RV News RVBusiness 2021 Top 10 RVs of the Year, plus 56 additional debuts and must-see units → ×
 

Go Back   Keystone RV Forums > Keystone Fleet | Keystone RV Models > Travel Trailers
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 09-15-2014, 12:29 PM   #1
bruce3211
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Fargo, ND
Posts: 9
I was a bit surprised by this

I am new here as I currently own a 2014 Cruiser 189FDS fun finder. We want something slightly bigger so I am really intrigued by the 19fbpr. Before I bought the 189 I ordered a report on it from the rvrviews.net folks and I own their comparison guide. I ordered the report for the 19fbpr and shockingly my fun finder scored higher. The one that shocked me is the higher score for the fun finder in quality. Not alot, but I thought it should be the other way around. I love my fun finder, but this premier seems several notches higher in quality than my fun finder. The premier vs my fun finder scored as follow:
Quality: At least 2 points less than fun finder
Reliability: = or maybe 1 point less than fun fiinder
Payload: 5 or 6 points less than fun finder: this one is math and I get it
Customer Satisfaction: 2 points less than fun finder
Style: 1-2 points less than fun finder: this one absolutely shocks me
Resale Value: 1-2 points better than fun finder

I have written back to this company and told them I was shocked by their scoring of these 2 trailers and gave them the reasons why. I have not heard back. I am concerned there may be things that I can't see on the premier that is causing this rating, but the eye test on the premier is top notch and seems more than a couple of notches better than my fun finder. Having said all of this, it still ranks as excellent with 471 points of 600. My fun finder rated 486. At a minimum, it seems like these numbers should be reversed if not even more of a trouncing by premier over fun finder. Takes 530 to get to superior,, so I don't want to make this sound like a disaster, just a bit shocking.

rvguide also ranks the premier 19fbbpr near last so I am completely baffled by all of this:

http://www.rvguide.com/specs/keyston...ht/19fbpr.html

I try to research as much as I can. I have read everything I can find on these blogs and forums but I am troubled by some of these ratings.

The only thing that matters is real world experience so I am open to comments. Thanks all.
__________________

bruce3211 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2014, 12:54 PM   #2
bsmith0404
Senior Member
 
bsmith0404's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Las Cruces
Posts: 3,041
I'm not familiar with the guide so I'm not sure how they come up with their scores. This is purely speculation.......if the reviews/scores come from feedback done by consumers you can run into expectation bias. For example, you buy a trailer called a fun finder, you feel it is an entry level unit and expect some minor problems. As a result, you do not become annoyed by them and you give high reviews based on your expectation bias. On the flip side you buy a "Premier", your view point is that it is a higher end unit compared to the fun finder, so you become annoyed by "problems" that you feel a trailer of this class should not have. As a result you give it lower reviews. Again, purely speculation, but expectation bias is a reality in the market.
__________________

__________________

Brent
2013 Alpine 3500RE
2019 Silverado 2500HD Duramax
U.S. Air Force Retired (25 yrs)
RV Sales Consultant
bsmith0404 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2014, 12:55 PM   #3
GaryWT
Senior Member
 
GaryWT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: MA
Posts: 3,153
I always thought the fun finder was entry level and the Premier is mid range. We love our Premier. Back in 2011 or 12 there was an issue with the axles but that was corrected with bigger axles. Not sure how the report you got works and where the info comes from but if it is based on expectations vs actual that could cause numbers to be off.
__________________
2013 Premier 31BHPR
2014 F350 6.2L
Soon to be just DW and I
GaryWT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2014, 01:36 PM   #4
Festus2
Site Team
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fraser Valley BC Canada
Posts: 7,015
Bruce -
Of the 6 or so criteria used in their rating system, 5 of them are mostly subjective. The single objective criteria would be payload - other than that they really don't give the potential buyer a lot to go on.
Personally, I wouldn't put much credence to their rating scale or the results of it and would use it as a rough guide at best. I wouldn't be "troubled" by their subjective rating results.
__________________
2008 Cougar 5th Wheel 27RKS
2005 2500 GMC Duramax
Festus2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2014, 01:43 PM   #5
Ken / Claudia
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Fruitland
Posts: 2,976
Bruce, have you gone to a dealer and been inside a 19fbpr?. I would if I was you. Than make up your own mind. You should be able to see after afew hours if it is what you want and how it's made etc. After that maybe you like the 19fbr, maybe you do not. You will be compareing the 2 trailers and who cares what someone else says about them. The problem with the ratings is how do they do it (by using them or reading about them). Do they know how each is built(all materials and methods). Do they just use comsumer information?
__________________
2013 24RKSWE (27ft TT) Cougar 1/2 ton series
2013 Ford F350 4x4 CC 6.7 engine, 8 ft bed 3.55 rear end lariat package
Retired from Oregon State Police in 2011 than worked another 9.5 years as a small town traffic cop:
As of 05-2020, I am all done with 39 years total police work. No more uniforms for me.
Ken / Claudia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2014, 02:24 PM   #6
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 20,236
Some of the RV Reviews are online and available to search. There are really no "objective" survey results (other than the numbers with payload). Everything else is a "customer expectation subjective comment".

