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Old 08-13-2018, 03:42 PM   #21
madmaxmutt
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Have you scaled your rig loaded for camping? Looking at the specs of the trailer looks like you might have about 2000 lbs. on the pin....that won't leave much for folks and "stuff". I'm sure you're aware that being able to "pull" it isn't the same as towing it "safely". Not trying to argue, just curious. Generally, any 1/2 ton is hard pressed to have the load capacity for most any 5th wheel. Yours may be the exception?
I think by definition, Milo has a 1 ton. The steel bodied HD trucks are not your standard F150.
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Old 08-13-2018, 03:52 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by madmaxmutt View Post
I think by definition, Milo has a 1 ton. The steel bodied HD trucks are not your standard F150.
Seriously? I sincerely hope this is a joke!
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Old 08-13-2018, 03:55 PM   #23
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I think by definition, Milo has a 1 ton. The steel bodied HD trucks are not your standard F150.
How do we come to that assumption? If it's a 1 ton it sure has a small payload at 2172 lbs. so something seems amiss.
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Old 08-13-2018, 04:01 PM   #24
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How do we come to that assumption? If it's a 1 ton it sure has a small payload at 2172 lbs. so something seems amiss.
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=convert+2000+lbs+to+tons
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Old 08-13-2018, 04:04 PM   #25
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Seriously? I sincerely hope this is a joke!
Of course it is a joke, but so is using outdated terms to describe current vehicles. I think Javi's truck is deuce and a half . . .
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Old 08-13-2018, 04:08 PM   #26
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Of course it is a joke, but so is using outdated terms to describe current vehicles. I think Javi's truck is deuce and a half . . .
Well that's definitely true. My father was just expressing some similar ideas last week about outdated terms for current trucks.
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Old 08-13-2018, 05:40 PM   #27
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How do we come to that assumption? If it's a 1 ton it sure has a small payload at 2172 lbs. so something seems amiss.

Got it. Wasn't thinking about a funny. And yes, if someone tried to interpret current weight capabilities of trucks vs their designations....they don't make sense. But, they are what they are and we work with them, and talk about them, based on the current manufacturers designations.

On the other hand, we've so many posts saying a 3/4 ton Ford is really a 1 ton rebadged that I figured anything could be possible.
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Old 08-13-2018, 06:15 PM   #28
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Got it. Wasn't thinking about a funny. And yes, if someone tried to interpret current weight capabilities of trucks vs their designations....they don't make sense. But, they are what they are and we work with them, and talk about them, based on the current manufacturers designations.

On the other hand, we've so many posts saying a 3/4 ton Ford is really a 1 ton rebadged that I figured anything could be possible.
The way I see it, any post here related to towing is met with "what does your sticker say". On the other hand people don't care because "it is a 1/2 ton" or "it is V6", when confronted by a 2100 lb payload. It cannot be both ways.
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Old 08-13-2018, 06:34 PM   #29
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The way I see it, any post here related to towing is met with "what does your sticker say". On the other hand people don't care because "it is a 1/2 ton" or "it is V6", when confronted by a 2100 lb payload. It cannot be both ways.
Well that was the point; Sourdough was not dismissing the guy's 2176 lb payload on his half ton- he merely point out that the model 5er the poster had would likely have a loaded pin weight of nearly 2,000 lbs (easy to look the trailer specs up)- meaning the poster would only have 176 lbs for him and all cargo. So yeah, he was not questioning the guy's payload or dismissing the truck; he was stating it probably still wasn't enough payload to legally pull the 5er.
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Old 08-13-2018, 06:36 PM   #30
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Yeah, I got that. Just think it is all funny.
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Old 08-13-2018, 06:39 PM   #31
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Then add Keystone's marketing section to the confusion and it gets "unbelievably mucked up beyond all recognition" (MUBAR)....

Who ever heard of a half ton towable 34'3" 11000 pound fifth wheel ?? The Cougar Half Ton Model 30RLS is being marketed that way, and it's not the only model in the line that is dramatically close to those length/weight stats. Frightening to think that someone would actually believe the salesman in such a situation, but we see it every day on the forum.....
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Old 08-13-2018, 07:03 PM   #32
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Then add Keystone's marketing section to the confusion and it gets "unbelievably mucked up beyond all recognition" (MUBAR)....

