Another useless thread about EVs

[sourdough]

EVs need to be bashed (if that's what you call negative comments) if they are being forced on anyone as is being done in the U.S. They are good for short hops for those that live in a city and folks that don't expect a lot. I need my vehicles to get me 300mi. in one hop with no lost time - and I expect to use my A/C and heater, not drive 30mph to increase mileage etc. along with throwing whatever I want in/on them. You like your EVs, good. Doesn't mean they are the answer to anything other than someone's personal desire - not a panacea for anything else.

[Catsailor]

85% of current 1/2 ton pickups are used as commuters and grocery getters.
75% of 1/2 ton pickup drivers report towing less than 1 time a year.
90% of 1/2 ton pickup drivers that do tow, tow less than 30 miles in a day.
80% of daily drives in this country are less than 40 miles (this includes rural areas)
99.9% of daily US drives are less than 100 miles a day.
There are way more places to charge an EV than gas stations.
90% of EV charging is performed at home overnight, most completed before dinner.
Per NTSB statistics ICE occupants are 10 times more likely to experience a vehicular fire than an occupant of an EV,
Battery warranties are double the duration of an ICE warranty. Modern Lithium batteries will far outlast the vehicle they are installed in. Just google used 2013 Tesla Model S if this is still confusing to you.
Look up EV customer retention, it’s the highest of any automotive segment. People who get “hosed” typically don’t continue buying items that “hosed” them.
The average ICE vehicle driver spends over two hours on over 50 trips to the gas station a year, plugging in and unplugging an EV takes five seconds. The Average EV driver spends considerably less time refueling their vehicle annually than you do.


Not my comments but well written. As to the Mustang comment mine is faster than most ever produced and the Lightning is faster if that's your thing.

Don't want to get into a on line war but like I said go drive one, one pedal driving is great

[sourdough]

Not interested in an argument but also not interested in re-hearing the industry/political talking points about EVs. Talking points are that, real life is real life. You have EVs and are happy - good. As you said, you aren't towing anything with them....and can't. We each have our preferences and if yours is an EV fine, if others don't like them and say so it's not bashing - it's an opinion...just as yours is. And yes, I've driven an EV and they would be good for going to the corner grocery.

[travelin texans]

Originally Posted by Catsailor

85% of current 1/2 ton pickups are used as commuters and grocery getters.
75% of 1/2 ton pickup drivers report towing less than 1 time a year.
90% of 1/2 ton pickup drivers that do tow, tow less than 30 miles in a day.
80% of daily drives in this country are less than 40 miles (this includes rural areas)
99.9% of daily US drives are less than 100 miles a day.
There are way more places to charge an EV than gas stations.
90% of EV charging is performed at home overnight, most completed before dinner.
Per NTSB statistics ICE occupants are 10 times more likely to experience a vehicular fire than an occupant of an EV,
Battery warranties are double the duration of an ICE warranty. Modern Lithium batteries will far outlast the vehicle they are installed in. Just google used 2013 Tesla Model S if this is still confusing to you.
Look up EV customer retention, it’s the highest of any automotive segment. People who get “hosed” typically don’t continue buying items that “hosed” them.
The average ICE vehicle driver spends over two hours on over 50 trips to the gas station a year, plugging in and unplugging an EV takes five seconds. The Average EV driver spends considerably less time refueling their vehicle annually than you do.


Not my comments but well written. As to the Mustang comment mine is faster than most ever produced and the Lightning is faster if that's your thing.

