Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Keystone RV Forums > Welcome to KeystoneForums.com! > New Member Check in!
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 04-08-2022, 01:13 PM   #1
Tom-67X
Member
 
Tom-67X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Suburbia Phx
Posts: 56
Howdy from AZ

New 5th wheel owner here- well, will be this week! We'll be taking delivery on the '22 Arcadia 3250RL, PDI is Thursday.

Coming from a Grand Design 21BHE, we learned a bit over the last year and a half, and with some extra encouraging from many friends in the club, we are jumping to 5th wheel. We were set on GD again, but after several weeks, and dozens of models looked at from all brands, we kept coming back to that Arcadia and just couldn't shake it. It must be ordained or something. It's the most intrigued my wife and I have been with a model and floorplan in our short run as RV owners so far.

I'm the classic lurker and knowledge sucker, but occasionally I've been known to post a question and join in on some congratulatory or helpful posts. It's not that I'm shy...I'm just still trying to learn SO MUCH! (solar...)

So with that, here I am!
Tom-67X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2022, 02:32 PM   #2
jsb5717
Senior Member
 
jsb5717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Posts: 1,389
Welcome aboard! The Arcadia is pretty new to the Keystone lineup and, from what I've seen online, is pretty nicely appointed. So congrats on the new purchase. Take your time with that PDI.

Also, some of the first advice you'll get here is to make sure you've got a properly rated truck to pull it with. With a loaded pin weight of approx. 2400 lbs you'll need a decent payload to carry that, plus people and everything else you'll be carrying. Good luck and stay safe.
__________________
Jeff & Sandi (and Teddy - 7lb Schnorkie)
2018 Montana High Country 305RL
2015 RAM 3500 Crew Cab 4x4 DRW
Demco Recon Hitch on RAM Puck Ball
jsb5717 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2022, 04:02 PM   #3
Gary R.
Senior Member
 
Gary R.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Oregon High Desert
Posts: 1,550
Greetings and welcome!

Congrats on your new Arcadia! Very nice and lots of room.

Have fun and take care!
__________________
Gary & Deb (44 years)
RV: Keystone 2013 Alpine 3495FL
TV: 2014 RAM 3500HD Laramie Long Box, 6.4 HEMI, 4x4, 4.10's, with Mopar Puck system, and a B&W Companion hitch.
Retired Firefighter/EMT.
Gary R. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2022, 04:50 PM   #4
travelin texans
Senior Member
 
travelin texans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Picacho, Az
Posts: 6,809
Welcome aboard!
I'd agree with Jeff in post #2!
You're going from a 6400lb TT with approx. 700-800lb tongue weight to a 11850lb 5th wheel with 2300-2700lb pin weight.
__________________
Full-timed 10+ years
Sold '13 Redwood FB
Traded '13 GMC Denali DRW D/A
Replacement undetermined
travelin texans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2022, 04:52 PM   #5
Tom-67X
Member
 
Tom-67X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Suburbia Phx
Posts: 56
Thanks all- we're pulling with a '17 F250 6.7 so yeah- we got plenty!
__________________
2022 Arcadia 3250RL
2017 F250 SD SC FX4
Arizona Native
Tom-67X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2022, 06:25 PM   #6
sourdough
Site Team
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 17,601
There is a misconception that a diesel 3/4 ton can tow any RV...that is dangerously wrong. Look at the sticker inside the drive door for your payload; is it 2500 or less? The truck isn't up to that large of a trailer. With a gvw of 11,800 at 22% pin weight you're looking at 2607 pin weight only. I suspect that will max your payload completely.

Look at that sticker, in addition to the estimated pin weight above add all the folks, toys, pets, tools, bbq, equip. etc. and I figure you will be well above the weight your truck is legally allowed to "carry", not "pull".
__________________
Danny and Susan, wife of 56 years
2019 Ram 3500 Laramie CC SWB SB 6.4 4x4 4.10
2020 Montana High Country 331RL
sourdough is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 05:16 AM   #7
German Shepherd Guy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Norwood, CO
Posts: 667
Welcome Tom.
Great place with lots of good advice.
Nice looking Rv. Very airy and lots of windows! I can see why you two liked it.


My first thought though was the same as Danny's. Be sure to check your door sticker. Do not use the specs listed on the Ford media site for your year. You will notice the MANY disclaimers after they show the carrying capacity. Your door sticker is the specific for that individual vehicle. Yes it will pull it easily. But I worry about will it "carry" it safely.



