First 5th Wheel

[ewbldavis]

We purchased a 2020 Cougar half-ton 32BHS in May.

For a mid-level unit obtained in the mid 30's, we love it. Certain light-weight features not excited about, although once I realized no wood in floor I felt alot better about it.

Build quality I think is excellent. we had typical little details like black tank flush valves backwards and tub drain not tight. Everything has worked top notch, and the fit-finish seems respectable considering the train wreck the RV industry is as a whole.

We compared to a Crossroads RV product - to-wit we have owned 2 travel trailers. The Cougar is a better build. My opinion and word on street from service tech's I know, we bought a quality brand with generally little to no issues.

Your truck won't even notice the 24RDS...so you're good there!

[Roscommon48]

there are lots of 34-35 foot rvs out there to. your 2500 can pull many of these. alpine, avalance and montana.

alliance rv is also coming out with 1/2 ton 5th wheels next year also.

[wiredgeorge]

Originally Posted by Roscommon48

there are lots of 34-35 foot rvs out there to. your 2500 can pull many of these. alpine, avalance and montana.

alliance rv is also coming out with 1/2 ton 5th wheels next year also.

Never heard of this bunch as they seem to be new into the biz. They claim luxury 5th wheels which means I can't afford one but I noted on their 35' Paradigm they understated the pin weight basing it on a trailer coming off the line and not the gross weight. Seems like the disease is infecting even new manufacturers who claim they want to form an "alliance" with new and unsuspecting owners.

[JRTJH]

In "real life" one can be like that "little redhead boy that sits on the bench during recess and reads a book while the rest of the kids play. He can wind up being a mechanic or a doctor and what he did during recess won't affect the outcome.

In "RV life" a manufacturer who isn't with the crowd will likely find themselves bankrupt in a year. Not following the crowd moves a company out of the circle and most buyers are looking for "easy pickings inside the circle".... As "unsophisticated as most RV shoppers are, if there's any question about payload/pin weight, they'll almost always go with the lightest and wonder why that "newcomer is so much heavier" (honesty being the reason they didn't buy from that manufacturer) even though they don't know/understand the implications of what they're buying.....

[notanlines]

We do have a member every now and then who tries to tell members that towing a Montana with a 250/2500 is not a problem. I believe the lightest, shortest Montana packs a pin weight north of 3K when loaded. It's a good trick if you can pull it off. That's a fairly large weight behind your 3/4 ton gasser.

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

In "real life" one can be like that "little redhead boy that sits on the bench during recess and reads a book while the rest of the kids play. He can wind up being a mechanic or a doctor and what he did during recess won't affect the outcome.

In "RV life" a manufacturer who isn't with the crowd will likely find themselves bankrupt in a year. Not following the crowd moves a company out of the circle and most buyers are looking for "easy pickings inside the circle".... As "unsophisticated as most RV shoppers are, if there's any question about payload/pin weight, they'll almost always go with the lightest and wonder why that "newcomer is so much heavier" (honesty being the reason they didn't buy from that manufacturer) even though they don't know/understand the implications of what they're buying.....

It's all cultural. Ask any european driver what they think of American cars. In most countries in europe a drivers license is a coveted and revered accomplishment. It takes time and a considerable amount of money to get one.

So they will shake their heads at the poor performance (especially handling), the lack of driver's knowledge pertaining to how the car operates, and stare in wonder why in the world any vehichle needs a half a dozen cup holders. They see driving as requiring concentration and full focus and not for dining while driving.

I shake my head at the commercials that tout "lane guidance", "automatic braking" and all the gizmos to compensate for poor driving skills. It's the "dumbing down" of the public that promotes these "advances". In this state you don't even have to parallel park to take your test. Thankfully, the test is printed because they don't teach this generation to read or write in script.