Don't want to get into a on line war but like I said go drive one, one pedal driving is great

If there are more charging staions than gas stations they're hiding them very well. Its about 30 miles one way for us to go buy groceries, in that 30 miles we pass about 20 gas stations & not a single charging station in sight, unless they're counting charging at home.
And less time charging than fueling, well hell yes, you have to stand next to the pump for 5 minutes to add 20+ gallons & then good for 300+ miles. To charge an EV you plug it in & go to bed for 8 hours, or more & you're good for 200-250 miles..........maybe, depending on wind, running heat or A/C, listening to the radio, terrain & number of passengers.
I agree there are plenty of folks that want an EV & really like them & have a need for one.
But even more that don't want one crammed down their throats all while being told how wonderful they are.
I would consider a hybrid, but where we live & travel required to go just about anywhere an EV just does not fit.
We have a trip planned this weekend of just over 300 miles one way & very little of anything on the route including gas staions & sure not a charging station 100 miles from our destination which is about where the EV would be dead. If I run out of gas roadside assistance can bring 5 gallons of gas & I'm on my way in 5 minutes or they bring a generator & we sit for ?? hours recharging to go the last 100 miles.

[notanlines]

“ There are way more places to charge an EV than gas stations.”
I’m fairly confident this article is referring to all duplex receptacles in the area. The city of Okeechobee has about four recharging stations. Your guess as to how many gas stations…..35 maybe?

[jasin1]

Originally Posted by Catsailor

Wow, way to bash those EVs. I have a Mach E Mustang and a F150 Lightning and I live in rural Ontario, Canada. Love both of them but I'm not likely to tow distances yet. Also have an Ice F150 Eco Boost.

Of the three my favorite is the Lightning. So before crapping on EVs go drive one

why don’t we all meet at the border ..say niagara falls? and discuss this like civilized people ,no bashing ..let’s see it’s about 750 miles from Ontario..so doing the math you should be good to arrive in a week to 10 days if you leave now???with charging stops???

LOL i couldn’t resist

i think they have a place but don’t want to be forced..and with the new rules about no gas stoves,water heaters or furnaces coming to a town near you i guess they better get working on new power plants and infrastructure

[Badbart56]

Originally Posted by Catsailor

Wow, way to bash those EVs. I have a Mach E Mustang and a F150 Lightning and I live in rural Ontario, Canada. Love both of them but I'm not likely to tow distances yet. Also have an Ice F150 Eco Boost.

Of the three my favorite is the Lightning. So before crapping on EVs go drive one

I'm sure you can defend this:

https://www.tiktok.com/@rodney_you_p...61480062553350

[jasin1]

i guess you need to have multiple EVs to always have one charged up and ready for a drive? .. i keep a few extra charged batteries for my 20 volt dewalt battery drill so i’m not forced to stop in the middle of a project..i guess the average american with two cars in the garage will need four evs???..

seems like a win for car manufacturers and also the fact that not much you can work on for yourself.Car dealers make more money servicing then they do selling car..of course evs are less maintenance but if everyone has to bring back their ev to the dealer then over time it’s the dealer who makes out.

As texans said i wouldn’t mind a hybrid one day instead of a full EV and i imagine the HD trucks will one day see a hybrid with the engine helping for steep grades and the batteries for coasting along flat roads

for now you buy two Lightning’s and a flatbed trailer with a generator…tow one while charging the other then pull over and switch out trucks for a cross country trip..or you don’t actually own the car for a cross country trip…you rent and change cars in every town..like the pony express riders switched to fresh horses..that sounds like a logistical nightmare

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by sourdough

Not interested in an argument but also not interested in re-hearing the industry/political talking points about EVs. Talking points are that, real life is real life. You have EVs and are happy - good. As you said, you aren't towing anything with them....and can't. We each have our preferences and if yours is an EV fine, if others don't like them and say so it's not bashing - it's an opinion...just as yours is. And yes, I've driven an EV and they would be good for going to the corner grocery.

Well do not I like that EV are being forced on us in the US, no not at all. That said EV have their place. Great city cars, make for cleaner air, but the jury is still out on the effects of producing the rare earth metals needed to make them.
The other issue is climate control inside the vehicle. Heat is a byproduct of an ICE engine, and cooling only has a small effect on mileage. With an EV they need to be managed carefully as they have a bigger effect on range.
They are not ready for prime time towing that is for sure currently.

Originally Posted by notanlines

“ There are way more places to charge an EV than gas stations.”
I’m fairly confident this article is referring to all duplex receptacles in the area. The city of Okeechobee has about four recharging stations. Your guess as to how many gas stations…..35 maybe?