Different people look for different things. If, for example someone were looking for a "nice, big kitchen" and found it in a specific model trailer, their expectations would be met and they would be happy. They probably wouldn't comment on the lack of quality in "fit and finish", they are still happy with the size of the kitchen...

Years ago, Consumer Reports did a review of travel trailers. At the time, Avion and Airstream were the only two "luxury trailers". Holiday Rambler and Cobra were two "medium priced" trailers that were included in the review. Believe it or not, both Airstream and Avion were rated very low in quality by owners. The reason given by Consumer Reports was the "expectation that owners have" based on price and reputation. So, to find that a low priced trailer may be "rated good" and a medium priced trailer may be "rated OK" or "poor" is more a reflection of the economic status and expectations of the buyers more than a reflection of the actual quality.

Imagine a "foo-foo" aristocrat and a minimum wage single mom, both going into a WalMart clothing department to buy school clothes for their first grade child. Then, do a "survey" of those two ladies as they leave the store.... You'll get a significant difference in "quality ratings" from those two ladies who just evaluated the identical clothing items.....

It's as much a matter of "who you ask" as it is "what they evaluate."
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2014, 04:14 PM   #7
bruce3211
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Fargo, ND
Posts: 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken / Claudia View Post
Bruce, have you gone to a dealer and been inside a 19fbpr?. I would if I was you. Than make up your own mind. You should be able to see after afew hours if it is what you want and how it's made etc. After that maybe you like the 19fbr, maybe you do not. You will be compareing the 2 trailers and who cares what someone else says about them. The problem with the ratings is how do they do it (by using them or reading about them). Do they know how each is built(all materials and methods). Do they just use comsumer information?
Thank you for your response. Yes, I spent about an hour in one last Thursday and liked it. I have come to the conclusion that there is no perfect trailer. There were a few things I was concerned about, but it meets the criteria of what we are looking for. I find it odd they don't vent the fan above the oven to the outside for this quality of trailer. My fun finder does that. This is a minor issue and not a deal breaker. Its funny how you don't know what you want until you have experienced things you know you would like better, like a walk around bed, but then that comes with a hook, 6 inches shorter than our current full queen. Oh well. We don't want to go bigger than this trailer as we like to drag this thing around the country. As far as what goes into the ranking, they are actually quite comprehensive. Here is a link to the description of these reports. This is the company whose links are all over this forum:

http://www.rvreviews.net/individual-rv-reports/

Thank you everyone for all your input.
Bruce
bruce3211 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2014, 11:18 AM   #8
koko
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Southwest Wyoming
Posts: 497
Been out of town and just caught your post. We have the 19fbpr and love it. We have had our camper for almost a year now and have slept in it at least 75 times. We've traveled thousands of miles with it from Michigan to Montana to New Mexico and all parts in between. We've taken two two-week trips in it since March; and every time we come home from a long one, we can't believe how comfortable it is. The floor plan is absolutely awesome, we love the bathroom, the kitchen area is adequate enough that I have cooked great meals for 6 with ease. Yes, the bed is a short queen, but we've even been thinking about having a custom mattress made so that we can extend the length just a bit - width-wise, it's just fine. We've owned 7 trailers over the last 45 years, and this is one of our favorites yet. We've had no issues with it - no leaks, no mechanical problems. In our minds, this trailer is perfect for us, and the quality seems comparable to others we've had. On our last trip, we went into a camper of another brand that was 22 ft. and it seemed smaller. One more comment - we love the high ceilings!
__________________

2017 Jayco Melbourne 24k-Jeep Wrangler
2013 Bullet Premier 19FBPR-Dodge Durango V8 Hemi
2013 Rpod 177HRE-Jeep Liberty
2011 Aliner Sport-Jeep Cherokee
2008 Little Guy 5^Wide-Toyota Avalon
1980 Shasta 21-GMC Suburban
1981 Coleman Tent Camper-1981 Dodge Ramcharger
1978 VW Westfalia
Lots of tents
koko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2014, 11:38 AM   #9
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 20,236
Koko,

If you want to extend your mattress "just a bit" you can buy a "CHEAP" mattress pad, roll it up and place it at the head of the mattress. Just pull the mattress down from the head of the bed, stuff the rolled up mattress pad (or even a couple of firm roll pillows) and put a fitted sheet on to cover the whole thing. We've been doing that when we get set up in a park, and just put the roll pillows under the bed when we travel. The only reason I don't leave them in place when travelling is because they do put the mattress very close to the sliding door to the bathroom and I don't want to have the mattress sliding into that door and possibly doing any damage to the hardware.