[travelin texans]

Just read in another forum they were so excited about the new gas engines Ford is offering in their HD trucks & that they've upped the max tow ratings on all of the F series.
They're touting the Ford F150 V6 Eco Boost with a 14000lb tow rating & what a towing beast that'll be.
I just hope I NEVER get beside that guy in his F150 with that 14000lb 35'+ 5th wheel with a 3000lb+ pin weight barreling 70 mph down the interstate because "it's rated to tow a 14000lb trailer" &/or "the dealer said"!!!!
My comment to any truck manufacturer spouting this is

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by travelin texans

Just read in another forum they were so excited about the new gas engines Ford is offering in their HD trucks & that they've upped the max tow ratings on all of the F series.
They're touting the Ford F150 V6 Eco Boost with a 14000lb tow rating & what a towing beast that'll be.
I just hope I NEVER get beside that guy in his F150 with that 14000lb 35'+ 5th wheel with a 3000lb+ pin weight barreling 70 mph down the interstate because "it's rated to tow a 14000lb trailer" &/or "the dealer said"!!!!
My comment to any truck manufacturer spouting this is
Attachment 30065

Ahhh, but Danny you will and we know it! The driver sitting there in his bucket seat turned sideways, shooting the breeze and laughing with all the passengers while texting with his right. Thankfully his left wrist is hanging lackadaisically over the steering wheel while Steppenwolf blasts "Born to be Wild"....all at 80mph, that beast eco boost howling and the bumper about 6" off the pavement - spring packs and bump stops flattened. Yep, I can see it now....

Edit: I just saw "that guy" again Didn't realize but he figured that 1/2 ton with a 14k rating really had a secret "cushion" built in so he just upped that load to 15k..... (All said in jest under the influence of 4 cups of Folgers regular grind!!! coffee!)

[notanlines]

I believe you two missed the two fake diesel exhaust stacks coming up right behind his open sliding rear window.

[wiredgeorge]

Originally Posted by flybouy

It's all cultural. Ask any european driver what they think of American cars. In most countries in europe a drivers license is a coveted and revered accomplishment. It takes time and a considerable amount of money to get one.

So they will shake their heads at the poor performance (especially handling), the lack of driver's knowledge pertaining to how the car operates, and stare in wonder why in the world any vehichle needs a half a dozen cup holders. They see driving as requiring concentration and full focus and not for dining while driving.

I shake my head at the commercials that tout "lane guidance", "automatic braking" and all the gizmos to compensate for poor driving skills. It's the "dumbing down" of the public that promotes these "advances". In this state you don't even have to parallel park to take your test. Thankfully, the test is printed because they don't teach this generation to read or write in script.

Shoot! Them darn Euros are so far culturally superior to us poor old Yanks.... might move to Texas I guess. WAIT! I already live in the greatest place in the world. I lived, worked and traveled all over the globe for 27 years and I am pretty much convinced we are doing OK right as we are with all the fancy driving safety aids and such. I have driven in most of the countries in Europe, South America, Central America, the Mid East, parts of Asia and I can assure you, we don't drive all that bad in comparison. God bless Texas! I think I will watch European Vacation this evening after the debate to try and remember how great it is over thar!

[travelin texans]

After I commented on the other forum about the numbers being BS check out the chart they posted stating the F150 payloads if you want a good chuckle.

Talk about getting rv newbies in trouble with these numbers!!!!
My last 38' 5th wheel pin weight was 3400-3500lbs that I towed with a diesel dually. According to this chart I could've almost towed it with a F150 V6 EcoBoost if we'd of left a couple pair of shoes out.

[Northofu1]

Originally Posted by travelin texans

After I commented on the other forum about the numbers being BS check out the chart they posted stating the F150 payloads if you want a good chuckle.
Attachment 30068
Talk about getting rv newbies in trouble with these numbers!!!!
My last 38' 5th wheel pin weight was 3400-3500lbs that I towed with a diesel dually. According to this chart I could've almost towed it with a F150 V6 EcoBoost if we'd of left a couple pair of shoes out.

It's all true
https://www.trucks.com/2020/09/29/20...tm_content=ram

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by travelin texans

After I commented on the other forum about the numbers being BS check out the chart they posted stating the F150 payloads if you want a good chuckle.
Attachment 30068
Talk about getting rv newbies in trouble with these numbers!!!!
My last 38' 5th wheel pin weight was 3400-3500lbs that I towed with a diesel dually. According to this chart I could've almost towed it with a F150 V6 EcoBoost if we'd of left a couple pair of shoes out.

Where does Ford dream up these numbers?? Surely, surely they know they get folks in a bind.

[notanlines]

I think I will watch European Vacation this evening after the debate to try and remember how great it is over thar!
I think we'll just watch Christmas Vacation again and wait for the light show!

