Lithium-ion batteries unsafe?

[wiredgeorge]

https://www.firehouse.com/operations...5G5B&rdx.ident[pull]=omeda|7666A3141845G5B

[peanut]

There are 6 or 7 varieties of lithium batteries.

Most often used variants used in ebikes and hoverboards and other similar devices (what the article linked to was about) are:
1. Nickel Manganese Cobalt (NMC)
2. Lithium Cobalt Oxide (LCO)
3. Lithium Iron Phosphate (LFP)
Another article (linked to in the article linked to above) states that OEM batteries (of these types) seem to be effectively QC'd but that, ". . . unskilled tampering and refurbishment seem to be a source of safety problems . . . " in defective batteries. Those tampered with and refurbished batteries show up most often on the gray market.
https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york...oxm-story.html

12vdc LiFePO4 batteries - the type typically used in RV's - do not have similar problems. They are not fire hazards. They are the safest variant of lithium. They won't catch fire or explode even when punctured.

So - - nothing to worry about in the RV community - - - - - - unless you are carrying an e-bike around.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by peanut

There are 6 or 7 varieties of lithium batteries.

Most often used variants used in ebikes and hoverboards and other similar devices (what the article linked to was about) are:
1. Nickel Manganese Cobalt (NMC)
2. Lithium Cobalt Oxide (LCO)
3. Lithium Iron Phosphate (LFP)
Another article (linked to in the article linked to above) states that OEM batteries (of these types) seem to be effectively QC'd but that, ". . . unskilled tampering and refurbishment seem to be a source of safety problems . . . " in defective batteries. Those tampered with and refurbished batteries show up most often on the gray market.
https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york...oxm-story.html

12vdc LiFePO4 batteries - the type typically used in RV's - do not have similar problems. They are not fire hazards. They are the safest variant of lithium. They won't catch fire or explode even when punctured.

So - - nothing to worry about in the RV community - - - - - - unless you are carrying an e-bike around.

Or have an Apple laptop with "swollen batteries you haven't seen yet" or a sound bar under your TV that needs recharging after an evening of movies or a battery operated drill that you use to tighten the leveling jacks or ......

There's probably as many "different battery types" in an RV as there are in any New York City apartment.... The ones on the tongue or in the battery compartment are just the beginning of "lithium battery use in a travel trailer".....

[NH_Bulldog]

I see a lot of lithium battery fires in my line of work, and racking my brain I don’t recall ever investigating a fire involving the larger RV type batteries.

What I do see are cordless tool batteries that were dropped, or the infamous hoverboard or E-Bike batteries that just seem (at least at first glance) to catch fire for no reason, or laptop batteries, etc. etc. (oh the horror stories I could share). These consumer grade batteries are so basic and don’t have a robust BMS (battery management system) that can “shut down” a power cell in the event of thermal runaway. Instead they overheat, expand, burst into flames and then start cooking off the adjacent cells in the pack until it’s like a roman candle going off with flaming balls of fire shooting in every direction, setting everything in the area on fire. But of course, don’t douse with water, that only makes it worse!

The quality RV batteries we are seeing now are very safe, they are sealed so they can be in a closed compartment, and they have a very robust BMS that can stop a potential issue before it gets to the point where anything is going to melt down. That being said, one should stick with a quality name brand with a long warranty for best peace of mind. I am intentionally not specifying brand names, but if you are buying a 100ah heated RV LiFePO4 battery for $500, you might be asking for trouble. The brand we hear about a lot that is now shipping with Keystone models costs more than a pretty penny for a reason…..YMMV

[Bill-2020]

Originally Posted by NH_Bulldog

I am intentionally not specifying brand names, but if you are buying a 100ah heated RV LiFePO4 battery for $500, you might be asking for trouble. The brand we hear about a lot that is now shipping with Keystone models costs more than a pretty penny for a reason…..YMMV

I didn't decide on the Cougar we have because of the 400i solar, lithium batteries (2 ea 100ah), inverter, etc. I decided on it for the floor plan and the size, period. I knew the price was more due to the extras and labor and material costs, but I didn't know what lithium batteries were going for at the time. After I did some research and looked deeper into the various newer systems (solar, on-demand WH, in-command, 12v fridge) I pulled the trigger and bought it. Will we ever boondock with it? Probably not. But! We have used the inverter several times now at rest stops and I don't have to worry about plugging in the camper on the property, the solar takes care of it all. A pretty penny is right, those batteries ain't for the faint of heart.