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Old 09-07-2018, 10:19 PM   #101
srvnt
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Originally Posted by CWtheMan View Post
Just some info. Triangle is building a complete line-up of ST tires in a NC plant. Here is a link. Lots of info in each tab.

http://triangletireus.com/truck-tires/tr653/
Didn't see where they manufacture that tire. The specs seem pretty weak too.
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Old 09-08-2018, 12:36 AM   #102
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Didn't see where they manufacture that tire. ...
Triangle Group is a Chinese tire company that manufactures a range of tires for vehicles from passenger cars to construction equipment and tires fit for special purposes. [Wikipedia]
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Old 09-08-2018, 04:17 AM   #103
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Check this "news flash" about Triangle Tire. Dec 17, 2017 (barely 10 months ago) they announced that they are building a "US plant". I can't tell you whether they have the plant "up and running and building ST tires at the facility yet or not"......

http://triangletireus.com/triangle-t...orth-carolina/

My guess would be that current, "in store" ST tires are probably not "built in the new NC facility"...... (but I can't say they aren't, so check the "plant code" on each tire for the actual location)
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Old 09-08-2018, 05:43 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by sourdough View Post
Your belief (I think it is you) that because you buy a tire with a higher speed rating LT tire (106 mph?) and then drive slower gives you MORE weight rating is just.....questionable at best. Please show the specs.
Heat kills tires! In the follow quote it is noted that a high speed rated tire can handle extra heat.

"The speed rating tells you the speed the tire can safely maintain over time. A higher speed rating usually means you will have better control and handling at higher speeds — and that the tire can take the extra heat. As a general rule, tires with higher speed ratings also handle better at slower speeds."

People posting heat numberd from maypops in the SW heat were always 20-30 higher than what my Ribs and R250s ran at.

Going back to the origin of ST tires, they got their higher speed ratings based on the 65 MPH speed restriction. Carlisle blew past the restriction to satisfy the bass boat crowd, and others have followed. There is magic in play here somewhere. You get a higher speed rating based on a speed restriction and then up the speed rating and do not lower the weight rating. ST tires have their own lesser testing standards!

The truth in the whole matter is people have been experiencing failures of ST tires for years. Hopefully there are now tire manufactures working to produce better trailer tires. I have long said that the All Season like tread on most ST tires was part of the issue, as they have to much grip on the payment in tight turns, thus rip themselves apart.

A few years ago at the Circus Circus RV in LV I took these two pictures of a semi trailer parked in the site next to me and of my R250s on our 5th wheel at the time. Tread is very similar with no breaks in the outer ribs. Nothing to bit into the payment in tight turns. Chris
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Old 09-08-2018, 06:07 AM   #105
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Ya'll are aware, that just because a tire; or anything else for that matter, is manufactured in the U.S.A. is not a guarantee that the quality is any better than one made anywhere else in the world.

I design and manufacture a variety of things and I can assure you that the quality of the product is not related to WHERE the plant is... but rather WHO controls the process..
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Old 09-08-2018, 06:28 AM   #106
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Ya'll are aware, that just because a tire; or anything else for that matter, is manufactured in the U.S.A. is not a guarantee that the quality is any better than one made anywhere else in the world.

I design and manufacturer a variety of things and I can assure you that the quality of the product is not related to WHERE the plant is... but rather WHO controls the process..
The china made Sailun tires are an example of that, they meet ISO testing standards. Problem is not everyone one is willing to pay for a higher quality product. Bean counters at trailer manufacturers are a prim example. I talked with the owner of NuWa about tires and why he did now use XPS Ribs on their smaller trailers vs the Uniroyal Laredo's they put on them. His answer was his bean counters! This conversion occurred after he picked up my post on Understanding Tire Types and reposted it on the NuWa forum. Chris
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Old 09-08-2018, 06:30 AM   #107
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Ya'll are aware, that just because a tire; or anything else for that matter, is manufactured in the U.S.A. is not a guarantee that the quality is any better than one made anywhere else in the world.

I design and manufacturer a variety of things and I can assure you that the quality of the product is not related to WHERE the plant is... but rather WHO controls the process..

Keystones are made in the US which proves the point
(sorry, couldn't resist)
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Old 09-08-2018, 06:42 AM   #108
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Keystones are made in the US which proves the point
(sorry, couldn't resist)
No need to apologize, that is actually a good example... but not limited to Keystone.. it is a product of many things but primarily a couple of generations which failed on a large scale to instill personal responsibility and pride in one's self...