Who ever heard of a half ton towable 34'3" 11000 pound fifth wheel ?? The Cougar Half Ton Model 30RLS is being marketed that way, and it's not the only model in the line that is dramatically close to those length/weight stats. Frightening to think that someone would actually believe the salesman in such a situation, but we see it every day on the forum.....
what exactly does the half ton on the cougars mean. Is it just a series name or does it actually mean something?
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Old 08-14-2018, 03:56 AM   #33
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Of course it is a joke, but so is using outdated terms to describe current vehicles. I think Javi's truck is deuce and a half . . .
As a note... Texas did away with the tonnage designation for registration in 2013... strictly pounds now... My truck is a >10,001 and <18,000
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Old 08-14-2018, 03:58 AM   #34
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what exactly does the half ton on the cougars mean. Is it just a series name or does it actually mean something?
Yep... Caveat emptor
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Old 08-14-2018, 06:12 AM   #35
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Sourdough sir.... you really think it has a 2000 lb pin weight when loaded for travel? Where did you come up with that 2000 lb figure? Spec sheet said it had a 1190 dry pin weight (yeah I know that doesn't mean diddly squat). Actually the scaled dry pin weight was 1145 (included battery & full propane) so I surmise theirs is a general guesstimate like the yellow sticker is on the truck.

....yes sir I've scaled it ready yo travel and no it doesn't have a loaded pin weight of 2000 lbs. FYI...scaled loaded pin weight is....1450.


Here are the #'s for our setup. So yes a properly equipped & loaded F-150 can "SAFELY" tow & stop a properly matched 5'er.

Truck loaded is;
FAW 3380 of 4050
RAW 3100 of 4800
Total 6480 of 8200


5er loaded is;

Pin 1450
AW 6900
5'er 8350
GVWR 9960

Sorry didn't mean to hijack this thread, but there is just so much false beliefs & misinformation about a so called 1/2 ton being able to tow a 5'er. I know the it can be done with a little bit of or maybe allot of homework, with matching the right 5'er with the right truck. JOMO Good Day!
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Old 08-14-2018, 08:25 AM   #36
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Sourdough sir.... you really think it has a 2000 lb pin weight when loaded for travel? Where did you come up with that 2000 lb figure? Spec sheet said it had a 1190 dry pin weight (yeah I know that doesn't mean diddly squat). Actually the scaled dry pin weight was 1145 (included battery & full propane) so I surmise theirs is a general guesstimate like the yellow sticker is on the truck.

....yes sir I've scaled it ready yo travel and no it doesn't have a loaded pin weight of 2000 lbs. FYI...scaled loaded pin weight is....1450.


Here are the #'s for our setup. So yes a properly equipped & loaded F-150 can "SAFELY" tow & stop a properly matched 5'er.

Truck loaded is;
FAW 3380 of 4050
RAW 3100 of 4800
Total 6480 of 8200


5er loaded is;

Pin 1450
AW 6900
5'er 8350
GVWR 9960

Sorry didn't mean to hijack this thread, but there is just so much false beliefs & misinformation about a so called 1/2 ton being able to tow a 5'er. I know the it can be done with a little bit of or maybe allot of homework, with matching the right 5'er with the right truck. JOMO Good Day!


You did not give scale weights or mention you had them. You said your little F150 pulled your little 5th wheel just fine without any qualifiers. That given, and assuming you knew nothing about your weights, the gvw of the trailer is 9990. "Assumption" then, to err on the safe side, is a quick 20% figure for the weight came out to approx. 2000 lbs.

By your numbers you have added approx. 1300 lbs. to the unloaded weight of the trailer vs a payload rating of 2943 lbs. And yes, it appears you have loaded it to a weight not much different than a bumper pull, which is unusual. And, if you can get by with only 1300 lbs. of gear in a fully loaded truck and 5th wheel then by all means do so. If that trailer was "fully" loaded, as most will, it will overtax your F150 if loaded at a 20% pin (assuming there are a couple of people and nothing else).

So, you may be loading minimally to make it work with your truck, which has a pretty high payload rating for a 1/2 ton, but that does not mean the next guy can take the same combo and make it work. Nor does it mean that every other 1/2 ton out there can do it. There are always exceptions but to say that a 1/2 ton is generally not cut out for a 5th wheel is accurate.
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Old 08-14-2018, 10:46 AM   #37
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what exactly does the half ton on the cougars mean. Is it just a series name or does it actually mean something?
Well they very obviously want to imply that the trailers are towable with a "half ton" truck, but after a quick (ie. by no means exhaustive) perusal of their website and marketing info, I have yet to find anywhere that they come right out and say it. The closest I could find was "Cougar Half-Ton travel trailers and fifth wheels are easy to tow"

I can see their lawyers in court: "...but your honor, it's just a name, it doesn't mean anything, I mean, there isn't actually a cougar in the trailer either, right?" <winks at jury with smug, self-satisfied, lawyer smile>
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