Just a consideration, but you'd be surprised how you never feel what's under your pillow at the head of the bed. It's a lot cheaper than a custom mattress !!!!!
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2014, 12:06 PM   #10
bruce3211
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Fargo, ND
Posts: 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
Koko,

If you want to extend your mattress "just a bit" you can buy a "CHEAP" mattress pad, roll it up and place it at the head of the mattress. Just pull the mattress down from the head of the bed, stuff the rolled up mattress pad (or even a couple of firm roll pillows) and put a fitted sheet on to cover the whole thing. We've been doing that when we get set up in a park, and just put the roll pillows under the bed when we travel. The only reason I don't leave them in place when travelling is because they do put the mattress very close to the sliding door to the bathroom and I don't want to have the mattress sliding into that door and possibly doing any damage to the hardware.

Just a consideration, but you'd be surprised how you never feel what's under your pillow at the head of the bed. It's a lot cheaper than a custom mattress !!!!!
This seems like an ingenious idea. Or maybe one could even get a cut piece of some sort of foam the same thickness as the mattress and 3 to 6 inches wide depending on how long you want to extend the mattress and stick that in the front when setting up and take it out when traveling.
bruce3211 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2014, 07:56 PM   #11
theeyres
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Green Valley, AZ
Posts: 782
I don't know anything about the group you are referring to but I do know that http://www.rv.org/ gives the best info in the industry. You can buy individual reports or get the whole package. It's worth every penny. These are not subjective reports or driving reports but reports based on a fixed set of criteria. You might want to see how they rate the trailer in question.
__________________
Earl

2007 33.5' Arctic Fox Fifth Wheel used for full-timing for several years--now sold
2011 Hideout 23RKSWE that we now use for poking around local parks
2007 Chevy 3/4 ton diesel with Prodigy Brake Control
theeyres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2016, 06:45 PM   #12
temccarthy1
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Flemington,NJ
Posts: 27
Re: I was a bit surprised by this

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
Koko,

If you want to extend your mattress "just a bit" you can buy a "CHEAP" mattress pad, roll it up and place it at the head of the mattress. Just pull the mattress down from the head of the bed, stuff the rolled up mattress pad (or even a couple of firm roll pillows) and put a fitted sheet on to cover the whole thing. We've been doing that when we get set up in a park, and just put the roll pillows under the bed when we travel. The only reason I don't leave them in place when travelling is because they do put the mattress very close to the sliding door to the bathroom and I don't want to have the mattress sliding into that door and possibly doing any damage to the hardware.

Just a consideration, but you'd be surprised how you never feel what's under your pillow at the head of the bed. It's a lot cheaper than a custom mattress !!!!!
Wow! Great idea! I am 6 ft tall and could use another 6" bed length but don't want to invest in a whole new mattress! Gonna take your suggestion when we head out for our last trip of the season in 2 weeks! THANKS!
__________________

Tim, Ramona and dog Scruffy
1982 Coleman Sun Valley PUP (retired)
2014 Keystone Bullet Ultralite 285RLS TT
2013 Ford Expedition XLT 5.4L V8 Triton
Equalizer E2 WD Hitch
temccarthy1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2016, 03:47 PM   #13
SummitPond
Senior Member
 
SummitPond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Northeast Florida/Southeast Maine
Posts: 750
Re: I was a bit surprised by this

Bruce3211

We have had our 19fbpr for almost 2 years. We've traveled up and down the eastern seaboard twice and gone as far west as Denver in that time frame (we're in NE FL). Numerous short, weekend trips, too.

My wife was sold on the trailer due to its apparent spacious interior given the relatively short length. An almost walk-around bed makes it easier to change the sheets, and the lighting above the bed (for reading) makes sense compared to others when the bed is only accessible from one side. The kitchen area and bathroom were also high on her list. (Per your question about the vent, I'd have to go check but I believe it exhausts to the outside.) Also, given the size of the trailer there is lots of storage for clothes and other things compared to others of similar size. You can also get to the fridge and bathroom with the slide full in (although it is a squeeze to get past the dinette table if it is up; we typically travel with it down in the "bed" position).

It is a very livable trailer; of course there are things one always wants different. She would have liked a walk-in shower rather than having to fight the high step into the tub. The microwave is also mounted a tad high for her. The dinette seat is not as comfortable as a regular chair, and I have a difficult time "getting around" the table leg when I sit down. (If we are not eating I typically take the table down and stow it next to the bed on the hamper side.) I was also surprised that the shelves in the bathroom closet were mounted from the bottom of the supports rather than sitting on top of them. I had to remedy this arrangement after the staples pulled free.

We have been able to "squeak" into several trailer parks due to our limited length whereas a larger trailer wouldn't fit in the allocated space. This has proved handy during holiday weekends when the parks are otherwise "full". There's typically always a spot available for a small trailer that a longer one can't get into.

We have looked at some of the larger Premier models and they are luxurious compared to our little trailer. But when we compare our model to other brands of similar size there is no comparison; we are extremely happy with what we chose.

Good luck, whatever you do.
__________________

__________________

Now: 2019 Winnebago 2500FL w/e2 WDH;Sold: 2015 Bullet Premier 19FBPR (shown)
2012 Ford F-250 Lariat Super Duty Crew Cab (gas 6.2 L, 3.73 gear ratio 2WD, 172" WB)
SummitPond is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates in any way. Keystone RV is a registered trademark of the Keystone RV Company.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 03:17 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×