It is a rare thing today to hire an individual who actually cares whether his/her work is correct.. They've been taught to just do enough to get by and to blame the next guy for their own faults. "yes I made those parts incorrectly, but it was Javi's fault they're bad, because he didn't check them before he assembled them".
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Old 09-08-2018, 06:48 AM   #109
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Keystones are made in the US which proves the point
(sorry, couldn't resist)
And I am setting here in a Bighorn made by one of Keystones sister companies and have no issue with the quality. We bought it in May of 2016 as an early 2017 model. It has been to Arizona and back twice, and we lived in it full time for more than a year. It is now going to be our NW Summer home and the Laredo is are commuter trailer to our park model in Arizona.

I am new to Keystone, however I can tell you that Thor lets Heartland run their own show more or less! The Heartland factory people are very willing to work with owners directly to resolve issues and/or put pressure on dealers, and will allow you to use mobile repair service if you pay the travel.

Chris
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Old 09-08-2018, 07:06 AM   #110
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Okay... back to tires...

Somewhere back in this or another thread I seem to remember that tires lose an average of 10% of their load capacity per year of use..

Assuming that this is correct and it is true for both LT tires and ST tires regardless of bias ply or radial ply construction.. if this is so...

Then one considers that the passenger LT tires are required to have a safety margin built into their rating... What would that margin be??? 10%, 20% ????

But the ST tire is not limited to a safety margin and can claim the maximum allowance from the get go... so "0" safety margin... ????

Am I following this correctly??
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Old 09-08-2018, 07:48 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by Javi View Post
Okay... back to tires...

Somewhere back in this or another thread I seem to remember that tires lose an average of 10% of their load capacity per year of use..

Assuming that this is correct and it is true for both LT tires and ST tires regardless of bias ply or radial ply construction.. if this is so...

Then one considers that the passenger LT tires are required to have a safety margin built into their rating... What would that margin be??? 10%, 20% ????

But the ST tire is not limited to a safety margin and can claim the maximum allowance from the get go... so "0" safety margin... ????

Am I following this correctly??
I believe that is for ST tires, not for LT or passenger tires. If that were true LT couldn't be rated for a life of ten years. That and the 12 year old LT's I took off my 5er last year were still doing very well.
If the 10% rule were in effect for the LT's and it is assumed it is 10% of the current capaciy, after 12 year the tires would only have 773# of capacity left from 3,042. If it is 10% of the original capacity then by the tenth year the capacity would be zero.
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Old 09-08-2018, 07:57 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by Javi View Post
Okay... back to tires...

Somewhere back in this or another thread I seem to remember that tires lose an average of 10% of their load capacity per year of use..

Assuming that this is correct and it is true for both LT tires and ST tires regardless of bias ply or radial ply construction.. if this is so...

Then one considers that the passenger LT tires are required to have a safety margin built into their rating... What would that margin be??? 10%, 20% ????

But the ST tire is not limited to a safety margin and can claim the maximum allowance from the get go... so "0" safety margin... ????

Am I following this correctly??
I have only heard that 10% loss in relation to ST trailer tires. Ran Michelin OEM tire on wives Buick Rainier for 10 years or so, lot of tread left and should have not been able to hold up the SUV with zero capacity left. The RIBs on out 29' Cardinal would have only had 35 percent capacity left on 3 and 25% of the forth when I removed them and sold them for 200 bucks on CL with around 60% percent tread left after around 44K miles on them.

10 years seems to be the long service recommendation for passenger and LT truck tires. Again ST have been in a category of their own for years.

Here is a write up on testing standards.

http://forums.goodsamclub.com/index....g/1/page/1.cfm

BTW CWtheMAN is FastEagle in this tread, which is one of the many userid's he uses across the interweb. "Chris" was my original userid on RV.net.
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Old 09-08-2018, 08:55 AM   #113
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Just a note... http://www.tiresafetygroup.com/tires...-in-six-years/
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Old 09-08-2018, 08:59 AM   #114
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Any of you guys bikers? Let's talk OIL... dino or synthetic? Or if you ain't a biker, perhaps we could talk religion or politics? TWELVE PAGES (so far) of "more taste/less filling" type "discussion". No ones mind was changed. It has been fairly civil but the horse may be dead...
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Old 09-08-2018, 09:16 AM   #115
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Any of you guys bikers? Let's talk OIL... dino or synthetic? Or if you ain't a biker, perhaps we could talk religion or politics? TWELVE PAGES (so far) of "more taste/less filling" type "discussion". No ones mind was changed. It has been fairly civil but the horse may be dead...
Was a biker, rode a hardtail... not since it hurt to lay one down at highway speeds..

I'm a mechanical engineer... I could talk oil..

Bottom line... don't read it, if it bores you...
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Old 09-08-2018, 09:24 AM   #116
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I have only heard that 10% loss in relation to ST trailer tires. Ran Michelin OEM tire on wives Buick Rainier for 10 years or so, lot of tread left and should have not been able to hold up the SUV with zero capacity left. The RIBs on out 29' Cardinal would have only had 35 percent capacity left on 3 and 25% of the forth when I removed them and sold them for 200 bucks on CL with around 60% percent tread left after around 44K miles on them.