Well this may be true, as there are charging stations in grocery store parking lots, and business parking lots. The big difference is that an EV needs at least an hour at a class 2 charging station to get to about an 80% charge, here with an ICE vehicle about max 5 minutes to go from empty to full fuel tank. so far more needed to cover use.

[JRTJH]

EV's are a "solution for some applications" and EV's "FAIL miserably in other applications"...

If you are "one of those for whom they work" then an EV is a suitable alternative...

On the other hand, if you are "one of those for whom they do not work" then an EV is a "total failure"....

So, to say they are "the way of the future" with current technology and the rising problem of what to do with waste from them (yes, Dorothy, there is waste to deal with even "down that rabbit hole") there are lots of things that have not yet been "fixed by the mandates to convert to EV's"....

I passed an EV USPS delivery truck yesterday, about a mile from our house. It was sitting on the side of the road, about 2 blocks from the post office. No, we didn't get our mail yesterday..... Was there a connection ???? Yep, you can't even deliver mail 10 miles from the post office if the battery is dead.....

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by Badbart56

I'm sure you can defend this:

https://www.tiktok.com/@rodney_you_p...61480062553350

Advocates talk about fabricated information. This lady talks about reality. It's known that EVs aren't "green" that's simply a ruse, they're a way to harm oil companies. Her other comments are also right on point. The lack of charging stations is just a fact, they're nowhere to be found in our neck of the woods either here in FL or back home in TX. They probably have some in Tallahassee but I'm not going up there and sit in some dark corner parking lot for 2 hours to charge a car. I also saw 4 in front of a hotel in Apalachicola - way in the back corner of town far from the highway - you would never find it. In all the times I've been there I've seen 1 vehicle parked there.

To your point, the facts pointed out in the video can't be defended by EV advocates but that's not the point - you're not supposed to ask.....

[dutchmensport]

In a lot of ways, these discussions about EV's really irritate me. And in another way, they are quite entertaining. I personally do not like the "push" for EV's. But with any new "marketing" I suppose "they" have to in order to boost sales.

Suffice to say, EV's work good for those who use their vehicles for "local" travel. And then there are those who travel cross-country and for towing a trailer or toad. For those folks, EV's simply do not cut the mustard. That is a proven fact, otherwise EV manufacturers would not be try so hard to convince a gullible public that EV's are the next best thing since sliced bread!

I always though of EV's as nothing but a glorified golf cart! On a golf course or in a campground a golf cart can come in real handy. But not everyone at the golf course and not everyone at the campground has a golf cart, nor do they want one. So, those who do not have a golf cart simply let those who do have them pass on by. Meanwhile, those who do not have one will simply jump in their gas or diesel vehicle and do what has to be done! Simple.

As long as fossil fuel is still available and as long as fossil fuel vehicles are still being manufactured that are capable of towing a 15,000 pound trailer 300-400 miles between fuel stops is no threat. We can share the road together wherever we meet. When the day comes that fossil fuel service stations close up ... or the day arrives when no dealership no longer has a fossil fuel operated vehicle for sale ... THAT is the day things will explode.

The real question about EV's is ... who's making the money off of them? And THAT would explain why they are being "pushed" on everyone! Think about that!

[notanlines]

Quote:
Originally Posted by notanlines View Post
“ There are way more places to charge an EV than gas stations.”
I’m fairly confident this article is referring to all duplex receptacles in the area. The city of Okeechobee has about four recharging stations. Your guess as to how many gas stations…..35 maybe?
Well this may be true, as there are charging stations in grocery store parking lots, and business parking lots. The big difference is that an EV needs at least an hour at a class 2 charging station to get to about an 80% charge, here with an ICE vehicle about max 5 minutes to go from empty to full fuel tank. so far more needed to cover use."

Russ, you may have misread my post. The article stated that there were more charging stations than gas stations. I believe that can only be true if one were to take into account all the duplex receptacles in the entire area, homes included. Okeechobee has maybe 6500 people, and a total of 16 actual charging nozzles/connections. In the 35 gas stations we have maybe 250 fueling nozzles. You are correct when you say more are needed. Far more stations and far, far more parking space when they do stop to recharge.