Good luck, lot's of adventure in store.
__________________

German Shepherd Guy

2018 Keystone 26RBPR
2014 Suburban 2500, 6L with 3.73 rear

German Shepherd Guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 05:21 AM   #8
Tom-67X
Member
 
Tom-67X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Suburbia Phx
Posts: 56
Thanks for that, but I'm sure we are good.

So the model I chose (Arcadia 3250RL) is what they call "1/2 ton towable", not that I would necessarily with a 1/2 ton. It's got a stated pin weight of 1655 and an unloaded weight of 8920 (UVW), so I figure pretty close to it.

My truck has the 10K GVWR option and even has Timbren suspension helpers. Even at the lowest published trailer weight rating, we have excess to spare- all according to Ford specs/sticker.

I should note the GCWR is not on the sticker, but the GAWR rear is and at 6340#.
__________________
2022 Arcadia 3250RL
2017 F250 SD SC FX4
Arizona Native
Tom-67X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 05:23 AM   #9
dutchmensport
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,666
Welcome to the forums and congrats on your new Arcadia!
__________________
2019 Montana High Country 375FL
2014 Chevy Duramax HD 6.6 - 3500 Diesel Dully Long bed Crew Cab
dutchmensport is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 05:45 AM   #10
wiredgeorge
Senior Member
 
wiredgeorge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom-67X View Post
Thanks for that, but I'm sure we are good.

So the model I chose (Arcadia 3250RL) is what they call "1/2 ton towable", not that I would necessarily with a 1/2 ton. It's got a stated pin weight of 1655 and an unloaded weight of 8920 (UVW), so I figure pretty close to it.

My truck has the 10K GVWR option and even has Timbren suspension helpers. Even at the lowest published trailer weight rating, we have excess to spare- all according to Ford specs/sticker.

I should note the GCWR is not on the sticker, but the GAWR rear is and at 6340#.
The standing joke around this forum is the term "half ton towable". The pin weight spec you cited is for the camper as it came off the assembly line and not as it will be delivered. Options, propane, batteries and the stuff you put in it to camp will have the pin weight north of 2500 lbs. The ONLY way you can telll if your truck is up to this is to look in the door frame at the yellow/white placard that tells you the actual PAYLOAD capacity for your particular truck. Many folks have been bamboozled by the specs on some manufacturer's advertising. Check your payload. Pin will be 2500 lbs, passengers, stuff in truck, hitch, etc. will have your payload at well over 3000 lbs. Check your payload placard.
__________________
wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
wiredgeorge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 06:46 AM   #11
flybouy
Site Team
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom-67X View Post
Thanks for that, but I'm sure we are good.

So the model I chose (Arcadia 3250RL) is what they call "1/2 ton towable", not that I would necessarily with a 1/2 ton. It's got a stated pin weight of 1655 and an unloaded weight of 8920 (UVW), so I figure pretty close to it.

My truck has the 10K GVWR option and even has Timbren suspension helpers. Even at the lowest published trailer weight rating, we have excess to spare- all according to Ford specs/sticker.

I should note the GCWR is not on the sticker, but the GAWR rear is and at 6340#.
Welcome to the forum. I seriously doubt the you are "sure we are all good". I totally beleive that you are convinced given the information you have and therein lies the trap that so many fall into. I won't go into it all for 1000 th time but I'd strongly urge you to do 2 things. First, do some reading here and other forums or websites that deal with real world towing. Don’t rely on the patronizing folks on some FB group.

Second and most importantly, If you want the truth then seek the truth. In this case the tructh can only be found at a scale. It's very simple, weight the truck with everything in it including the hitch just the way you would load it to go camping. If you "cheat" and leave things out to make the numbers work then you are only lying to yourself. Now take that scaled weight and subtract it from the listed truck GVWR. What ever number you end up with is YOUR truck's available payload. Now you have the truth.

The only way to find the truth regarding the trailers weight is to repeat the process with the trailer, also completly loaded for a camping trip. Cat scale has an app and easy-to-use directions at catscale.com. I will give you a warning. Be prepared to learn that several salesman and companies have decieved if not outright lied to you. The folks here are all concerned for your well being and most have been through this same process with the same results.
__________________
Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
flybouy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 09:20 AM   #12
Tom-67X
Member
 
Tom-67X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Suburbia Phx
Posts: 56
Wow- appreciate all the advice!! I’m not so proud as to think I can’t learn or even be corrected and I will take in all the advice shared!!! Hell, I almost look forward to being wrong so that I move away from it as quickly as possible.

