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Old 07-06-2018, 04:21 PM   #1
NHcamper
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Tires and # of accidents

Tire question. I have a 2015 Duel Axel Keystone Laredo 322rl. About 3,000 miles on the tires and all have valve mounted tire pressure monitoring system sensors with a display in my truck cab. All tires are set to 65 PSI and checked every start and constantly monitored while driving along with tire temp. All has always been within norms. Vehicle is never driven over 65 MPH. Tires are always covered when not being driven. Tires were manuf. In 2014 according to dot code. Tires are Trailer King ST radial 225/75R15.

With the above as background, I’d so appreciate some good opinions.

I was driving on an interstate when the first tire blew. Tread ripped right off of tire, pieces flew thru camper floor and slide out floor ripping out major wiring and leaving significant holes. Changed tire, cut out hanging pieces and wires and continued on my way Went approx.. 100 miles more prior to stopping for 2 nights. No road hazard.

Got on road again and approx.. 100 more miles the second tire blew. Opposites side of same axel. This tire had all of its tread but blew right thru the steel belts center. Looked like someone took a chain saw to it. This one took out the wheel well moldings but not much else. No road hazard. Changed it, went to a Goodyear dealer and bought 5 replacement Goodyear Endurance tires as I didn’t want to take a chance with more blow outs.

I consider this one accident as it seems reasonable that the second tire blew due to either the axel shifting or on due weight put on in when first tire blew on same axel. Coincidence of individual un related blowing doesn’t make sense. I’m attaching pictures of each tire.

My question is what is your opinion as to the cause of the second tire blowing? I am making the case with my insurance company that the second tire blew due to the blowing of the first tire and should be considered one accident vs. two. They say it can’t be proven so they are treating it as 2 accidents with two deductibles and no reimbursement for either tire. As two accidents no payment for second tire either.

Your opinions would be so greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
NH Camper
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Old 07-06-2018, 04:59 PM   #2
Badbart56
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Personally, I haven't heard anything good about Trailer King tires. And I'm not impressed with Goodyear marathons, as I had a set that were about 5 years old and two of the 6 failed. I have gone to a 14 ply for my Toy Hauler. Just my opinion.
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Old 07-06-2018, 05:10 PM   #3
ctbruce
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It is more an issue of the tires having enough and giving up the ghost up. If you got more than 3 years on them, you were on borrowed time. Chances are, if you looked st the insides of the non-blown tires, they were probably starting to separate too. It happens a lot. This is the kind of failure that your TPMS cannot help.

Since the insurance already has enough info to determine it was 2 incidents, it's unlikely you will be able to change their mind.
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Old 07-06-2018, 05:39 PM   #4
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I doubt you will convince the insurance company it was 2 separate incidents, although in reality it probably was.

Your problem, #1 the tires were Trailer King. Mine made it to the 2nd season before disintegrating. My failure looked exactly like your first picture; took out the wheel well, fender, coroplast and gas lines to the slide - 7k worth (all perfectly maintained I might add). #2) I suspect the tires were LRDs; not heavy enough for a trailer that weighs almost 10k IMO although the trailer manufacturers will say otherwise. You bought new tires; I HOPE you went to LREs because you really need them. That, IMO, is the single biggest thing you could do to prevent a recurrence of the incident.
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Old 07-06-2018, 06:12 PM   #5
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Sourdough, I am sorry but what are LRE"s, thanks. I have the same tires as NHcamper and we are looking at a getting new tires for our High Country 375fl, any information provided for a good safe tire would be appreciated, thanks.
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Old 07-06-2018, 06:25 PM   #6
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Sourdough, I am sorry but what are LRE"s, thanks. I have the same tires as NHcamper and we are looking at a getting new tires for our High Country 375fl, any information provided for a good safe tire would be appreciated, thanks.
LRE = Load Range there are different levels of rating: "D" "E" "F" etc...
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Old 07-06-2018, 06:41 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Colts View Post
Sourdough, I am sorry but what are LRE"s, thanks. I have the same tires as NHcamper and we are looking at a getting new tires for our High Country 375fl, any information provided for a good safe tire would be appreciated, thanks.

