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Old 08-25-2017, 01:40 PM   #41
bill-e
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Just the opposite around here. 1500 EcoDiesels are as I stated with a $1500 REBATE. 2500/3500 Cummins diesels, comparably equipped are about $10K more (sticker price) with a $12K rebate, so essentially you can buy a "big Cummins" for the same price (comparably equipped) as a 1500 Diesel.
John, even if that was true here, my point was that for us short haul, 12 times a year campers, even at the same initial price it wouldn't make sense to me when I could get a half ton that rides like a car, is basically loaded and get's great mileage.

I purposely bought the truck before upgrading campers so I wouldn't buy more than I could tow. Didn't really want one even as big as I got but I made the mistake of bringing my wife with me when camper shopping
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Old 08-25-2017, 01:45 PM   #42
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Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a monster 3500 Cummins as a second truck, I'm just too rational for that
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Old 08-25-2017, 02:05 PM   #43
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Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a monster 3500 Cummins as a second truck, I'm just too rational for that
I'm not going to address the "rational" aspect of your comment, after all, none of us need anything bigger than a bicycle or a Prius, but we all want what we do have and most of us can justify it "one way or another"...

As for the rest of it, that's why they make "biguns" and "liluns".... All of us have a "un" of one kind or the other.....
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Old 08-25-2017, 03:46 PM   #44
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Bill-e,
What about a 32ft 5" trailer @ 6660? ��
Hitch weight 716
CCC 1456
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Old 08-25-2017, 03:59 PM   #45
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The DW and I took the other route but we actually like small and compact. The 1750RD fits the specs of our Sierra 1500 quite nicely and frankly I would feel uncomfortable pulling much more than that with a half ton. Ours is about 21 feet and tops out at 4400 soaking wet. I could probably move up to a 25 foot Hideout or something like that at 7000 pounds (trailer GVWR) but it wouldn't be fun anymore, not with that truck anyway.
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Old 08-25-2017, 04:06 PM   #46
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Bill-e,
What about a 32ft 5" trailer @ 6660? ��
Hitch weight 716
CCC 1456

I'm not Bill-e but; if I understand the above you are looking at a trailer with a gvw of 81xx lbs. and 32' 5" long. Tongue weight on that will probably run in the 800 lb range which puts you back at 800 lbs left for payload (re-read bill-e's list of "stuff"). Start adding people, propane, hitch and whoops! you run out of payload. Personally I think 7000 lbs, gvw not dry, is about where you want to be. Being limited to the 1500 truck from your employer is really going to limit what you can buy/tow. And, having walked thru lots of trailers, I'm not sure what kind of floorplan you are going to find that sleeps 6 without bunks and is still manageable to stay in.
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Old 08-25-2017, 04:19 PM   #47
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Just an FYI, the online payload is usually incorrect. If I look online (via VIN), it states 300lbs more than the sticker on the door. Check your door sticker or weigh your truck.
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Old 08-25-2017, 05:23 PM   #48
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Bill-e,
What about a 32ft 5" trailer @ 6660? ��
Hitch weight 716
CCC 1456
I'd hate to be the guy who told you that was good or bad and it turns out to ne the opposite.

What did that online calculator say when you plugged in the specs? Run it with just you and your wife and then with the 4 kids.

Your truck had about 2 or 3oo lbs more payload than mine and 2300lbs more Trailer GVW so from a weight perspective, if you're honest with yourself as to what you're going to be packing in the camper and the truck (make a list), you may be OK though at your max.

Like I said from the start, I don't think I would want a total length trailer longer than 30', is that 32'5" just the box or overall length? It's pushing, pulling and swaying that worries me and the bigger the camper, the more of that you will get. What's the make and model of the camper?
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Old 08-25-2017, 05:25 PM   #49
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rides like a car, i
Sounds as if you think that is a good thing!
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Old 08-25-2017, 05:27 PM   #50
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Sounds as if you think that is a good thing!
Yep, I'm into comfort
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Old 08-25-2017, 05:29 PM   #51
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Just an FYI, the online payload is usually incorrect. If I look online (via VIN), it states 300lbs more than the sticker on the door. Check your door sticker or weigh your truck.
GREAT ADVICE !!! Far too many "noobies" look at the advertised weights, advertised payload, advertised empty weight and get "fascinated with colors and floorplans and forget to double check their vehicle against what's actually posted on the door pillar or on the yellow sticker (where ever it might be glued). They go with "generalities and best weight/base model" propaganda from the truck manufacturers and the trailer manufacturers and forget that they live in a "real world" with the truck that is in their driveway, not the one in the advertisements. Most vehicles, unless you buy a "stripped base model" won't come close to the payload advertised by Ford, GM or RAM. (include Toyota and Nissan if you want). To them, it's about selling trucks and boasting to beat the competition, so take what you see on paper with a grain of salt and take what you see on the truck as gospel.... They won't be the same.
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Old 08-25-2017, 05:32 PM   #52
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Good recommendation. Interestingly the RAM the online towing chart we looked at stated that everything accounted for 300lbs of human cargo.
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Old 08-25-2017, 06:00 PM   #53
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GREAT ADVICE !!! Far too many "noobies" look at the advertised weights, advertised payload, advertised empty weight and get "fascinated with colors and floorplans and forget to double check their vehicle against what's actually posted on the door pillar or on the yellow sticker (where ever it might be glued). They go with "generalities and best weight/base model" propaganda from the truck manufacturers and the trailer manufacturers and forget that they live in a "real world" with the truck that is in their driveway, not the one in the advertisements. Most vehicles, unless you buy a "stripped base model" won't come close to the payload advertised by Ford, GM or RAM. (include Toyota and Nissan if you want). To them, it's about selling trucks and boasting to beat the competition, so take what you see on paper with a grain of salt and take what you see on the truck as gospel.... They won't be the same.
To be fair, the manufacturers also bake a HUGE factor of safety into their posted capacities (unlike the RV manufacturers). Imagine the lawsuits if someone was just under their stated capacity and a major accident occured, solely due to the truck and not due to improper loading or other outside circumstance.

