take care of it. Comp claim. Should not be any major issue on your record. Ask the adjuster.
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Old 08-06-2020, 09:53 AM   #39
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Looks like a Keystone Fuzion. I had the exact same tire blowout on me. Same damage to the RV as well. Itís always difficult to tell what went wrong unless you see a puncture or cut. All you can do is look over the other tires for wear; checking, crowning or fatigue due to age, tread depth, etc. I replaced all five of my 16Ē tires with truck tires. Theyíre rated for high speed as trailer rated tire are only rated for 64/65mph. Good luck.
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Old 08-06-2020, 09:58 AM   #40
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From an actual tire design engineer.

Sorry to read about your problems, Some observations and comments on your info and the posts of others.

Travel speed at time of failure is not critical information as belt separations take hundreds if not thousands of miles to initiate, and then grow large enough to actually result in the tire coming apart.

The sidewall split, seen in one picture, could be the confirmation of prior damage from pot hole or hitting "road trash" I covered this in my blog post of Jan 10, 2020
It is possible that the complete failure could have been avoided if a "Free-Spin" inspection had been done starting at 2 years of age.

"Made in China" is no more of a reason for failure than "Made in Indiana" is the reason for any problem with most RVs.

Yes knowing the actual DOT serial would help in any investigation.

While always inflating to the sidewall pressure (pressure on the RV Certification label) is the preferred place to start as tests have shown that very few people can correctly identify the actual load on a tire or the tire's inflation by visual inspection.

RE Inflation Have you ever compared your pressure gauge to a known source to confirm it is reasonable accurate (+/- 5 psi)?

Yes replacing other tires, when one has failed and been run for some unknown number of miles. As the "mate" had to pick-up and support the load which in many cases means that tire was 100% overloaded.

A "Belt Detachment", improperly called a tread separation in this case, can many times be discovered during the annual "Free Spin" inspection.

Yes running a TPMS is always a good idea but I think this failure was the result of long term use, heat, high speed (higher than 65 mph) coupled with low reserve load and impact.

Yes Load imbalance - Not 50/50 split between axles PLUS not 50/50 load split axle end to axle end) probably means one or more tires were in overload even if inflated to the tire sidewall 100 psi.

For that size and Load Range many like Sailun brand. ST 235/85R16 might be OK But you MUST confirm tire to tire clearance and that the new tire has equal or greater load capacity.


Yes Radial vs Bias can make a difference. RE who made a "mistake" It is the vehicle manufacturer's responsibility to select and specify the appropriate tire and inflation. This is not the responsibility of the tire manufacturer.

I thought it was established the tires were LR-F so I do not understand the comments on LR-E. But I thnk the options might include LR-G. If switching to radial be sure the wheels are rated for radial tires. If you need to change wheels you might even consider actual truck tires ( 17.5 wheel diameter)

Once you know your actual scale weights on each tire position then you can look for replacement tires that offer at least a +15% "Reserve Load" capacity.

RE Speed Rating of ST type tires. The "Speed Symbol" is really just an indication of heat resistance and handling capability. The load formula used to generate the numbers published in ALL the Load inflation tables for ST type tires was and still is based on an assumed 65 mph MAX. Not average or occasionally but MAX. No one tells you this because they don't wan to lose the sale and many people insist on traveling faster than 63 mph simply because they can pull that fast. Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

"Definitely under-inflation can shorten tire life. Over-inflation of radials ( + 5 to 10%) doesn't result in structural failures based on the thousands of tires I inspected in my career.


Sorry but I am not allowed to post direct hot links to my blog on this forum.
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