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Old 07-09-2020, 07:06 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by Govols View Post
I saw that online. I kinda like the impacts. Not sure if i need the fuel cart is electric and have had the scooters for a year and only have 30 miles on each so thats shows how much we use Is that a 50amp generator?
You will need the fuel station if you have a generator most come standard with a Onan . I suppose you could order without the generator. I know toy haulers are designed for Boondocking.
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Old 07-10-2020, 04:44 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by notanlines View Post
One more thing of importance. This site will tell you all you need to know, and then some.
Great chart! Any chance you have on for a Ram 2500? Handy to have around and I've not seen it.
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Old 07-10-2020, 05:15 AM   #63
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Just be aware of the footnotes. #1 the weights on payload are "estimated" so when I see someone fretting over getting "down to" the payload numbers using an estimate is not prudent. I also don't agree with the 10% hitch, 15% pin weights. This not real world but obviously advertising.
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Old 07-10-2020, 05:19 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by CedarCreekWoody View Post
Great chart! Any chance you have on for a Ram 2500? Handy to have around and I've not seen it.
Here you go.
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Old 07-10-2020, 05:37 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by Govols View Post
We really haven't decided other than we need a TH. I want to keep it 40' or under, ramp that's also a deck, triple axle, and 6 point leveling system instead of the 4 i have. 11' cargo space would work but if i don't lose too much living area in the main cabin i could go 13'. Looked at some fuzions online..... We're gonna go check out a couple RV dealers here in the twin cities saturday to get a little better idea.

Edit.....would like it to stay around 12000 to 13000 gvwr but am a little flexible......
Most of the triple axle T.H. type trailers are in the 19,000 to 20,000 lb GVWR range. 12,000, up to almost 17,000 lbs is usually a tandem axle. So if you are definitely wanting to go with a triple axle, that likely will require a Dually truck in order to get the payload capacity you need. Some of those larger T.H.ers are putting 4000+ lbs on pin weight down. I have a friend that he and his wife full time in a triple that has a 20K GVWR and their pin will usually run in the 4500 to 4600 lb....but again, they are fully loaded, as they full time.
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Old 07-10-2020, 05:43 AM   #66
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If you're really looking for the largest trailers, keep in mind that a 1-ton dually truck can't pull *everything*. There are definitely some trailers that are too large for even one of these trucks. You would still need to do the numbers and make sure your truck can handle the given trailer.

We purchased the truck we have because we plan to upgrade to a larger trailer at some point. However, we realize our trailer choices are still limited by the towing capacity of our truck.
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Old 07-10-2020, 06:28 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by Govols View Post
I probably haul about 500lbs cargo....2 generators, cornhole boards, hoses, 10gals fuel for generator....etc. Only travel with 1/3 tank fresh water. Only adding the golf cart and maybe the scooters so i don't believe I'll come close to the max cargo weight. I'll take your advise and do the gross weight and 20%. I'll probably come back later tomorrow or sunday and have more questions after we look at a few 5ers. Again, thanks for all the info!
We have a 2018 Raptor 353TS - this is the smallest of the Raptor line at 39' and has a dry weight of about 14K and GVWR of 17K. From experience, I think you are under-estimating your new rig weights. Here's why:

Already mentioned: 5500 generator & either single 30 gal or dual 30 gal fuel tanks. You will need at least some fuel. Golf card (maybe 800#s?) plus 2 x scooters (maybe 250# each?).

Not mentioned: toy haulers always have much larger water and waste tanks. It is easy to think you just won't haul much water but that limits you to staying in campgrounds with hookups. Even if you don't have much fresh water at any one time, ultimately, you may have a lot more waste water. So your new toy hauler will undoubtedly have more liquid pounds that you might estimate.

Garage size: you mentioned you wanted a deck. If so, subtract at least 6" from your garage length to allow stowing of the deck rails (and doors?) on a patio system. If you need 10' of cargo space, you will need at least an 11' garage (to allow for some movement and for tie-down room). Also check the living space to garage door - if it is a slider, good. If it swings inward to the garage, recognize that you may not be able to open that door when the garage is full of toys.

Electrical: if you plan to boon dock, you will ultimately want multiple batteries, probably an inverter system, and potentially a solar system - all adding cost and weight.

The bigger toy haulers typically have multiple slide outs - all adding weight. This will be included in the trailer GVWR; is access to the contents during travel time important to you? Check the trailer for access to the fridge, bathroom, bed, etc. with the slides all IN.

