Convertor question

[tech740]

Okay this will be long but I think the background info is important.
My RV went in for repairs and the dealer flipped the battery switch to kill power and didn’t restore it. I picked it up and took the RV home after repair. Plugged it into shore power and it sat for 4 days before we were planning to leave. After 4 days when I went to operate the slides, it was attached to the truck when it was opened after repair, the batteries were dead. I found the battery switch and turned it on. I waited overnight to close the slides and I got them closed. Now we have been plugged into shore power for 36 hours at our site and I am still only showing 12.7 volts. With a meter at the batteries plugged in I still only show 12.7. Shouldn’t I be seeing 13+ because it is in shore power? I am not sure if I have a converter issue or not.

Sorry for all words and thanks for the insight.

[JRTJH]

Several things you need to consider.

1. When a battery is "fully discharged" (which is probably what happened when it sat for weeks at the dealership) most batteries will never again accept a full charge. You'll probably need to buy replacement batteries.

2. When a battery is discharged, using the converter or the truck connection to operate "high amp draw" items (slides, leveling systems, etc) can damage either the truck connection and/or the converter since the battery is unable to "help provide the amp surge"....

3. To check your converter output for proper voltage (13.6 VDC) the battery must be completely disconnected from the cables. Then use the voltmeter to check the voltage present at the cable terminal ends. It should be 13.6-13.8 VDC. If the battery (good, bad, fully charged or completely discharged) is connected to the battery cables, the converter circuitry will not produce "full output" but will produce only the "adjusted voltage per the charge regimen programmed into the converter"... So, it might read 12.1 VDC or it might read 14.2 VDC. That's the "biased voltage caused by the battery"... Remove the battery and check the cable ends for proper voltage.

[sourdough]

RJ, first, did you make the dealership aware of the fact they left the batteries disconnected all that time? Were they aware that they were dead when you picked it up? If not, did you let them know right away? How did you raise/lower it to get it on the hitch on pickup?

The reason I ask is that a similar thing happened to me. When I picked up my trailer they had let 2 new Interstate batteries completely die. I could not make the tongue jack work so immediately let them know sitting there in the yard. At that time I told them the batteries were destroyed and I wanted new ones. They responded that they would charge them and they would be OK. I provided them with the discharge chart from Interstate to show them that the batteries had lost 88% of their recharge capability and I would not be taking the trailer home without new batteries. They did and I took it home. You may want to address this situation similarly if you are holding all the cards.

[travelin texans]

Even though the dealer may have used the factory disconnect that WILL NOT prevent the batteries from totally discharging, too many parasitic draws that bypass that disconnect. The only sure way to totally disconnect battery drains during storage is to disconnect the battery cables.
I'd guess if it sat at the dealer for several weeks waiting on repairs the batteries are toast, replacement is your best bet.

[Pigman~1]

Rechargeable batteries are rechargeable batteries with a limited number of recharges. They are used with chargers. No. 5 and No. 7 are generally sold in the market, but there is also No. 1. The advantages of rechargeable batteries are economic, environmental protection, sufficient power, suitable for high-power, long-term use of electrical appliances (such as Walkman, electric toys, etc.). The voltage of the rechargeable battery is lower than that of the same type of disposable battery. The AA battery (Charge 5) is 1.2 volts, and the 9V rechargeable battery is actually 8.4 volts. Now the general charging times can be around 1000 times. As of February 2012, there are only five types: nickel cadmium, nickel metal hydride, lithium ion, lead storage, and iron lithium.

[tech740]

So I let the dealer know and there response was that there responsibility is to flip the switch when it is dropped off. They did that. They never did any other time they had it. I guess they don't have to put it back or inform the customer. I didn't look because they hadn't done it in the past. I pulled my leads and tested the voltage at the leads with no batteries hooked up and it was 13.2 which I expected from the converter. I cleaned all the battery connections and the batteries are up to 13.0. My goal is to unplug it at home for a night when I go to work so I can see if they make it through the night. If not new batteries it is.
If I go the new battery route I am considering 6V. I know I have to hook them in series not parallel. My question is do I need to do anything with the converter or will it charge them appropriately?
I am also changing the wiring on the disconnect to make it a true disconnect.

[tech740]

So if you measure with a volt meter and get 13.2 and the one control display inside the RV says 12.7, I assume you trust the meter? Or am I missing something?

[chuckster57]

I have dealt with Lippert and the voltage display on the One Control panel. Been a while but I think there was a fix. Call LCI and ask for tech support, very friendly and extremely knowledgeable about their products.

[tech740]

When I flip the disconnect why do I have power in both lugs still?

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by tech740

When I flip the disconnect why do I have power in both lugs still?

What disconnect and where are you measuring the "power"?

[tech740]

Originally Posted by flybouy

What disconnect and where are you measuring the "power"?

I was trying to find which side of the battery disconnect was “hot”. One side was 12.7 and one side was 13.6 with the switch off. We figured out the 12.7 is the battery side. We were plugged into shore power. When we unplugged that and checked it we had no power on one side and the 12.7 remained.

All this make my factory disconnect an actual disconnect. I am going to put what is now my positive lead on the switches side of the disconnect and tuna 6awg wire from the positive to the hot side of the switch. That way when I turn it off it isolated all power from the batteries.

What I learned is that if plugged into shore power even with the battery switch off you have power on both sides of the switch.

As I said earlier my plan is to be able to have the trailer sit 12-13 hours at work in the lot so I can leave right after work. Tonight I am leaving it unplugged from shore power to see if the refrigerator is still running in the morning. I am guessing I will be putting two new deep cycle batteries in it after the test because when I turn off the switch I drop to 12.7 volts from 13ish right away.

