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Old 11-12-2017, 08:07 PM   #1
Banshee365
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I'd love some help from some tire guru's for my Cougar 5er.

Without having to go much into the whole thing, I blew a tire on my 2016 Cougar 5er. They are a little over 3 years old. I just recently bought the unit. I was planning to replace the tires by years end and thought I had some time by keeping meticulous care of the pressures and staying around 60 mph. I also don't travel with a drop of liquid in the tanks and pack very light for short trips.

It doesn't matter. The right rear Trailer King exploded and absolutely destroyed the right side of the RV. The shop said it will take 3 months from now for completion of the repairs as the parts take forever to get.

Anyway...

The size is 235/85R16. I'm looking at Goodyear Endurance, Carlisle Radial Trail HD (E or F range) and Sailun S637's. The issue with the Sailuns is that apparently my aluminum wheels aren't rated for the 110psi. It's also my understanding that it's the valve stems that are the limiting factor and that I could replace them with metal ones and run the 100-110psi in the Sailuns on my factory wheels. The Goodyears and Carlisles are under 100psi. I think the LRE's are 80 psi and the LRF's are 95.

I was looking at the Carlisles because they seem to be highly regarded by some and they are cheap enough that I could buy the 4 times and a TPMS system for the same price as 4 Goodyears. The Sailuns cost about the same as the Goodyears. I am having to spend a ton of money on new tires for the truck and the insurance deductible so I'm considering cost as somewhat of a factor. I don't want to ever have another blowout again. Maybe the Sailun's are the way to go...

My unit is a 339BHS and it's GVWR is around 12-something.
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Old 11-12-2017, 08:41 PM   #2
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I had two blowouts with the Trailer Kings so I think they are c....p. I had the Carlisle Radial Trails on our fifth wheel and our current pull trailer and haven't had a blowout since I bought them. The fifth wheel was heavier than yours and the trailer is a lot lighter and the Carlisle worked on both of them. Can't comment on the other choices.
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Old 11-12-2017, 08:46 PM   #3
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.

This is going to be good, I have the popcorn ready.

All I know is what I have heard here, Trailer Kings just resemble trailer tires, black and round. I am looking at the GY Endurance for my little TT.

Just posted so I can follow this thread.

.
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Old 11-12-2017, 08:48 PM   #4
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I bought a new 2016 Cougar 303 rls. I emailed the manufacturer of the wheel and was told they were only rated to 80#. I pulled it to the tire dealer and had Carlisle LR F and metal valve stems installed too. My neighbor bought the Cougar and it is still going with 90 psi cold. My Montana has Sailun S637 235/85/16 that was my 1st choice for the Cougar. Later found Sailun has a chart that states the tires can be run at 80# and shows the amount of weight capacity at various psi from 80 to 110. Also, Sailun 235/80/16 is rated for 80#.

This man will answer all your Sailon questions, Alan Eagleson [[email protected]]
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Old 11-12-2017, 10:21 PM   #5
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With an12,215# ish GVWR why not go with a standard LT truck tire?
LT235/85-16E’s have a capacity of 3,042# ea. that is a total 12,168#. Now consider that even at full GVWR a 20% pin would be 2,443#, so well under 10,000# on the axles. This is what I run on my 5er with a 12,360# GVWR.
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Old 11-13-2017, 01:49 AM   #6
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Discount Tire shows the Endurance at $159 and Simple Tire online shows the Sailun for $141. I believe Wally World has a great price on the Carlisles. I don't know about the Maxxis. After the Trailer Kings blew the left side of our Raptor all to pieces we went with Sailun S-637 and never looked back. About 20K on them when we sold the Raptor. I don't think anyone on here will tell you that there is one definitive answer to your question, but usually it boils down to the Maxxis, Sailun, and Carlisle. And, yes, this is always an interesting discussion.
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Old 11-13-2017, 02:19 AM   #7
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Whichever way you decide to go in the end, do your due diligence first and confirm with somebody at the manufacturer what you are thinking about doing. Regardless of cost, this is no time to skimp on safety.