[travelin texans]

Originally Posted by Northofu1

It's all true
https://www.trucks.com/2020/09/29/20...tm_content=ram

Those numbers may be true,............to Ford, thier test trailers & their engineers that wouldn't know a rv from a loaf of bread. One thing is absolutely sure, they weren't using rvs to arrive a those overly inflated weights.
The numbers have been confusing enough to a lot of folks up to now, all these new numbers are going to do is further muddy the water.
Now the salesman will be selling 40' Mobil Suites to F150 owners, "it'll tow anything on our lot, won't know it's back there"!

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by travelin texans

After I commented on the other forum about the numbers being BS check out the chart they posted stating the F150 payloads if you want a good chuckle.
Attachment 30068
Talk about getting rv newbies in trouble with these numbers!!!!
My last 38' 5th wheel pin weight was 3400-3500lbs that I towed with a diesel dually. According to this chart I could've almost towed it with a F150 V6 EcoBoost if we'd of left a couple pair of shoes out.

Looking at those numbers you could tow a 14,000# 5er with about a 20% pin and still have 500# for passengers (2,700# pin), how crazy is that.

I read on this forum or this one some one looking at a gas f350 DRW with a tow rating of about 12,500#, how messed up is that!

[chunker]

Now back to our regularly scheduled program. Since the OP is thinking about going to a 5th wheel he/she should know the differences between and the implications they have. 5th wheels have that "cool factor" so to speak, but may not really be what they want. General statement, but most 5th wheels will gain additional storage with the basement BUT you loose a good portion of the truck bed. Stairs, more stairs to go up and down. Maybe not a factor for many but if you have knee issues, it can be. The tow different and definitely back different. You know that sticker you see on the back of a semi trailer, "this truck makes wide turns" with a picture of a car getting crunched, same with 5th wheels.

The pin weight will likely be heavier than comparable tongue weight meaning truck capacity needs to be seriously addressed.

I would avoid any trailer with lite/light/half-ton towable/etc. in the name. Lite means under built with lighter frames, more use of MDF and particle board products to achieve the lighter weight. Unless the use is just weekends to a local park to very level sites, avoid. Trying to level such a trailer will result in frame twisting meaning slides, doors, etc. will be out of square.

That said I would suggest used to make sure that is the style RV you want to use. What ever RV is chosen it's very unlikely to be the last.

Just my not so humble opinion.

[wiredgeorge]

Originally Posted by notanlines

I think I will watch European Vacation this evening after the debate to try and remember how great it is over thar!
I think we'll just watch Christmas Vacation again and wait for the light show!

Well, watched the debated and decided to go to bed as it wore my ol' tail out.

[wiredgeorge]

Originally Posted by travelin texans

Those numbers may be true,............to Ford, thier test trailers & their engineers that wouldn't know a rv from a loaf of bread. One thing is absolutely sure, they weren't using rvs to arrive a those overly inflated weights.
The numbers have been confusing enough to a lot of folks up to now, all these new numbers are going to do is further muddy the water.
Now the salesman will be selling 40' Mobil Suites to F150 owners, "it'll tow anything on our lot, won't know it's back there"!

There is an industry protocol for the testing. I believe they drag a flat trailer. Interesting article explaining how the mystery of factory tow ratings is derived:

https://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/...w-ratings.html

[JRTJH]

Here's the actual SAE 2807 standard "in all its glory". Trailer requirements are in Appendix A. Truck "selection to represent the fleet" is defined throughout the standard. Gone is the requirement to use a 150 pound driver (the standard now also requires a 150 pound passenger)...

IMHO, while the standard is closer to something every manufacturer has to use so they all are using the same test procedures, there's still lots of "wiggle room" for any manufacturer to one up the competition by reading "between the lines" of the standard and picking/choosing how to conduct the test to their own benefit.....

14,000 pound trailer behind a half ton truck ??? With a 5500 pound truck weight, that's a 19,500 GCWR.... Quite an optimistic rating for towing a trailer that outweighs the tow vehicle by 2.5 times.... Does such a vehicle/trailer combination really meet the "intended requirements" of the SAE standard or is there a "way around the actual intent by redefining/finding a loophole" ?????