Delamination

[swenson713]

We purchased our Keystone Springdale in Jan of 2022.
Wanting to know if anyone has experienced this Multiple cabinet doors are peeling (delaminating )throughout the travel trailer The local dealer has asked Keystone to cover the repairs, they have said NO, it is out of warranty
This is truly a manufactory defect, we also have a toilet which over runs plus a few other issues, none of these is Keystone willing to take responsibility for, yet they believe we should pay $4700.00 to have their issues repaired

[Mikendebbie]

Photos would help.
A common occurrence in Montanas (mine especially) is the wood grain “veneer” paper/vinyl/whatever it is - is peeling off the interior doors. My bedroom door was first, then half-bath door and some on the main bath door. It peels off from the corners/edges of the door in small pieces. Folks have suggested many ways to deal with it. I chose to try dabbing contact cement and re-sticking the peel parts. It has been like hitting Prarie dogs. Fix it here - it pops up in other areas. It is a lost cause. The best idea I have heard is to sand the paper off and paint the doors. I have not heard stories of large pieces of paper coming off…just bits along the edges.

When you use the term “delaminating” I think in terms of layers of plywood coming apart rendering a cabinet door unusable. That would be a big deal in my book that I would be looking to the manufacturer to help with because that sounds like manufacturing mistake. Paper veneer peeling is a nuisance and an unfortunate pain in the rear. I would expect that to be corrected in the warranty period. I would guess the only fix would be all new cabinet doors. After the warranty period - it is your problem…just like it is unfortunately my problem also.

Cheap materials. That’s all it is. If Keystone had selected doors for my unit with real wood veneer or painted veneer - it may have cost $150-$200 per door more…or maybe $600 to the price. That is nothing! It will cost me time and effort to sand and paint them now. Ordering real wood veneer doors from a door company will be expensive because this size door does not exist in the commercial or residential world. They will be special and expensive.

Real wood veneer cabinet doors would have made your RV more expensive also.

[Customer1]

The photo finish coming off the cabinetry is more likely a moisture issue rather than construction. A small amount isn't unusual, a large amount is. Toilet probably just needs an $18 flush valve, easy fix. The warranty is the warranty, why do you expect preferential treatment beyond the warranty period?

[Customer1]

The dealer knows Keystone isn't going to cover those things but they are making Keystone the bad guy so you don't get mad at them.

[JRTJH]

No idea which model Springdale you have, but realize that trailers, like vehicles, come in varying price ranges and the more you pay, the more expensive materials you get in the build. Springdale and Hideout are the two "least expensive trailers" in the Keystone line and they use the least expensive materials to build them.

If you compared an Ethan Allen end table from a high end furniture store to a WalMart "build it yourself" end table, you'd expect the Ethan Allen table to be nicer and more durable with a much better finish.

It's the same with trailer cabinetry and as Mikendebbie stated, even in their "high end, top of the line" Montana, they have similar problems with the vinyl wrapped MDF cabinetry.

As for the toilet, if you have a Dometic 300 or 310 toilet, the Dometic warranty is a "limited two year warranty". So, depending on how long you've owned your trailer, you may want to contact Dometic to discuss your warranty issues. It's all in your Keystone Owner's Manual in the warranty section. The manual fully explains that Keystone will act as your agent DURING THE 1 YEAR KEYSTONE WARRANTY and that it is your responsibility to contact the individual component manufacturer for any warranty issues that occur beyond the "Keystone warranty period"... So, your dealer, if they didn't explain that to you, is not doing you any favors and they're the "bad guy" holding out for you to pay rather than process your Dometic toilet warranty....

If you haven't fully read and reread the Keystone Owner's Manual "warranty section" it would benefit you greatly to take an hour or so, sit down with the manual and fully understand what YOUR responsibility in the warranty repairs entails.

It's no surprise that your dealer told you Keystone won't repair your issues under warranty. It's no longer Keystone's responsibility. Contact Dometic, discuss the issue and act as your own "warranty coordinator"... Keystone is out of the picture and your dealer apparently doesn't want your business unless it's you that's paying them, so they "make Keystone the bad guy" and try to get into your pocket even deeper than they already have......

[swenson713]

Originally Posted by Customer1

The dealer knows Keystone isn't going to cover those things but they are making Keystone the bad guy so you don't get mad at them.