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Old 11-13-2017, 03:14 AM   #8
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I think if I were in your shoes, I'd get rims to match the air pressures listed or required for the tires and not just run them at a lower pressure even if they can be...for piece of mind if nothing else! Just my .02
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Old 11-13-2017, 04:53 AM   #9
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You say you're considering cost as a factor, from the way you posted the issue, it sounds like cost is a substantial factor. So, you can buy Goodyear Endurance (4) for $636 (plus tax, mounting/balancing) or you can buy Sailun's for 564 (plus tax, mounting/balancing and possibly new wheels) or you can buy Carlisle Radial Trail HD's at WalMart for $308 (plus tax, mounting/balancing).

Keep in mind that the Endurance and the Radial Trail HD have the same weight rating at 80PSI. That's 3520 pounds per tire, or 14080 for the four. Either of those tires, the Endurance for $636 or the Carlisle for $308 will give you the same weight capacity, sufficient for your trailer. With the Endurance, you would need to order them from Simple Tire to get that price and have them mounted by a local tire dealer. With the Carlisle, just go to WalMart, order them, take in your wheels and once installed, remount them on your trailer.

Your choice, but at the weights you're dealing with, I wouldn't consider Sailun to be necessary. Maybe an "over the top" add-on, but not a necessity.

So, if cost is something important, I'd consider WalMart and Carlisle. There's $328 difference between the Endurance and the Carlisle, that's more than double the price, and from reports here, no difference in performance or reliability.
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Old 11-13-2017, 05:17 AM   #10
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"The right rear Trailer King exploded and absolutely destroyed the right side of the RV. The shop said it will take 3 months from now for completion of the repairs as the parts take forever to get. "

This exactly what we were warned of on the forum and aided us in our decision to buy new Carlisle's LR E's replacing our TK, LR D's and add a TPMS.
The TPMS has already paid for itself in alerting us to a problem with the brake on one wheel overheating. The Carlisle's have performed perfectly over the past year and 8500 miles.
Whichever major tire brand you decide on will give peace of mind. In any case definitely add the TPMS. Best vacation insurance you'll ever buy!
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Old 11-13-2017, 06:31 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
You say you're considering cost as a factor, from the way you posted the issue, it sounds like cost is a substantial factor. So, you can buy Goodyear Endurance (4) for $636 (plus tax, mounting/balancing) or you can buy Sailun's for 564 (plus tax, mounting/balancing and possibly new wheels) or you can buy Carlisle Radial Trail HD's at WalMart for $308 (plus tax, mounting/balancing).

Keep in mind that the Endurance and the Radial Trail HD have the same weight rating at 80PSI. That's 3520 pounds per tire, or 14080 for the four. Either of those tires, the Endurance for $636 or the Carlisle for $308 will give you the same weight capacity, sufficient for your trailer. With the Endurance, you would need to order them from Simple Tire to get that price and have them mounted by a local tire dealer. With the Carlisle, just go to WalMart, order them, take in your wheels and once installed, remount them on your trailer.

Your choice, but at the weights you're dealing with, I wouldn't consider Sailun to be necessary. Maybe an "over the top" add-on, but not a necessity.

So, if cost is something important, I'd consider WalMart and Carlisle. There's $328 difference between the Endurance and the Carlisle, that's more than double the price, and from reports here, no difference in performance or reliability.
^^^Shazam, bingo and bada boom. Read no further. Wisdom has spoken. Thatís it. Period, end.
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Old 11-13-2017, 02:54 PM   #12
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Good comments fellas. At this point I think I've decided on Carlisle Radial Trail HD LRF's as well as an Eeztire TPMS system for good measure.

JRTJH, I can agree with the statement about Sailuns. It would be way overkill. I just don't want anymore blowouts. The Trailer Kings are 'rated' plenty high enough for a my trailer loaded much less empty. But they exploded with perfect tire pressure and low speed. Maybe I'm just paranoid now and would install solid rubber tires if they were available (joking.) The only reason I was thinking of the Sailuns is that there just doesn't seem to be much of a possibility of them coming apart.