[dutchmensport]

OK, I'm being a brat here... but ... I can't wait for the next power grid failure!

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by dutchmensport

OK, I'm being a brat here... but ... I can't wait for the next power grid failure!

You don't need to wait long.... On the news last night, they were talking about the flooding in southern California and said, if I heard it correctly, that 30,000 homes were without power..... Maybe not a "grid caused failure" but certainly for those home owners, they still can't plug in their EV, or cook with an electric stove or heat their home with "grid power"....

With the grid in most areas "working at capacity" there's just not enough available energy to provide for current requirements and certainly not enough energy to provide for the "future growth demands" when every one of those homes has one or two EV's rather than one or two ICE vehicles.....

Of course, the "talking points" are "here and now centered" not "concerned with the future".....

There's WAAAAAAAY too many consequences caused by the conversion that have not yet been worked out. What scares hell out of me, is there is a "common belief among those in charge" that goes somewhat along the lines of Alfred E Newman: "What, me worry?"...... They keep telling us that technology will develop fast enough to fix those "minor issues" before they become a problem.....

My question is: What if "technology don't" ???

[sourdough]

^^^Intelligent people have a complete plan in place then execute. Those that aren't just go do whatever and figure they'll figure out things further down the line when there is no answer at the moment - they call those folks (or plans) failures - seen it many times.

[wiredgeorge]

Originally Posted by notanlines

“ There are way more places to charge an EV than gas stations.”
I’m fairly confident this article is referring to all duplex receptacles in the area. The city of Okeechobee has about four recharging stations. Your guess as to how many gas stations…..35 maybe?

Mico doesn't have a single charging station but then again, there are no filling stations either.

As with all topics, them that loves 'em loves 'em; thems that don't won't. Guy loves his EV fleet; God bless him. Go forth and be happy and never stop and think about how the electricity used to charge them is generated (from what source) or where those big non-eco friendly batteries will go when they are dead nor where the chemicals come from and how they are mined used to make the batteries. To each his own.

[colby]

In this thread, I keep seeing that EVs are being pushed onto the masses. I know that we have a nation-wide mandate in Canada (https://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/canada-...26-1.6203478); however, with the exception of a few areas in the US (like California and the US Government), I can't find any mandates that dictate a timeframe for the requirement to only sell EVs. As per https://econsultsolutions.com/us-ev-...gulation-2022/, there are lots of states that are pushing incentives; however, if someone has links to US-based mandates for EV sales, that would be great.

[Kirk's Keystone Outback.]

I also did find this thread very entertaining, and slightly educating. I own 3 pickup trucks and 2 trailers, and cannot ever see myself driving a battery to do what my trucks can do. Thanks to all the contributors on this one!!!

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by colby

In this thread, I keep seeing that EVs are being pushed onto the masses. I know that we have a nation-wide mandate in Canada (https://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/canada-...26-1.6203478); however, with the exception of a few areas in the US (like California and the US Government), I can't find any mandates that dictate a timeframe for the requirement to only sell EVs. As per https://econsultsolutions.com/us-ev-...gulation-2022/, there are lots of states that are pushing incentives; however, if someone has links to US-based mandates for EV sales, that would be great.

EVs are being pushed onto the masses....and forced. Some states have mandated the elimination of gas powered vehicles, some some percentage etc. Biden has decreed the elimination of gas powered vehicles in various statements and orders. Here's a clip of one report, Motor Trend 8/5/21:

"President Joseph R. Biden today signed an executive order declaring that up to half of all new cars sold by 2030 must be electric. Take a moment to spit out your coffee, do a double-take, or engage in whatever expression of surprise suits you."

These decrees, coupled with actions taken to eliminate fossil fuels, are directly aimed at forcing EVs on the masses.

EVs are an interesting discussion. I have some very strong feelings about them and how/why they are being forced. The reasons are both ideological and political....very political. Please keep that in mind as these discussions occur because the topic can veer very quickly.