Lippert 6 Point Hyd Level Up 12 Volt Troubleshooting Info

ChuckS · 01-01-2021, 12:28 PM

If you are having issues with your Lippert 6 Point hydraulic leveling system and its out of warranty the following 3 files are my attempt at what and how to troubleshoot the 12 volt DC control system...

My findings are based off my 2014 Alpine unit .. the exact location on your Keystone RV with regards to the solenoids for the mid/rear level up solenoids and pressure switch may differ slightly from my PDFs but they are in the system and if the don't work right you will have issues..

The Front LG Hydac solenoid will be on one LG only and can be on left or right side depending on your unit

If you are having issues with a leveler leg or LG creeping down you could have issues with the Hydac valve not closing and opening properly, manual override screw not fully CW, or an internal or external leak

I've attempted to trace and identify the overall layout of the system and on my unit this PDF is accurate.

Lippert Tech support of course is excellent for troubleshooting but I wanted to know where all the wires went, what they control, and potential test areas to check if I had issues

maybe this will be of use to another OP down the road

See following attachments (3 Parts)

texas-traveler · 01-17-2021, 11:05 AM

I also had some issues with the level up. repeated errors saying check components, hydraulics stopping before task completes, slow auto level up or retract to home, repeated time out error. hydraulic pump repeatedly stopping. system acted like bad batteries.
Found:
#1 multiple power cable terminals, bad crimps from factory. 13 out of 16 terminals crimps loose. terminals installed by keystone assembler.
#2 wrong size auto resettable circuit breaker to hydraulic pack as per lippert tech. 50 amp. cb failed. recommended 80 amp. as replacement.
#3 level drifting down, popping noise and rams noisy while moving.
#4 while off shore power level up and slides intermittent
#5 Battery bypass cable connected to hydraulic pack terminal on cb.
#6 faulty grounds to chassis at battery and dc converter

ChuckS · 01-17-2021, 11:27 AM

If you have a leveler leg drifting down then either it has an internal leak or the Hydac valve for that side isn’t closing completely..

The mid/rear levelers each are in tandem on their respective side and share ONE Hydac valve...for each side

The Frt LG are also in tandem and share ONE Hydac valve for both front LG

If the manual override screw on the Hydac valve isn’t fully CW it will allow hud holding pressure to bleed off for the leveler circuit thus allowing drifting down

texas-traveler · 01-17-2021, 12:52 PM

thanks for the reply Chuck. If drifting repeats will check into your recommendations.
i have made the recommended upgrades to the cb and added the stiction fluid (fork oil) and exercised system as recommended by lippert. also corrected faulty wiring connectors and incorrect wiring. along with identifying the unmarked inline fuses in battery/hyd compartment. So far it seems to be working better. Will probably put jack stands under frame again and exercise system again. will be awhile before we take rv out again.

texas-traveler · 01-17-2021, 12:53 PM

Very good troubleshooting information.

Old Mustanger · 09-11-2021, 06:18 PM

Rear leveler legs were creeping down so I turned the manual override screws CCW to make sure they were closed. Problem is I turned them too tight and loosened the solenoid(s) from the manifold and now I have at least one of them leaking when operating the system.

I am asking for suggestions on how to tighten these up since a regular wrench will not fit between the solenoids or between the manifold and the black plastic part of the solenoid itself.

**chuckster57** · 09-11-2021, 06:21 PM

The black plastic will come off. It is an electro magnet, just loosen the nut at the top and it will slide off.

Might want to label the wires so you don’t hook it back up wrong.

Old Mustanger · 09-11-2021, 07:21 PM

Thanks, that will help, I'm thinking I'll be able to use a socket to tighten the solenoids then?

ChuckS · 09-12-2021, 06:38 AM

If you have fluid leaking at the END of the HYDAC valve manual override screw you will NEED TO replace the Hydac valve itself..most likely…

Inside of the Hydac valve is where it is sealed and if fluid is leaking at the end of the manual override screw then only recourse it to replace the valve..

You can buy separately without the solenoid

There IS an oring that could cause a leak and you will have to unscrew the Hydac valve and inspect that oring at the base of the large nut…

Images of leak from a friend I helped with a 2021 Alpine leaking

**** NOTE.. the manual override 5/32 screw at tuned of Hydac valve should just need to be finger snug with an Allen wrench…one finger snug pull..

Last image is PN of Hydac valve only that is used on your Alpine

ChuckS · 09-12-2021, 06:45 AM

This video I created helping another Alpine owner with a Hydac valve that was sticking open causing the LG to move when he operated the slide outs also shows his endeavors he experienced when he over tightened one of the manual over ride allen screw heads....

He ordered just the Hydac cartridge and leak is no more and the LG doesnt move when he operates the hyd slide outs

At about 4:45 into this video you will see his fluid leak he had on his Hydac Valve

https://youtu.be/6p6BFcfkqg4

Old Mustanger · 09-14-2021, 06:11 PM

Thanks for the info, I got the leaks stopped by being able to tighten the valves into the manifold, but I am concerned that I probably over tightened the screws at the top of the valves and damaged them. Would this cause the landing gear to drop while traveling?

ChuckS · 09-15-2021, 05:28 AM

YEs if you over tighten the Hydac manual over ride screw and it develops a leak then the levelers or LG can creep down while towing...