I am not saying we should make it a free for all and go way overweight or anything, but that is also a way of looking at in the "real world".
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Old 08-25-2017, 06:06 PM   #54
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Old 08-25-2017, 06:12 PM   #55
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To be fair, the manufacturers also bake a HUGE factor of safety into their posted capacities (unlike the RV manufacturers). Imagine the lawsuits if someone was just under their stated capacity and a major accident occured, solely due to the truck and not due to improper loading or other outside circumstance.

I am not saying we should make it a free for all and go way overweight or anything, but that is also a way of looking at in the "real world".
I'd ask one question (well a bunch of questions): Do you have any substantiated documentation to validate the statement I changed to red? We all know there's some "fudge factor" but to call it "HUGE" ???? What's "HUGE" 100 pounds? 500 pounds? 1,000 pounds? How do we know? When does that "HUGE" factor age out? When the tires are 5 years old? When the springs have flexed 250K times? When the brakes are 50% worn? when the frame has been loaded to "max capacity" plus a "HUGE" factor for 6 trips? or 12??

I'd suspect that none of us have access to any data to confirm anything "HUGE" so how do we address it with any reliability?

ADDED: And, a point to consider: Wouldn't the RV manuacturers also be subjected to that same "lawsuit" if they didn't also "bake in a HUGE" safety factor?
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Old 08-25-2017, 06:28 PM   #56
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Rockwood ultra lite
This one?
http://www.forestriverinc.com/produc...elID=1222#Main
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Old 08-25-2017, 06:29 PM   #57
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I'd ask one question (well a bunch of questions): Do you have any substantiated documentation to validate the statement I changed to red? We all know there's some "fudge factor" but to call it "HUGE" ???? What's "HUGE" 100 pounds? 500 pounds? 1,000 pounds? How do we know? When does that "HUGE" factor age out? When the tires are 5 years old? When the springs have flexed 250K times? When the brakes are 50% worn? when the frame has been loaded to "max capacity" plus a "HUGE" factor for 6 trips? or 12??

I'd suspect that none of us have access to any data to confirm anything "HUGE" so how do we address it with any reliability?

ADDED: And, a point to consider: Wouldn't the RV manuacturers also be subjected to that same "lawsuit" if they didn't also "bake in a HUGE" safety factor?
Those are good questions for sure, and I certainly don't have a specific answer for you.

In the case of the RV makers, we can see their specific factor of safety: The put (2) 3500 lb Dexter axles on a trailer with a GVWR of 7700 all the time, or tires rated to handle the trailer wight all the time that will be overloaded after 1 year (See the good old LR C Trailer King tires). I'd argue the truck capabilities are more understated, as components vary much more mildly between truck sizes. These are just my obeservations mind you. I definitely don't have a 100% answer for you.

Anecdotally, my new 33', 6300lb rig is MUCH more stable when I pass semis/Semis pass me than my old 29', 4900lb Passport ever was.
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Old 08-25-2017, 06:42 PM   #58
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Those are good questions for sure, and I certainly don't have a specific answer for you.

In the case of the RV makers, we can see their specific factor of safety: The put (2) 3500 lb Dexter axles on a trailer with a GVWR of 7700 all the time, or tires rated to handle the trailer wight all the time that will be overloaded after 1 year (See the good old LR C Trailer King tires). I'd argue the truck capabilities are more understated, as components vary much more mildly between truck sizes. These are just my obeservations mind you. I definitely don't have a 100% answer for you.

Anecdotally, my new 33', 6300lb rig is MUCH more stable when I pass semis/Semis pass me than my old 29', 4900lb Passport ever was.
So, are we to suspect that there's "something" but we don't know what it is, but surely it must be??? Like the Easter Bunny, or Santa or the Great Pumpkin? I'd suspect that if we can't define it, can't identify it, can't touch it, feel it, see it or verify it, then it "must be" but we don't know for sure?????

Maybe we ought to take the written word as the limit since we don't know anything about the unwritten...... At least from a safety perspective, that would seem to be the prudent thing to do, rather than "make a guess that there must be some extra" (but we don't know for sure how much, if any) but, by golly, it's there, fersure (we think)...

Just my perspective on "fudge" and "fudge factors" (same color, different smell, same result)
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Old 08-25-2017, 07:14 PM   #59
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Good points all. Thank you very much
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Old 08-25-2017, 08:45 PM   #60
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To be fair, the manufacturers also bake a HUGE factor of safety into their posted capacities (unlike the RV manufacturers). Imagine the lawsuits if someone was just under their stated capacity and a major accident occured, solely due to the truck and not due to improper loading or other outside circumstance.

I am not saying we should make it a free for all and go way overweight or anything, but that is also a way of looking at in the "real world".

Your comment is a statement of fact; based on what? If that is indeed the case maybe you could contact the big 3 and ask them to provide the "huge" safety factor built into their published numbers? Ain't gonna happen. Their numbers are their numbers and are meant to be followed. Vague comments like "huge built in safety factors" above the published manufacturers weight limits are misleading and, in fact, based on nothing but an individual's belief that they don't need to follow the published limits.

I understand that an individual WANTS to believe that there is a "huge safety factor" built in when they want to disregard established limits but it's not the safe or prudent thing to do.....or to encourage new folks to do when trying to do the right thing. There are many posts from members describing various suspension failures that occurred by just exceeding the limits by a little. JMO
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