Desert185, who did you spray chemtrails for? I spent 7 years flying RJ's for ASA and finally bailed out of that mess and went 91 corporate. Enjoying life once again!
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Old 11-13-2017, 03:18 PM   #13
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I can vouch for the Carlisle Radial HD. I've had mine since March of 2016 (after blowout and extensive damage from TKs) and they've not given me any trouble. Went up a load range (D to E). Added a TPMS as well. MUCH better.

When you get the Carlisle's take the old tires and squash them......then the Carlisle's; no comparison. Pick up one of each; Carlisle will be much heavier.

Add: mine were 2 years old as well; taken care of and kept in storage when not used. You can't fix (or save) junk.
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Old 11-13-2017, 03:57 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Banshee365 View Post
Good comments fellas. At this point I think I've decided on Carlisle Radial Trail HD LRF's as well as an Eeztire TPMS system for good measure.

JRTJH, I can agree with the statement about Sailuns. It would be way overkill. I just don't want anymore blowouts. The Trailer Kings are 'rated' plenty high enough for a my trailer loaded much less empty. But they exploded with perfect tire pressure and low speed. Maybe I'm just paranoid now and would install solid rubber tires if they were available (joking.) The only reason I was thinking of the Sailuns is that there just doesn't seem to be much of a possibility of them coming apart.

Desert185, who did you spray chemtrails for? I spent 7 years flying RJ's for ASA and finally bailed out of that mess and went 91 corporate. Enjoying life once again!
Unless something better demonstrates itself, Iím going with the LRF Carlisleís in the spring after four uneventful years on LRE Maxxis tires. The right kind of ďbangĒ for the buck.

I retired from a major, brown, package carrier before going to NASA, who didnít care about age like another government entity. Now, I just fly spam cans.
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Old 11-14-2017, 06:52 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banshee365 View Post
Without having to go much into the whole thing, I blew a tire on my 2016 Cougar 5er. They are a little over 3 years old. I just recently bought the unit. I was planning to replace the tires by years end and thought I had some time by keeping meticulous care of the pressures and staying around 60 mph. I also don't travel with a drop of liquid in the tanks and pack very light for short trips.

It doesn't matter. The right rear Trailer King exploded and absolutely destroyed the right side of the RV. The shop said it will take 3 months from now for completion of the repairs as the parts take forever to get.

Anyway...

The size is 235/85R16. I'm looking at Goodyear Endurance, Carlisle Radial Trail HD (E or F range) and Sailun S637's. The issue with the Sailuns is that apparently my aluminum wheels aren't rated for the 110psi. It's also my understanding that it's the valve stems that are the limiting factor and that I could replace them with metal ones and run the 100-110psi in the Sailuns on my factory wheels. The Goodyears and Carlisles are under 100psi. I think the LRE's are 80 psi and the LRF's are 95.

I was looking at the Carlisles because they seem to be highly regarded by some and they are cheap enough that I could buy the 4 times and a TPMS system for the same price as 4 Goodyears. The Sailuns cost about the same as the Goodyears. I am having to spend a ton of money on new tires for the truck and the insurance deductible so I'm considering cost as somewhat of a factor. I don't want to ever have another blowout again. Maybe the Sailun's are the way to go...

My unit is a 339BHS and it's GVWR is around 12-something.
You know, Iím probably going to take major rebukes for this post. So, Iím not defending your tire brand.

Tire history, when known, makes predictions about itís weaker/finer points much easier to point out. You admittedly state you drove around on tires with no knowledge of their prior maintenance. Therefore, labeling them as unfit for the task required of them is strictly an unsubstantiated situation. There are more reasons for them to fail than there is for them to be successful.

According to Keystone specs, your trailer has 5200# GAWR axles. Any tire with a 3520# load capacity at 80 PSI is way above what is needed to satisfy the minimum load capacity requirements. However, that Original Equipment tire has set the standard for your replacements.

The industry wide standard for replacement tires is to provide replacements that at the very minimum provide a load capacity equal to the OE tireís load capacity depicted on the tire placard.