This is clearly not a moisture problem, it's a construction problem. I understand we exceed the warranty period by several months. As earlier stated "Keystone knew this problem existed". This is not a warranty problem it's a manufacturer's defect. It's not small pieces that peeled (lifted) , this has happened with over 8 cabinets! Much larger sections have been peeling off the cabinets.

[swenson713]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

No idea which model Springdale you have, but realize that trailers, like vehicles, come in varying price ranges and the more you pay, the more expensive materials you get in the build. Springdale and Hideout are the two "least expensive trailers" in the Keystone line and they use the least expensive materials to build them.

If you compared an Ethan Allen end table from a high end furniture store to a WalMart "build it yourself" end table, you'd expect the Ethan Allen table to be nicer and more durable with a much better finish.

It's the same with trailer cabinetry and as Mikendebbie stated, even in their "high end, top of the line" Montana, they have similar problems with the vinyl wrapped MDF cabinetry.

As for the toilet, if you have a Dometic 300 or 310 toilet, the Dometic warranty is a "limited two year warranty". So, depending on how long you've owned your trailer, you may want to contact Dometic to discuss your warranty issues. It's all in your Keystone Owner's Manual in the warranty section. The manual fully explains that Keystone will act as your agent DURING THE 1 YEAR KEYSTONE WARRANTY and that it is your responsibility to contact the individual component manufacturer for any warranty issues that occur beyond the "Keystone warranty period"... So, your dealer, if they didn't explain that to you, is not doing you any favors and they're the "bad guy" holding out for you to pay rather than process your Dometic toilet warranty....

If you haven't fully read and reread the Keystone Owner's Manual "warranty section" it would benefit you greatly to take an hour or so, sit down with the manual and fully understand what YOUR responsibility in the warranty repairs entails.

It's no surprise that your dealer told you Keystone won't repair your issues under warranty. It's no longer Keystone's responsibility. Contact Dometic, discuss the issue and act as your own "warranty coordinator"... Keystone is out of the picture and your dealer apparently doesn't want your business unless it's you that's paying them, so they "make Keystone the bad guy" and try to get into your pocket even deeper than they already have......

Just to be clear, you believe Keystone manufactors trailers of "low quality" . However then you said Keystone experiences this problem in the "high end top of the line Montana". So which is it , low quality in both high & low end models?
Here is what customer service told me..."Keystone is aware of this 'low quality ' manufacturers defect"

[sourdough]

Back to square one. The trailer is almost 2 years old. Keystone's warranty period is 12 months. Whatever is going on now that you are bringing to their attention isn't their problem. Within the first 12 mos. you have a bone to pick with them; outside 12 mos. they have no obligation. That is one of the reasons we constantly harp about using the trailer in the first 12 months, paying attention to what's failing then get it reported within that time frame.

I have no idea what made all your cabinet doors peel - I've never seen it. I have seen the paper coming loose but not all the doors peel at once...which does sound like a moisture issue. I don't know who at Keystone told you they are aware of a manufacturing "defect" but you need to keep that documentation because without it I'm afraid you've got a long row to hoe if you want them to replace them all.

As far as any other items failing after the 12mos. Keystone warranty; some have longer warranty periods from the manufacturer. Keystone runs that gauntlet for you during the first 12mos. but after than you need to know the manufacturers of your various appliances etc., the warranty periods and their contact info so you can do your own warranty claims. At 2 years you will be running out of most of them.

[swenson713]

This peeling problem started shortly after the first year and has continued to get worse. Moisture has never been a problem .
Keystone is aware of the problem and a company knows they have a problem and don't fix it even if it goes past the warranty says they really don't care about their customer.
Hope you enjoy working for them.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by swenson713

This peeling problem started shortly after the first year and has continued to get worse. Moisture has never been a problem .
Keystone is aware of the problem and a company knows they have a problem and don't fix it even if it goes past the warranty says they really don't care about their customer.
Hope you enjoy working for them.

NOBODY on this forum "works for Keystone" so maybe you might want to either rephrase your unfounded accusations or apologize for the "perceived attempt at insulting members of the forum who are trying to help you."...

Now, back to "reality". Do you have any documentation or proof that "Keystone is aware of the problem and don't fix it even if it goes past the warranty"??? Or is that "something someone told you to get you out of their shop" ???

Facts are facts. You have a trailer that is not in warranty. You want Keystone to fix it anyway and they told you, "No, your trailer is no longer in warranty"... Now, you come on a private website (read the red flagged disclaimer at the bottom of every forum webpage) and start insulting members here because we tell you that you're facing a difficult or impossible attempt at getting something for nothing ???