10 years seems to be the long service recommendation for passenger and LT truck tires. Again ST have been in a category of their own for years.

Here is a write up on testing standards.

forums.goodsamclub.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/23225970/srt/pa/pging/1/page/1.cfm

BTW CWtheMAN is FastEagle in this tread, which is one of the many userid's he uses across the interweb. "Chris" was my original userid on RV.net.
So, you're assuming or maybe advocating that LT tires don't degrade at all or at some much reduced rate than do ST tires...

I'd like to see documentation on that and on the much touted "SAFETY MARGIN" built into the LT tire..

It is my consideration that any mandated safety margin would most likely be in fitment, rather than in the tire capacity rating..

Can you show documentation to the contrary?
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Old 09-08-2018, 09:26 AM   #117
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Ain't dead yet.....

This is in my Ford Owner's Manual:

Age
WARNING
Tires degrade over time depending on many factors such as weather, storage
conditions, and conditions of use (load, speed, inflation pressure) the tires experience throughout their lives. In general, tires should be replaced after six years regardless of tread wear. However, heat caused by hot climates or frequent high loading conditions can accelerate the aging process and may require tires to be replaced more frequently.

You should replace your spare tire when you replace the road tires or after six years due to aging even if it has not been used.


Where did the 10 years come from? Ford says 6 years (and even sooner in Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Florida, or other "hot" states)...
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Old 09-08-2018, 09:31 AM   #118
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Lately have seen heavy equipment with an open cel. plastic/foam/rubber type material with no air in them, maybe they'll have them on rvs in the future.
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Old 09-08-2018, 10:12 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by Javi View Post
So, you're assuming or maybe advocating that LT tires don't degrade at all or at some much reduced rate than do ST tires...

I'd like to see documentation on that and on the much touted "SAFETY MARGIN" built into the LT tire..

It is my consideration that any mandated safety margin would most likely be in fitment, rather than in the tire capacity rating..

Can you show documentation to the contrary?
Google is your friend.

How Long Do Tires Last?
The average life of a tire is determined by the conditions a tire is exposed to throughout its life - not measured in calendar years. Temperature changes, sun exposure, storage conditions, usage, and maintenance schedules all contribute to the rate at which a tire ages.

It is impossible to determine a tire’s exact life expectancy, because there is no way to account for the level of influence any one of these factors may have on a tire. However, you can defer to the vehicle and tire manufacturers replacement recommendations:

Vehicle manufacturers recommend tire replacement at 6 years

Tire manufacturers' warranties expire at 6 years

Tire manufacturers recommend replacement at 10 years, regardless of tread depth

https://www.discounttire.com/learn/tire-aging

https://www.michelinman.com/US/en/he...new-tires.html

BRMA members include manufacturers of tires, tire related products, and other rubber and polymer based products in the United Kingdom. The BRMA “strongly recommends” that previously unused tires not be used if they are more than 6 years old and that all tires be replaced 10 years from the date of their manufacture.

https://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/tire-...ry?id=23686666

Remember I said "10 years seems to be the LONG service recommendation for passenger and LT truck tires."
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Old 09-08-2018, 12:16 PM   #120
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Google is your friend.

How Long Do Tires Last?
The average life of a tire is determined by the conditions a tire is exposed to throughout its life - not measured in calendar years. Temperature changes, sun exposure, storage conditions, usage, and maintenance schedules all contribute to the rate at which a tire ages.

It is impossible to determine a tire’s exact life expectancy, because there is no way to account for the level of influence any one of these factors may have on a tire. However, you can defer to the vehicle and tire manufacturers replacement recommendations:

Vehicle manufacturers recommend tire replacement at 6 years

Tire manufacturers' warranties expire at 6 years

Tire manufacturers recommend replacement at 10 years, regardless of tread depth

https://www.discounttire.com/learn/tire-aging

https://www.michelinman.com/US/en/he...new-tires.html

BRMA members include manufacturers of tires, tire related products, and other rubber and polymer based products in the United Kingdom. The BRMA “strongly recommends” that previously unused tires not be used if they are more than 6 years old and that all tires be replaced 10 years from the date of their manufacture.

https://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/tire-...ry?id=23686666

Remember I said "10 years seems to be the LONG service recommendation for passenger and LT truck tires."
Actually, I've read much of that already as well as several papers on testing including but not limited to oven testing..

That still doesn't answer my main question of.....

So, you're assuming or maybe advocating that LT tires don't degrade at all or at some much reduced rate than do ST tires...

I'd like to see documentation on that and on the much touted "SAFETY MARGIN" built into the LT tire..

It is my consideration that any mandated safety margin would most likely be in fitment, rather than in the tire capacity rating..

Can you show documentation to the contrary?
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