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Old 08-13-2020, 09:48 PM   #21
firestation12
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Just a thought

If the previous owner had done a def delete, wouldnít the exhaust pipeís tip show signs of soot accumulation?
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Old 08-14-2020, 02:39 AM   #22
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Stickman, I couldn't agree more with what you said. Remember this: People with the 'deletes' are me, me, me type people. It is all about them. I'm quite sure none of this will change, and scofflaws (I can't remember ever using that word before) will be with us forever.
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Old 08-14-2020, 05:53 AM   #23
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Been awhile since I've posted, and I have no dog in this hunt due to not wanting nor needing a diesel. With that said I have to weigh in on the "delete" issue.
Regardless of what state you are in, if you delete the OEM emissions system from ANY vehicle regardless of year of manufacture, you are breaking FEDERAL law, period. No licensed dealer can LEGALLY sell a new or used vehicle with a modified emissions system that had those components put in place by the OEM,without being subjected to heavy fines and possible loss of license.
I shouldn't need to mention that ALL delete kits and tuners state somewhere in their documentation that these products are for "OFF ROAD USE ONLY".
I am by FAR no fan of big, intrusive government, but I also know this country by itself has spent decades cleaning the environment and improving air quality. I've been a heavy truck and trailer mechanic for more than forty years, and would prefer to NOT go back to the days of firing up a rig in closed building, and five minutes later not being able to see the roof twenty feet overhead. Now I can force regen a DD15 in a closed shop and the worst of it is it might get too warm in the building.
Even if you're not tweaking it with a tuner to the point of rolling coal, and have just done a "simple" delete of the DPF, etc. where do you think all that particulate matter and the associated nastiness that would normally be turned to relatively harmless ash by the regen is going? Does no one remember the era when the air above major metro areas like LA resembled something from a nightmare. Is that really what people would like to go back to in search of a few more mpg, more ponies(needless I might add, with current diesel power plants), or avoiding the OMG inconvenience of a regen.
As any big rig owner knows, the cost of maintaining and repairing a vehicle to the specs and standards it was built to can be expensive and aggravating, especially when they now have to pay to have their DPF and DOC removed and cooked out due to not keeping up with regen. They also realize that's the cost of admission to the game, and the same applies to private vehicles. If you choose to take your modern, quiet, powerful, technology driven diesel that has helped improve the environment for EVERYONE and turn it into an obnoxious, stinking, spewing dinosaur, that's up to you I guess. I don't care if your reasoning is a few measly mpg, wrongly perceived durability or it just makes you feel more "endowed", I have no time for you and the Feds are welcome to bang on your door.
Rant over.
Well said! I assume most people who camp do so because they have some love of nature. And while we all have a carbon footprint, I don't understand why someone would go out of their way to increase it.
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Old 08-14-2020, 06:06 AM   #24
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Well said! I assume most people who camp do so because they have some love of nature. And while we all have a carbon footprint, I don't understand why someone would go out of their way to increase it.
I get what your'e saying but.....