I mean, I am still learning, and intend that I never STOP learning! My hat’s off fellas- I’ll do my due diligence for sure!
__________________
2022 Arcadia 3250RL
2017 F250 SD SC FX4
Arizona Native
Tom-67X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 09:31 AM   #13
wiredgeorge
Senior Member
 
wiredgeorge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,395
A start to get an idea of where you are regarding payload is to actually look at the sticker shown below and let us know what your payload actually is. This is the payload placard in your driver door frame:
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	payload_sticker.jpg
Views:	63
Size:	138.5 KB
ID:	39176  
__________________
wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
wiredgeorge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 11:35 AM   #14
Tom-67X
Member
 
Tom-67X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Suburbia Phx
Posts: 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiredgeorge View Post
A start to get an idea of where you are regarding payload is to actually look at the sticker shown below and let us know what your payload actually is. This is the payload placard in your driver door frame:
Mine's 2406.
__________________
2022 Arcadia 3250RL
2017 F250 SD SC FX4
Arizona Native
Tom-67X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 02:39 PM   #15
wiredgeorge
Senior Member
 
wiredgeorge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,395
You can only know specifically and accurately how much your pin weight is by use of scales. If you don't have the camper yet, then the way to estimate is to take the empty weight of the trailer and add to the carrying capacity then multiply by 23 percent to give you a very good idea what your pin weight is. Based on those parameters, your pin weight will be just north of 2700 lbs.

Add 2700 pounds payload then add weight of passengers in your tow vehicle and the weight of the hitch and the other stuff you have added to your truck (gear/accessories). This number will be north of 600 lbs and when you add that to the 2700 lbs of the 5th wheel, you ae roughly 3300 lbs payload on a truck rated for just over 2400 lbs payload Like I said, this is an estimate but you are very likely about a half ton overloaded. You should be pulling this HALF TON TOWABLE with a one ton truck. Just want to point this out for safety sake and in the event of an accident there could be some liability. It is a great looking camper!
__________________
wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
wiredgeorge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2022, 09:48 PM   #16
travelin texans
Senior Member
 
travelin texans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Picacho, Az
Posts: 6,809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom-67X View Post
Mine's 2406.
With the 11850lb GVWR of that 5er the pin weight will be up to as much as 2700lbs + 100-200lbs for hitch + everyone/everything in/on that truck since it left the factory = overloaded 3/4 ton truck with a 2406lb payload.
The dry/shipping weight on that or any rv mean nothing to the buyer, you'll NEVER tow it anywhere near that weight once it's arrived at the dealer. The other useless number is your truck's "max tow rating", the payload will be exceeded long before towing that weight.
As George mentioned the "1/2 ton towable 5th wheel" is a cutesy sales gimmick, most are beyond 3/4 towable due to pin weights.
Artic, 4 season, Polar are in the same gimmicky category to sell rvs.
Not wanting to rain on your parade, just passing on accurate information for your safety as well as those sharing the highways.
__________________
Full-timed 10+ years
Sold '13 Redwood FB
Traded '13 GMC Denali DRW D/A
Replacement undetermined
travelin texans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2022, 07:43 AM   #17
Tom-67X
Member
 
Tom-67X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Suburbia Phx
Posts: 56
All advice graciously accepted gents-

Agree that "1/2 ton towable" is a bit laughable in the 5th wheel category- even a novice like myself can see that...it's also crazy apparent that many/most rigs I see going down the road are probably 'overweight' by the standards described above.

__________________
2022 Arcadia 3250RL
2017 F250 SD SC FX4
Arizona Native
Tom-67X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2022, 08:40 AM   #18
sourdough
Site Team
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 17,601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom-67X View Post
All advice graciously accepted gents-

Agree that "1/2 ton towable" is a bit laughable in the 5th wheel category- even a novice like myself can see that...it's also crazy apparent that many/most rigs I see going down the road are probably 'overweight' by the standards described above.


You are right, lots of folks towing out there that are overweight, some grossly overweight. As we have discussed many times, some tow that way due to ignorance, some due to the "I don't care factor" (about their, their family's or others safety) some because once they found out they couldn't do anything about it and try to leave everything at home trying to be as little overweight as possible.

One of the primary drivers are the sales people - truck and RV along with the manufacturers. "1/2 ton towable" and other misleading nomenclatures are also used to confuse buyers with no cares about what kind of lurch the buyer is being left in.

One thing we try to provide on this forum is knowledge and awareness of weights. Raising awareness doesn't do much good if the recipient(s) refuse to do anything with the new knowledge....and some don't for one reason or another. For me, a guy that fell into the "it's no big deal" group (sort of) years ago, finally let the message sink in and I became very focused on upgrading what needed to be upgraded (several times) to maintain safe towing weights. It has removed a HUGE burden from my shoulders that I carried every time I hooked up and took off with my wife.