[flybouy]

With shore power active you should have the voltage from the converter on the load side of the switch and you should have voltage on the line side (from the batteries). When shore power is disconnected the converter is not energized and the load side will drop to zero if the switch is in the off or disconnected position.

The reason the factory switch does not completely disconnect the batteries completely is because some items such as landing gear or tongue jack , slides, CO monitor, and radio memory wires are not connected to the switch. Those circuits are connected inbetween the batter positive lead and the switch.

[tech740]

Originally Posted by flybouy

With shore power active you should have the voltage from the converter on the load side of the switch and you should have voltage on the line side (from the batteries). When shore power is disconnected the converter is not energized and the load side will drop to zero if the switch is in the off or disconnected position.

The reason the factory switch does not completely disconnect the batteries completely is because some items such as landing gear or tongue jack , slides, CO monitor, and radio memory wires are not connected to the switch. Those circuits are connected inbetween the batter positive lead and the switch.

Yup I understand that now. I knew about the parasitic drains that is why I am adding the new positive cable and moving the old to the old side. That way when I leave it at the dealer it is actually disconnected and I don’t have the same issue again.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by tech740

So I let the dealer know and there response was that there responsibility is to flip the switch when it is dropped off. They did that. They never did any other time they had it. I guess they don't have to put it back or inform the customer. I didn't look because they hadn't done it in the past. I pulled my leads and tested the voltage at the leads with no batteries hooked up and it was 13.2 which I expected from the converter. I cleaned all the battery connections and the batteries are up to 13.0. My goal is to unplug it at home for a night when I go to work so I can see if they make it through the night. If not new batteries it is.
If I go the new battery route I am considering 6V. I know I have to hook them in series not parallel. My question is do I need to do anything with the converter or will it charge them appropriately?
I am also changing the wiring on the disconnect to make it a true disconnect.

That response would be inadequate for me. If the trailer is not returned to you just as you left it with them it is incumbent on them to inform you of any changes that were made; particularly if they require your intervention to correct. An owner should not have to go through an RV looking for anything/everything that might have been done by the dealership that they need to correct (but we do). They knowingly put your trailer in a non operative condition leaving you to figure it out resulting in dead batteries....nada.

[tech740]

Originally Posted by sourdough

That response would be inadequate for me. If the trailer is not returned to you just as you left it with them it is incumbent on them to inform you of any changes that were made; particularly if they require your intervention to correct. An owner should not have to go through an RV looking for anything/everything that might have been done by the dealership that they need to correct (but we do). They knowingly put your trailer in a non operative condition leaving you to figure it out resulting in dead batteries....nada.

I completely agree! I have argued that with the dealer and Forest River. Neither will budge because I am a week outside warranty. So now I am moving onto making sure it cant happen again. This RV has been by far the biggest pain I have ever dealt with. It has been back to Elkhart twice, the dealer twice, a home repair by Lippert, and a flooring repair company. I know its not Keystone but this forum is so active and helpful I will always come here first. They are all the same parts just built in a different plant.

Thanks again

[tech740]

I have never kept an RV long enough to need new batteries. I am leaning towards two of these.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/EverStart...-MCA/180350522
I am thinking I will need new ones, at 6:00PM I was at 13.0V at 7:15 it was 12.42V. Only draws are the detectors and the residential fridge on the invertor. I think its 8 amps total

[sourdough]

I understand your frustration. When I forced them to replace both my batteries due to a similar dealership error my trailer was almost 6 years old. Had nothing to do with warranty, it was a dealership failure. Good luck.

[tech740]

Well after 6 hours the batteries were at 12v. I got two new deep cycles today and put them in. Rewired the shut off to be a true disconnect. Batteries were both 12.6 when I picked them up. Letting them balance and acclimate for 24 hours. (Not sure that needed but makes me feel better) Then I will redo the test tomorrow. Gotta turn off the antenna booster and I think I will have everything isolated except the inverter for the fridge and the detectors.

[LERD]

Having been a previous boat owner, I still had an old Perko 2 battery disconnect switch laying around. All battery power goes through that first. This switch is very heavy duty. It takes effort to turn the dial from battery 1 to battery 2 to both batteries or Off. It has a very noticeable detent and a very loud and solid clunking noise when you turn it. There's no mistaking that you rotated that knob. I have had my battery last 4 weeks with no drain whatsoever. I was more disappointed in the fact that it took four weeks to get back on the road. But sometimes that's life for you

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by LERD

Having been a previous boat owner, I still had an old Perko 2 battery disconnect switch laying around. All battery power goes through that first. This switch is very heavy duty. It takes effort to turn the dial from battery 1 to battery 2 to both batteries or Off. It has a very noticeable detent and a very loud and solid clunking noise when you turn it. There's no mistaking that you rotated that knob. I have had my battery last 4 weeks with no drain whatsoever. I was more disappointed in the fact that it took four weeks to get back on the road. But sometimes that's life for you

It's frustrating but it's also a learning experience is it not? Being a several decades boater myself if I were going to install 2 12 volt batteries I would use the POerco switch you described as well.

My reasoning for the use of the Perco 1,2,1+2 & off switch is the isolation ability. If you have one battery go south it's easily taken out of the equation by selecting the other battery. If you have say a solar charger that you want to quickly charge 1 battery you can do that. It also gives you the option to run run 1 battery down to the max 50% while keeping a second battery "in reserve" instead of running both batteries down and then being forced to recharge or be powerless. JMHO