I somehow don't see how the guy in the 450 pulling a 40' toy hauler running 2 generators to keep his a/c running while he's "tearing up the trails" with the quads is overly concerned. with his "carbon footprint". Just saying.
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Old 08-14-2020, 08:37 AM   #25
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I would not buy a used diesel that someone else deleted, that's a fairly good indicator of how it was most likely driven by the fellow that deleted it.
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Old 08-14-2020, 08:43 AM   #26
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I would not buy a used diesel that someone else deleted, that's a fairly good indicator of how it was most likely driven by the fellow that deleted it.
So very true !!!!! With today's diesels producing over 400 HP and 800 FtLbs, there's very little "need" for additional power, so the reasons for deleting emissions very often leads to "vehicle mis-use" rather than the need for more operational capacity..... In either case, mis-use or the need for more power, where does that "leave the rest of the vehicle components ???? From transmission/transfer case to u-joints to rear end problems, that's "only the start of possible problems".....
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Old 08-16-2020, 05:29 PM   #27
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So very true !!!!! With today's diesels producing over 400 HP and 800 FtLbs, there's very little "need" for additional power, so the reasons for deleting emissions very often leads to "vehicle mis-use" rather than the need for more operational capacity..... In either case, mis-use or the need for more power, where does that "leave the rest of the vehicle components ???? From transmission/transfer case to u-joints to rear end problems, that's "only the start of possible problems".....
I don't think thats the case at all, I am not delete, but if I were to delete it would be to get rid of all the costly garbage. I have issue with a vehicle being able to find a fault in the def system and then telling me I have only 150 miles to get to a certified dealer to get my def pump replaced or repaired. Some of us go way out in the boonies and that is not only unsafe but downright looney. You can delete and run stock power settings, its very simple. I for one tend to keep my truck fully emissions intact, but I have zero issue if someone wants to delete because I can surely see reasons to do so other than wanting additional power.
But hey that's just Me, Me, me.
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Old 08-16-2020, 05:36 PM   #28
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Stickman, I couldn't agree more with what you said. Remember this: People with the 'deletes' are me, me, me type people. It is all about them. I'm quite sure none of this will change, and scofflaws (I can't remember ever using that word before) will be with us forever.
Oh Come on, we are all ME, Me , Me. If we weren't, we would be driving a Prius
with a Tent int he back on our way to hike into the wilderness instead of a big truck pulling a big RV and sucking fuel. It's all about the "me" wanting Big Luxury and big power to tow it with. Many folks Break Speed limits and other laws while Thinking of "Me" while on their way to the campground to suck up more natural resources.
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Old 08-16-2020, 05:38 PM   #29
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I don't think thats the case at all, I am not delete, but if I were to delete it would be to get rid of all the costly garbage. I have issue with a vehicle being able to find a fault in the def system and then telling me I have only 150 miles to get to a certified dealer to get my def pump replaced or repaired. Some of us go way out in the boonies and that is not only unsafe but downright looney. You can delete and run stock power settings, its very simple. I for one tend to keep my truck fully emissions intact, but I have zero issue if someone wants to delete because I can surely see reasons to do so other than wanting additional power.
But hey that's just Me, Me, me.
Not to be argumentative, but if you delete the DEF system then your trucks emissions system is no longer fully intact.
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Old 08-16-2020, 06:36 PM   #30
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Not to be argumentative, but if you delete the DEF system then your trucks emissions system is no longer fully intact.
I agree completely, my truck is fully intact and I intend to keep it that way, but what Im saying is with the dreaded countdown "150 miles until 5mph" I feel its dangerous and I can understand the reasoning behind wanting to get rid of things like that.
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Old 08-16-2020, 07:32 PM   #31
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Sorry to everyone with the diesels but.....here we are with yet another reason I avoid a diesel.... Not to generate more conversation, just underlining another reason someone like me doesn't need a diesel. Thanks to all for their comments.
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Old 08-16-2020, 07:47 PM   #32
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Sorry to everyone with the diesels but.....here we are with yet another reason I avoid a diesel.... Not to generate more conversation, just underlining another reason someone like me doesn't need a diesel. Thanks to all for their comments.
You can do the same thing to gas engines, its called an off road or racing tuner.
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Old 08-16-2020, 08:14 PM   #33
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I don't think thats the case at all, I am not delete, but if I were to delete it would be to get rid of all the costly garbage. I have issue with a vehicle being able to find a fault in the def system and then telling me I have only 150 miles to get to a certified dealer to get my def pump replaced or repaired. Some of us go way out in the boonies and that is not only unsafe but downright looney. You can delete and run stock power settings, its very simple. I for one tend to keep my truck fully emissions intact, but I have zero issue if someone wants to delete because I can surely see reasons to do so other than wanting additional power.
But hey that's just Me, Me, me.
The "point of my post" was that "I" (not you) would not consider a vehicle with the emissions deleted... Your point, that some people delete their emissions system "because they go way out in the boonies" is just one example of vehicle use that would eliminate that vehicle from my "list of ones to consider".... IMHO, (again, "me" not "you") would consider that any 1 ton truck that's operated "way out in the boonies" is going to have significantly different "use/abuse issues" than a truck that's driven by a "little old lady, only on Sunday and only to church"... If I were to buy a used truck (which I'm not inclined to do) it would be "one owned by that little old lady, not one that was "operated way out in the boonies" (whether it had an intact emissions system or not)..... YMMV
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Old 08-16-2020, 08:31 PM   #34
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The "point of my post" was that "I" (not you) would not consider a vehicle with the emissions deleted... Your point, that some people delete their emissions system "because they go way out in the boonies" is just one example of vehicle use that would eliminate that vehicle from my "list of ones to consider".... IMHO, (again, "me" not "you") would consider that any 1 ton truck that's operated "way out in the boonies" is going to have significantly different "use/abuse issues" than a truck that's driven by a "little old lady, only on Sunday and only to church"... If I were to buy a used truck (which I'm not inclined to do) it would be "one owned by that little old lady, not one that was "operated way out in the boonies" (whether it had an intact emissions system or not)..... YMMV


And like John, I have no earthly idea of what someone has done, modded or otherwise to a vehicle and I don't want to find out on a cross country trip with DW depending on me to "choose" vehicles. My last used vehicle was in 1974 (and there won't be another) other than the 86 Chevy customized van my MIL had when my FIL died; she couldn't drive it. I took it and gave her a new TBird....which she loved for 10 years....until the next one we got her. I can't imagine "me" buying any used diesel truck that has had who knows what done to it. I like to "know" and not "hope" if possible.
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Old 08-17-2020, 03:45 AM   #35
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Sorry to everyone with the diesels but.....here we are with yet another reason I avoid a diesel.... Not to generate more conversation, just underlining another reason someone like me doesn't need a diesel. Thanks to all for their comments.
I Owned a 2500 Gasser but was sadly disappointed in the gas HD truck towing my previous camper, sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do. I personally wouldnt own a diesel for anything less than 10K pounds, But I personally wouldnt own a Gas truck for anything 10K and above, it was just a horrible experience for me. The word being Need, and you hit it on the head with that comment, at some point weight necessitates a diesel, and if you dont have that weight behind you then your options are a lil more fluid! I also certainly wouldnt buy a used diesel unless it was from someone I knew or had it's service history with it. Shoot just putting in some Def that is a lil old can screw up everything.
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