Another note for those that think "I'll get by and cut corners", "lots of other folks do it so I will too", "I can cheat karma" etc. -

Grew up with a cousin that always seemed to obtain things I couldn't. Lie, cheat, steal, cut corners; it didn't matter to him and he seemed to always come out on top and it sort of made me jealous. Went to see him one year in a city where he had become the pastor of a large church. Beautiful house, shiny new red Buick convertible etc. He was always a salesman so I asked how he became a preacher. He just grinned and said it was the easiest sales job he ever had and they paid him very well for it. I'm a religious guy and believe in reaping what you sow. That floored me and I just shook my head and left. Told DW "what goes round comes around" and never saw him again. Got a call one day from his sister. He had moved on from the church and had owned an insurance business with several locations - very successful. He was dead. On his way to work in his smaller commuter car and a lady in a dually dropped a CD, bent over to retrieve it and hit him head on. What does that have to do with anything? He spent years lying, cheating and ignoring the right thing. His ledger got filled and he used up the "breaks" he was allowed because he just wouldn't try to do the right thing. We've all seen those stories; "how did that happen"? He had everything going for him and then this unforeseeable tragedy?

Sorry for the long post but weights are important as is knowledge. Knowledge, once in our grasp, needs to be acted upon and used. If not, there's karma. One may seemingly skate by forever cheating her but karma is there and she WILL "come round" in the most unexpected way. Safe travels to you and yours.
__________________
Danny and Susan, wife of 56 years
2019 Ram 3500 Laramie CC SWB SB 6.4 4x4 4.10
2020 Montana High Country 331RL
sourdough is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2022, 03:40 AM   #19
spicercars
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Saginaw Mn
Posts: 1,716
Welcome from northern MN.
__________________
2012 Keystone Retreat 39 FDEN
99 Dodge One Ton Diesel Dually
spicercars is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2022, 07:53 AM   #20
SD Kitty
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Salem
Posts: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by sourdough View Post
You are right, lots of folks towing out there that are overweight, some grossly overweight. As we have discussed many times, some tow that way due to ignorance, some due to the "I don't care factor" (about their, their family's or others safety) some because once they found out they couldn't do anything about it and try to leave everything at home trying to be as little overweight as possible.

One of the primary drivers are the sales people - truck and RV along with the manufacturers. "1/2 ton towable" and other misleading nomenclatures are also used to confuse buyers with no cares about what kind of lurch the buyer is being left in.

One thing we try to provide on this forum is knowledge and awareness of weights. Raising awareness doesn't do much good if the recipient(s) refuse to do anything with the new knowledge....and some don't for one reason or another. For me, a guy that fell into the "it's no big deal" group (sort of) years ago, finally let the message sink in and I became very focused on upgrading what needed to be upgraded (several times) to maintain safe towing weights. It has removed a HUGE burden from my shoulders that I carried every time I hooked up and took off with my wife.

Another note for those that think "I'll get by and cut corners", "lots of other folks do it so I will too", "I can cheat karma" etc. -

Grew up with a cousin that always seemed to obtain things I couldn't. Lie, cheat, steal, cut corners; it didn't matter to him and he seemed to always come out on top and it sort of made me jealous. Went to see him one year in a city where he had become the pastor of a large church. Beautiful house, shiny new red Buick convertible etc. He was always a salesman so I asked how he became a preacher. He just grinned and said it was the easiest sales job he ever had and they paid him very well for it. I'm a religious guy and believe in reaping what you sow. That floored me and I just shook my head and left. Told DW "what goes round comes around" and never saw him again. Got a call one day from his sister. He had moved on from the church and had owned an insurance business with several locations - very successful. He was dead. On his way to work in his smaller commuter car and a lady in a dually dropped a CD, bent over to retrieve it and hit him head on. What does that have to do with anything? He spent years lying, cheating and ignoring the right thing. His ledger got filled and he used up the "breaks" he was allowed because he just wouldn't try to do the right thing. We've all seen those stories; "how did that happen"? He had everything going for him and then this unforeseeable tragedy?

Sorry for the long post but weights are important as is knowledge. Knowledge, once in our grasp, needs to be acted upon and used. If not, there's karma. One may seemingly skate by forever cheating her but karma is there and she WILL "come round" in the most unexpected way. Safe travels to you and yours.
You make a great point - do the right thing!

I raised two boys using this mantra. They sometimes complained about others getting away with something and my reply was “Life will take care of it” ie..Karma. They didn’t have to correct others egregious actions. I really do believe this.

Thanks for a interesting post 😎
SD Kitty is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates in any way. Keystone RV® is a registered trademark of the Keystone RV Company.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:54 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.