SNUG CCW is all that is needed on the 5/32 override screw on the Hydac valve... If it is not leaking out of the end of the valve at the screw then quit worrying...

Old Mustanger · 09-15-2021, 10:26 AM

OK thanks for the help, I'll stop worrying about leaking since that stopped. I still have to figure out why the rear landing legs drop, I've been strapping them up on this trip and yesterday when I arrived at the RV park, the center driver's side strap had disappeared (assume it tore from the pressure) and that pad was only about 6" from the ground. I don't see any leakage at the legs, how does an internal leak show itself?

ChuckS · 09-15-2021, 12:11 PM

Since yours is an Alpine with six point hyd level up let’s clarify some items..

1. You say “Rear leveler legs” are creeping down
2. Is this both SIDES and ONLY the rear ones?
3. Are the MID levelers on BOTH sides staying fully retracted?

The reason I ask for clarification is the mid/rear leveler legs operate in TANDEM and are somewhat isolated from side to side

The RETURN hydraulic line (black in color if still OEM) does run across from the right rear leveler leg to the left rear leveler leg..

If one leveler leg has an internal leak it would normally only affect the other leveler leg on same side

Example… mid leveler leg on left side has an internal leak.. this is going to also affect the rear leveler leg on same side because they are connected in tandem

Old Mustanger · 09-15-2021, 06:54 PM

I have had both rear and mid levelers on both sides drop. but mostly on the left (driver's side) and the rear one will drop further than the mid. Now that I think on it the only time I can remember any dropping on the curb side was the other day when I had all 4 of the rear and mid legs strapped and the mid right strap had broken so that one had dropped.

Old Mustanger · 09-19-2021, 12:56 PM

maybe the latest occurrence will help diagnose what is happening. Hitched up this afternoon so we can leave early in the morning. When I put the hyd. slides in, all jacks still down, I get a hammering from the slides until I back them out about 1/2 inch. Hitched up, front landing gear down enough to level front to rear, rear and mid levelers up. Extended slides and just out of curiosity pulled them back in and still got the hammering,extended them a little to stop it and noticed the left rear jack had dropped about 6". Leaving tomorrow morning for home (3 day, 2 night trip), any ideas would be appreciated.

ChuckS · 09-19-2021, 01:10 PM

IF the hydraulic slide slides are chattering when you operate the leveler system THEN THE HYDAC valve for the slide outs IS NOT fully closing when you let go of switch for slides .

Hydac valve is Normal Closed via spring pressure on its internal poppet valve..

Here is the image from my 2014 Alpine…the three Hydac valves are from left to right..
CS mid/rear leveler legs
OS mid/rear leveler legs
Hydraulic slides.. only one Hydac for all hydraulic slide outs..

I’d also have to do an internal bypass leak check on that left rear leveler leg.. very easy to do

This link should explain how to do the internal bypass test..the hyd lines are easy to get to on the rear leveler legs

https://lci-support-doc.s3.amazonaws...cd_0001910.pdf

haulinit · 09-20-2021, 04:30 AM

Wow, you guys are awesome! I’m nowhere near as knowledgeable as you are, but have found several YouTube videos of reliable guys talking about these issues and what fixed them.

Check out Chad at changinglanesrv.com. He is really good with the maintenance and fixing things on their Grand Design toy hauler. For the popping/creep, when they had the problem he found out that if you replace a quart of the fluid in the system with a special fluid from CAT (you can also use fork oil), it will stop the popping. He also talks about the 50 amp circuit breaker being too small and the need for the 80 amp breaker.

I have both the circuit breaker and oil to do my jacks, just have to remember to do it when the trailer is hooked to the truck. I hope this helps you all out some. Here is the link to Chad and Tara’s YouTube videos: https://youtube.com/c/ChangingLanes

Shelley
Haulinit aka The Tiny McMansion

travelin texans · 09-20-2021, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haulinit

Wow, you guys are awesome! I’m nowhere near as knowledgeable as you are, but have found several YouTube videos of reliable guys talking about these issues and what fixed them.

Check out Chad at changinglanesrv.com. He is really good with the maintenance and fixing things on their Grand Design toy hauler. For the popping/creep, when they had the problem he found out that if you replace a quart of the fluid in the system with a special fluid from CAT (you can also use fork oil), it will stop the popping. He also talks about the 50 amp circuit breaker being too small and the need for the 80 amp breaker.

I have both the circuit breaker and oil to do my jacks, just have to remember to do it when the trailer is hooked to the truck. I hope this helps you all out some. Here is the link to Chad and Tara’s YouTube videos: https://youtube.com/c/ChangingLanes

Shelley
Haulinit aka The Tiny McMansion

Adding the anti stiction oil (motorcycle fork oil) to the hydraulic fluid reservoir was not Chad's idea, the factory techs did that to my '13 model back in '13 while having warranty work done at a rally.
And the increased breaker size was also done back in '13, by factory techs.
I will however agree both of those do work & if Chad (whoever he is) is spreading the word then he gets an ATTABOY!

haulinit · 09-20-2021, 03:51 PM

I couldn’t remember what the oil was called (stiction). Chad had been told about it by the techs too and was passing all the info on about both the oil and circuit breaker.

My husband wants to get some oil and put in our system and also try a circuit breaker. Reading about all the issues everyone was having sounded like this might help.

Shelley
Haulinit aka The Tiny McMansion

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