With the size of your trailer I figure you probably have 16s? Look at the gvw of the trailer. Look at the size/load range of your tire (whatever the LR may be - they will give you max load at x pressure). Does the load range for each tire x4 exceed the gvw of your trailer? By any significant margin? Manufacturers take the gvw of the trailer, deduct the pin weight and then give you tires that maybe, hopefully cover the weight that's left. Bad idea IMO. I, personally, buy tires in a load range that will exceed my gvw by a nice margin. Why? Running tires at a marginal load range on rough, undulating road will exceed the loads on minimally rated tires. JMO.
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Old 07-06-2018, 06:54 PM   #8
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I dont have the 5th wheel at the house but I know our dry weight is right around 12K, we are going to Les Schwabb tomorrow to see what they have to offer and or recommend, do you have any recommendations for LRE for this size 5th wheel, thanks?
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Old 07-06-2018, 07:11 PM   #9
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I dont have the 5th wheel at the house but I know our dry weight is right around 12K, we are going to Les Schwabb tomorrow to see what they have to offer and or recommend, do you have any recommendations for LRE for this size 5th wheel, thanks?
There are many here who have changed the "stock" tires with a better quality tire. If you search around the various threads, you'll find lots of info. Many of us chose the Carlisle brand. They seem to be very reliable, well known and one of the better quality Chinese made tires available. If your 5r is 12K dry, you have heavy (GVWR) trailer. You might want to look into the F or even G rated tires, as long as your wheels are rated for the pressure needed to properly inflate and run the heavier rated tires.
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Old 07-06-2018, 07:15 PM   #10
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Speaking of Les Schwab.... As you see in my "signature lines" I went with a total upgrade, to 17.5 inch wheels and tires from Les Schwab. Now if you are in a big hurry, these will not be your tires as they are rated "J" with a 62-mph speed rating. However you will have complete piece of mind! We have approximately 80,000 plus miles on them and they still have deep tread.
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Old 07-06-2018, 07:20 PM   #11
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There are many here who have changed the "stock" tires with a better quality tire. If you search around the various threads, you'll find lots of info. Many of us chose the Carlisle brand. They seem to be very reliable, well known and one of the better quality Chinese made tires available. If your 5r is 12K dry, you have heavy (GVWR) trailer. You might want to look into the F or even G rated tires, as long as your wheels are rated for the pressure needed to properly inflate and run the heavier rated tires.
Thanks, I will check with Les Schwab staff to make sure the wheels are rated foe those tires.
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Old 07-06-2018, 07:41 PM   #12
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Thanks, I will check with Les Schwab staff to make sure the wheels are rated foe those tires.
FWIW... I don't know if Les Schwab sells Carslile tires, they might but I don't know. On the back of your wheels, there should be a PSI rating stamped or molded in the metal.

I don't know where you live, but if you have a reputable tire shop you regularly deal with, ask them how much they would charge to mount and balance the tires if you brought them in.

This is the reason, last year, my regular tire shop quoted me about $750 for 5 new Carlisle tires in the size i wanted, including replacing the spare tire. I ordered the EXACT same tires online from Walmart, and had them shipped to my local store for free, for about $375, for 5 tires. The same tire guy charged me $25 per tire to install them, including balance. I saved about $225 dollars going this route.

Since the tires I took off the trailer only had about 400 miles on them, i sold them on craigslist for a couple hundred buck to some local farmer. So in the end, I only paid about $300 for brand new, (less than 6 month old based on the date code) tires for my 5r. I used the extra cash to invest in a TPMS for the 5r. Im very happy with them so far.

Granted, you should choose what works best for you, your trailer, and budget, my story is just one option to consider.

Assuming your wheels are 16"... Walmart has an LR-F tire for $95 each https://www.walmart.com/ip/Carlisle-...-F-12/55012161
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Old 07-06-2018, 08:05 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Colts View Post
I dont have the 5th wheel at the house but I know our dry weight is right around 12K, we are going to Les Schwabb tomorrow to see what they have to offer and or recommend, do you have any recommendations for LRE for this size 5th wheel, thanks?

IMO you need to do your homework and TELL THEM what you want. Don't go to a place that sells boat loads of car tires and ask them what they think....they don't know. They will give you a blanket idea from some guy that has no idea what the difference is between an ST, LT or P tire is. Study up and learn what the deal is. The tires are the most important thing going on when you are pulling a heavy trailer down the road, and no, "that" guy in the tire shop #1 probably doesn't know squat, #2, doesn't really care and #3 just wants to sell you something "that works". It's on YOU to know all the ins and outs; it's your trailer, you and your family. They don't have that burden.
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Old 07-07-2018, 04:19 AM   #14
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Sourdough and Bolo are all over this. Wise words worth following.
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Old 07-07-2018, 07:05 AM   #15
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Thank all for your input, will do some research.
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Old 07-07-2018, 11:48 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by NHcamper View Post
Tire question. I have a 2015 Duel Axel Keystone Laredo 322rl. About 3,000 miles on the tires and all have valve mounted tire pressure monitoring system sensors with a display in my truck cab. All tires are set to 65 PSI and checked every start and constantly monitored while driving along with tire temp. All has always been within norms. Vehicle is never driven over 65 MPH. Tires are always covered when not being driven. Tires were manuf. In 2014 according to dot code. Tires are Trailer King ST radial 225/75R15.

With the above as background, I’d so appreciate some good opinions.

I was driving on an interstate when the first tire blew. Tread ripped right off of tire, pieces flew thru camper floor and slide out floor ripping out major wiring and leaving significant holes. Changed tire, cut out hanging pieces and wires and continued on my way Went approx.. 100 miles more prior to stopping for 2 nights. No road hazard.

Got on road again and approx.. 100 more miles the second tire blew. Opposites side of same axel. This tire had all of its tread but blew right thru the steel belts center. Looked like someone took a chain saw to it. This one took out the wheel well moldings but not much else. No road hazard. Changed it, went to a Goodyear dealer and bought 5 replacement Goodyear Endurance tires as I didn’t want to take a chance with more blow outs.