Don't mean to paint a dark picture - I wish you all the very best in your quest! From experience, going from a standard 5th wheel to a toy hauler is a BIG change and I don't want you to get surprised. Keep asking questions and you will be fine.
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Old 07-10-2020, 06:42 AM   #68
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On your way home from your camping trip stop at a truck stop and weigh your rig, truck and trailer. After you unhook your trailer go back to the truck stop and weigh your truck just like it was loaded for camping. Then do the math. That may show you the difference between the real world and the sales brochure.
I think what you're wanting is in dually territory.
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Old 07-10-2020, 10:31 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by rhagfo View Post
Thanks! Where are finding that info? I will see if they it for 2019.
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Old 07-16-2020, 08:26 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by Govols View Post
I know I'm being a pain but just trying to understand. I should load the 5er just like i normally would and take it to the scales and figure out the pin weight from there? Does it matter where the weight is in the 5er? The only cargo hold is in front of the axles. Does that add to the pin weight or does it matter?
My take on loading a 5er is that weight behind the axles lessens the pin weight. It's simple geometry. The axles are a fulcrum, like a teeter totter. The further away from the fulcrum you put weight, the less weight on the other side of the fulcrum.
So, if you are buying a toy hauler, putting a motorcycle in the back will lessen the pin weight on the front. Additionally, WHERE you put the motorcycle in the back will determine the amount of weight in the front.
Be careful with the ratios of front to back weights. A traditional trailer is best loaded 60/40, with the 60% being in the front. You definitely don't want the weight in the back. I did that once and almost lost the trailer.
A fifth wheel is more forgiving, but you still need to take this into account. But my thinking is that if your pin weight is too much because you have too much stuff in the front, shifting it back behind the wheels will relieve some of that. But if you put too much stuff in your fiver, you will overload the entire frame, even if your pickup can tow that much weight!
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Old 07-16-2020, 08:35 AM   #71
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Woody, here's your site. Pick 2019 from the two choices...
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Old 07-16-2020, 08:44 AM   #72
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Keep in mind that the capacities listed in that chart are for the "base model truck" in each model line. ALL optional equipment added to the truck will decrease the payload and increase the curb weight of the vehicle... Add 1000 pounds of optional equipment/aftermarket equipment and you reduce the payload by that same 1000 pounds. Any "optional" equipment that's not "standard build" on the model will not be reflected in the chart's data.

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Old 07-16-2020, 10:39 AM   #73
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Inline with what LewisB posted earlier, our was the smallest Fuzion back in 2017. The brochure noted a dry weight of 12806, with 3005 pin weight. As shipped the sticker on the trailer showed 13310 already up 500lbs. On the way out of town for weekend trip with NOTHING in the garage, maybe 20 gallons of water and the typical stuff (chairs table food, etc), gross combined was 22820, I calculated the trailer at 13840, and a pin of 3340. I didnt weight the truck separately that time so my numbers can be off a bit but the stated weights are from the CAT sheet.

Gross 22820
Steer Axle 5120
Drive Axle 7200
Trailer Axle 10500

Calc Weights
Truck F/R 12320
Truck no trailer 8980
PIN 3340
Trailer total 13840

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Old 07-17-2020, 03:07 AM   #74
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Lots of great inputs here, just some other considerations for a T/H.

My previous camper was a 3602 Raptor that was 40' long and included 1.5 baths and a genset.

Empty with nothing in the camper other than filled propane bottles, it weighed 14.5k lbs. When loaded and ready to hit the road including 1/3 fresh water tank and full gas tank for the toys, the weight increased to 16k.

One of the biggest things to learn about T/H is the effect of the load within the camper included fresh/gray and black water and where each of these tanks are located in the camper. Water tanks located in front of the axles will increase pin weight pretty quickly whereas water tanks located behind the axles reduce pin weight much like toys in the garage.

My camper had a 3k pin weight when loaded for camping and my dually pulled it like a dream. As others have already suggested the only way to really know what weights you are playing with is to weigh both the camper and the truck loaded and ready for camping. Weighing the truck and the camper separately (and then together if so desired) is the only way that you are ever going to know the true weights that are in play with your rig.

I would not ever suggest pulling one of the large T/H with a 2500 series truck as there is just too much pin weight to safely tow IMHO. Although I see lots of them on the road.

Don't believe anything that any dealer tells you about weights and the capacities of your truck. Do your own research and draw your own conclusions. Asking these questions in this forum is a very wise step toward that end.

Good luck with your shopping..
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