Industry wide standards also require the wheel to be certified for the PSI value used to inflate the tire to the minimum acceptable PSI required for the load capacity it needs to support the minimum load capacity required (3520#). It is recommended that replacement valve stems be the bolt in type.

There probably isnít any paper work from Keystone about the OE tireís load capacity used on the 5200# axles. So any of the ST235/80R16E tires will be suitable replacements. Some, Endurance, Marathon & Maxxis just to name a few are rated at 3420#. The OE tire is rated at 3520# but when not certified by the vehicle manufacturer at that rating it defalts to 3420#.

I did not mention your trailerís GVWR because itís not a consideration in tire fitments. They are fitted to the certified GAWRs found on the tire placard, ownerís manual or on the vehicle certification label.

Although I write all my posts from memory, I do have a sizable reference folder full of all the information need to substantiate 90% of every thing said here. The unknown, lack of history of even history itself would still be a judgment call. Safety is paramount.

Note: The standard wheel used by Keystone for your OE tire fitments is rated at 3580# @ 80 PSI.
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Old 11-17-2017, 02:37 PM   #16
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I bought a new 2016 Cougar 303 rls. I emailed the manufacturer of the wheel and was told they were only rated to 80#. I pulled it to the tire dealer and had Carlisle LR F and metal valve stems installed too. My neighbor bought the Cougar and it is still going with 90 psi cold. My Montana has Sailun S637 235/85/16 that was my 1st choice for the Cougar. Later found Sailun has a chart that states the tires can be run at 80# and shows the amount of weight capacity at various psi from 80 to 110. Also, Sailun 235/80/16 is rated for 80#.

This man will answer all your Sailon questions, Alan Eagleson [[email protected]]
Thanks for the info, I emailed Alan and asked about running pressures lower than the max (110psi) for the Sailun ST tires. He said you absolutely can, and included a copy of the spreadsheet you mentioned (I attached an image of it, hopefully it's readable).
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Old 11-17-2017, 03:53 PM   #17
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The above chart reflects precisely the same discussion from yesterday on appropriate tire loading/pressure on trucks based on payload rather than on 'door sticker suggestions".....
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Old 11-17-2017, 04:03 PM   #18
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The above chart reflects precisely the same discussion from yesterday on appropriate tire loading/pressure on trucks based on payload rather than on 'door sticker suggestions".....
Agreed. The really striking thing about this chart for me though, is that there seems to be a commonly held belief on RV forums that, unlike regular car/truck tires, ST (trailer) tires are designed to be used only at maximum rated inflation, and running anything less than that is likely to induce failure due to heat caused by excessive sidewall flex. At least that's what I always thought was being said. This chart implies that that isn't the case.
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Old 11-17-2017, 04:41 PM   #19
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This is just my opinion, but with the "dummying down" that has occurred over the years, it's sort of become "local legend" that ST tires, with all their "explosive properties" are better run by the 'less experienced" at maximum pressure. That way, there's less chance of "guessing on the low side". When you consider that many RV owners have absolutely NO CLUE how much their trailer weighs, how much weight is on the tires and how to read a chart such as you posted, it's "safer" for the tire and RV manufacturers to just "dummy us down" a little more and perpetuate the legend...... So, all LRC tires are recommended to be run at 50PSI, all LRD tires at 65PSI and all LRE tires at 80 PSI... It's just "easier for the masses" that way, not to mention much less expensive for the legal department.....
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Old 11-17-2017, 04:56 PM   #20
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This is just my opinion, but with the "dummying down" that has occurred over the years, it's sort of become "local legend" that ST tires, with all their "explosive properties" are better run by the 'less experienced" at maximum pressure. That way, there's less chance of "guessing on the low side". When you consider that many RV owners have absolutely NO CLUE how much their trailer weighs, how much weight is on the tires and how to read a chart such as you posted, it's "safer" for the tire and RV manufacturers to just "dummy us down" a little more and perpetuate the legend...... So, all LRC tires are recommended to be run at 50PSI, all LRD tires at 65PSI and all LRE tires at 80 PSI... It's just "easier for the masses" that way, not to mention much less expensive for the legal department.....
Your explanation makes perfect sense to me!
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