I consider this one accident as it seems reasonable that the second tire blew due to either the axel shifting or on due weight put on in when first tire blew on same axel. Coincidence of individual un related blowing doesn’t make sense. I’m attaching pictures of each tire.

My question is what is your opinion as to the cause of the second tire blowing? I am making the case with my insurance company that the second tire blew due to the blowing of the first tire and should be considered one accident vs. two. They say it can’t be proven so they are treating it as 2 accidents with two deductibles and no reimbursement for either tire. As two accidents no payment for second tire either.

Your opinions would be so greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
NH Camper

Your pictures tell the story. They are, IMO, a classic example of normal tread separations. Probably caused from a combination of usage conditions such as fatigue, interplay sheer and vary likely, axle overloading. They are to old to have been caused by any manufacturing defects.

It’s too bad you already got new tires if you got them with the same load capacity. You really needed to go up in load range to LRE. The LRE tires are identical in size and use the same load inflation chart but have the ability to be inflated to 80 PSI which would of given you a much higher load capacity reserve than the LRD tires.

Did you add steel valve stems when you added the TPMS? If not, you should do so with the replacement tires.

A lot of RV trailer owners are unhappy with your trailer’s original brand of tire. In general they get above average reviews. IMO, their problem is with OEM fitments requiring them to carry weights at their maxim capacity, causing them to degrade more rapidly then what would normally be expected of them.

Next time you head-out fully loaded for a camping trip, see if you can find some scales and check you total weight. If high, check each axle’s weight. Overloading an axle is common when carrying full tanks of water.

The 3-5 year usage from RV trailer tires is a good rule of thumb. There are a lot of variables that causes them to degrade during that time frame. IMO, the more excess load capacity the longer the life expectancy.
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Old 07-07-2018, 12:02 PM   #17
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Side Bar:

Original Equipment tires for RV trailers are not selected by the trailer's GVWR or GVW. They are selected to carry the weight of the vehicle manufacturer's GAWR weights listed on the vehicle certification label, tire placard and in the owner's manual.

Part of the GVWR is carried by the tow vehicle or the tongue/landing gear when disconnected from the tow vehicle.

Tire industry standards require the replacements to have a load capacity equal to or greater than the Original Equipment tires by inflation.

Parking your RV trailer unlevel for long periods of time will cause more fatigue in the tires holding the most weight. That is also a condition that could have caused the OP of this thread to have tire failures on one axle and not the other.
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Old 07-07-2018, 01:34 PM   #18
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Old 07-07-2018, 04:45 PM   #19
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Original Equipment tires for RV trailers are not selected by the trailer's GVWR or GVW. They are selected to carry the weight of the vehicle manufacturer's GAWR weights listed on the vehicle certification label, tire placard and in the owner's manual.

Part of the GVWR is carried by the tow vehicle or the tongue/landing gear when disconnected from the tow vehicle.

Tire industry standards require the replacements to have a load capacity equal to or greater than the Original Equipment tires by inflation.

Parking your RV trailer unlevel for long periods of time will cause more fatigue in the tires holding the most weight. That is also a condition that could have caused the OP of this thread to have tire failures on one axle and not the other.
As a note to CWs sidebar:

My trailer gvw is 10k lbs. The gawr is 5200x2 = 10, 400 lbs. The tires were 225x75 15 LRD @ 2540 lbs. each = 10, 160 lbs. Tongue weight, if loaded to a 12% weight, would = 1200 lbs. at gvw.

IF, and I say IF, the trailer was pulled on a constantly flat, smooth perfect surface, yes, that 1200 lbs. could come off the weight the tires need to carry. That's just not real life. Probably 30-40% of the time, if not 60-70%, we are on undulating roads, frost heaves, potholes, expansion joints etc. that throw the full weight of the trailer, and more, onto the tires. In our case, thinking that a 40 lb. margin for safety per tire over what the trailer could actually haul is ludicrous at best, dangerous at worst - and that is considering the load was perfectly balanced. That is the reason that I totally endorse a tire upgrade in most situations regarding a trailer.

CW is spot on with his observation; I am trying to point out my opinions on the criteria that is used and how it affects, and has affected, me and I'm sure many others. JMO, YMMV
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Old 07-12-2018, 07:27 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Colts View Post
Sourdough, I am sorry but what are LRE"s, thanks. I have the same tires as NHcamper and we are looking at a getting new tires for our High Country 375fl, any information provided for a good safe tire would be appreciated, thanks.
Depending on the tear of your HC ~~my 2017 came with Rainier LR E tires on wheels rated for 110 psi. Pulled the 5er 43 miles to the tire shop and had Sailun S637 tires installed. I run these ast 100 psi. My previous 5er, a Cougar arrived with Trailer King tires. Again 43 miles to the tire shop and put Carlisle LRF tires on it. The wheels were rated for 80 psi and I ran the Carlisle LRF at 90 psi.
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