Regroup, take a "chill pill" and if you want suggestions on how to fix your trailer or on how to (or who to) contact Keystone for an additional attempt at getting them to consider a repair, then members here have a "bucket load of experience" with Keystone and how to navigate their corporate policies and guidelines.

Otherwise, if all you want to do is "lash out at or insult people who are trying to help you understand what you're facing" then I do hope you have a nice rest of the weekend.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by swenson713

This peeling problem started shortly after the first year and has continued to get worse. Moisture has never been a problem .
Keystone is aware of the problem and a company knows they have a problem and don't fix it even if it goes past the warranty says they really don't care about their customer.
Hope you enjoy working for them.

As has been stated, no one on this forum works for Keystone. You had a warranty like every other owner of every other RV of every other manufacturer....you let it expire without taking care of the issues. IF the issues occurred outside that 12mo. window that is just bad luck...but reality.

Refusing to face reality and facts leads one to be unhappy many times. Getting mad at yourself makes a person start blaming anyone and everyone as I see in your comments. There is no need to make smart aleck remarks to those trying to help and is unwarranted.

As I said, if you actually have information provided by KEYSTONE that they admit they have a "manufacturing" defect in the cabinet doors, which I can't imagine them saying, and they refuse to do anything you have something to work with. If you are listening to a dealer you are in deep kimchi - they don't work for the RV manufacturers and certainly aren't their spokesmen.

All RV owners have faced irritating, costly failures that they fix. When faced with that fact, that reality, they reach out for help in how best to rectify the situation. Some on the other hand only want to vent, get affirmation and then attack anyone that doesn't agree....

[SargeW]

I have a similar issue with my 2023 Passport cabinet doors. 10 of the 16 doors are failing, and I have taken it to a dealer and they have submitted the warranty claim to Keystone. Keystone doesn't make their doors, so they will submit my claim to their vendor for their resolution. I have documented my issue on a separate thread here on the forum.

I will call Keystone this week to see if I can get an update on my claim. You have to stay on top of the progress of the issue so it is not lost in the shuffle. I will post when I find out Keystone's answer to my problem.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by SargeW

I have a similar issue with my 2023 Passport cabinet doors. 10 of the 16 doors are failing, and I have taken it to a dealer and they have submitted the warranty claim to Keystone. Keystone doesn't make their doors, so they will submit my claim to their vendor for their resolution. I have documented my issue on a separate thread here on the forum.

I will call Keystone this week to see if I can get an update on my claim. You have to stay on top of the progress of the issue so it is not lost in the shuffle. I will post when I find out Keystone's answer to my problem.

Thanks. Please follow up and let us know what they say. I had forgotten about your issue until I read this post. I've read all kinds of things on forums about who makes and/or assembles the cabinets for various manufacturers and RV model lines. Hopefully yours is within the 12 mo. window and you get a favorable decision. If yours has 10 of 16 peeling similar to the OP it sounds like there may be some problem with the adhesive, adhesive vs wood finish or something along those lines vs moisture as noted in the comments on the other thread.

When did you buy your trailer? OP bought his in Jan. '22. I'm wondering if there was a bad "batch" of something used during a short timeframe or if the products used are incompatible in some way. Has the dealer made any comments on their assessment of the problem?

Be sure and stay on Keystone. If they are using an outside vendor for the cabinets your persistence will help them keep your issue on the front burner vs sending an email then forgetting it. Good luck.

[Bisjoe]

We have not had that problem at all with our 2017 Springdale. I recall reading several articles back in the Covid lockdown days of the lack of help, inexperience and materials issues for the 2020 and 2021 trailers of all makes.

I will say that our Springdale roof is a problem, I had to go around the edges and apply some new Dicor twice already.

[Gbpb]

Originally Posted by swenson713

We purchased our Keystone Springdale in Jan of 2022.
Wanting to know if anyone has experienced this Multiple cabinet doors are peeling (delaminating )throughout the travel trailer The local dealer has asked Keystone to cover the repairs, they have said NO, it is out of warranty
This is truly a manufactory defect, we also have a toilet which over runs plus a few other issues, none of these is Keystone willing to take responsibility for, yet they believe we should pay $4700.00 to have their issues repaired

Hi yes wa have the same problem keystone will repair the delam wear is is peling so we will see what kind of job the do

[SargeW]

The dealer just heard back from Keystone, they will replace all affected doors under warranty.