Help me get balanced please

tommy_z · 04-03-2016, 01:44 PM

I finally got my rig to a CAT scale, and was I surprised how off my setup is. I'd go back to the dealer, but they're the ones who made it this way to begin with, so I'd rather try to resolve myself with your guidance.

1st weigh was truck only with fuel and all passengers: Steer 3220, Drive 3540
2nd weigh was truck & trailer WD disconnected: Steer 2680, Drive 5160, Trailer 5440
3rd weigh was truck & trailer WD connected: Steer 3240, Drive 4660, Trailer 5600

If I understand right, total trailer is 6520 but tongue is 1080.....19% ? My TW rating is 900#, so I'm over.

The drive axle rating is 4250, so I'm way over there too.

Could someone please confirm for me?

CWSWine · 04-03-2016, 02:21 PM

Not sure about what TV you have but here is your numbers in Tow Planner and if you have a 1/2 ton without HD Payload it looks like you might be over axle and GVWR. You need to check you load rating on your tires and make sure you not exceed it also. Check my numbers in tow planner and make sure there are correct.

http://towingplanner.com/ActualWeigh...&w3da=3540&a=2

tommy_z · 04-03-2016, 03:53 PM

I only changed the weigh#2 numbers to match what the scales reported.

http://towingplanner.com/ActualWeigh...&w3da=3540&a=2

Looks like I misunderstood how to compute TW%, but the TW# is higher than my 900 rating. GCWR is under my 15K capacity. GVW of 7900 is over my GVWR of 7700. And I know my rear axle is over.

So, is there hope to balance me out? TV is SWB Ford Expedition.

therink · 04-03-2016, 04:24 PM

It is my experience that 10 to 15 percent tongue weight to trailer weight is the optimal ratio for towing with a TT. You do appear to be tongue heavy. Can you shift some cargo more towards the rear of the trailer?
Where are your water and waste tanks? Were any of them filled when you scaled it?

tommy_z · 04-03-2016, 05:55 PM

My fresh tank is very near the tongue. I had 10-15 gals in during weigh, which is what I like to travel with for bathrooms breaks, etc.

I might have some front storage weight I can shift towards the back, but I don't know about 200# worth.

Even if took 200# off the nose, my rear axle would still be over I think.

Ken / Claudia · 04-03-2016, 07:56 PM

Remember that saying "we need a bigger boat". Your not listing the tow vehicles ratings and I suspect the trailer is to heavy for it.

GaryWT · 04-03-2016, 08:04 PM

After you shift a little weight out of the front of the trailer, tune you're WDH some. Tighten it some will move some weight to the front. Still not sure if you will get enough. My experience is the dealer set up the hitch for the empty trailer I was bringing home and one at home I had to tighten it one lever and tilt the ball a little.

theeyres · 04-03-2016, 08:09 PM

You can certainly take some weight off the rear truck axle and transfer it to the front axle with your weight distribution hitch. Your dealer may well have adjusted it when the trailer was empty so it will now be way off. It would be best if you learn how to adjust it yourself as you may well need to fine tune it as you go along.

Javi · 04-04-2016, 01:53 AM

As we say here in Texas, Son... you need a bigger truck

You ain't the first and you won't be the last to find yourself in this situation... head over to Covert and do some shopping

tech740 · 04-04-2016, 04:26 AM

Another thing to keep in mind is that the weight you move will act as a lever if you move it behind the axle of the trailer. If you remove 200 pounds and put it on the ground the weight goes down 200lbs. If you put that same weight in the rear of the trailer it provides a lever effect and will make the lounge even lighter. You may not need to move the full 200 to get what you need.

tommy_z · 04-04-2016, 06:20 AM

The dealer definitely set me up with a dry trailer, and zero passengers in the TV. Don't understand why they would do that. I didn't know enough at the time to ask differently.

I started looking at how to adjust the WD setup. The bars are slightly curved toward the frame now, with 3 loose links. Since I need to make a pretty significant change, is my next step to raise the ball?

Ken/Claudia: what other ratings would be helpful? My TW rating is 900# and Rear GAWR is 4250#.

Javi: I know more truck would be the easy answer, and I've been shopping. But with these numbers I'm not sure what I "need".

Javi · 04-04-2016, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tommy_z

The dealer definitely set me up with a dry trailer, and zero passengers in the TV. Don't understand why they would do that. I didn't know enough at the time to ask differently.

I started looking at how to adjust the WD setup. The bars are slightly curved toward the frame now, with 3 loose links. Since I need to make a pretty significant change, is my next step to raise the ball?

Ken/Claudia: what other ratings would be helpful? My TW rating is 900# and Rear GAWR is 4250#.

Javi: I know more truck would be the easy answer, and I've been shopping. But with these numbers I'm not sure what I "need".

See your PM

Ken / Claudia · 04-04-2016, 08:44 AM

Tommy you have been doing a good job trying to get the combo set up correctly. Many do not. What is normally used when checking vehicles wt. rating is GVWR of each vehicle. GVW of each vehicle. CGVWR of the tow vehicle. GVWR of the front axle and rear axle of tow vehicle. And going to scales to check it all out. You got most of that done. It sounds like you have TW listed as rear axle GVWR. They are not the same. All in all a couple hundred lbs over in one spot may not be a problem where as a 1,000 will. Make sure your tires are made to carry the wt. Many SUV have "P" tires for comfort. When towing you really want LT tires. Good Luck it may be OK but, do not be shocked if your not able to have all numbers below max ratings with that vehicle and trailer combo.

tommy_z · 04-04-2016, 04:17 PM

Thanks Ken. Here are the other numbers.

GVWR = 7700
GVW = 6760 (all passengers, fuel full)
CGVWR = 15000
GVWR of the front axle = 3550
GVWR of the rear axle =4250

I calculated TW of 1080 by [(combined TV axles of weigh#2) - (combined TV axles of weigh#1)]. TW rating is 900.

I can't say how grateful I am to JAVI who spent an hour on the phone with me this evening to talk through all this. Big howdy out to ya my friend!

We've concluded that if I shift some weight off the tongue, and maybe upgrade to LT tires, I'd still be a bit over but it would gain me some time until I can upgrade to a bigger TV.

theeyres · 04-04-2016, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tommy_z

The dealer definitely set me up with a dry trailer, and zero passengers in the TV. Don't understand why they would do that. I didn't know enough at the time to ask differently.

I started looking at how to adjust the WD setup. The bars are slightly curved toward the frame now, with 3 loose links. Since I need to make a pretty significant change, is my next step to raise the ball?

Ken/Claudia: what other ratings would be helpful? My TW rating is 900# and Rear GAWR is 4250#.

Javi: I know more truck would be the easy answer, and I've been shopping. But with these numbers I'm not sure what I "need".

In defense of the dealer--the only way he can set it up is with what he has: an empty trailer. You just need to get the information on how to set up your equalizing system. I don't know the brand, but all the info should be in the trailer information or you can get it on line. Most of the systems are fairly easily to understand and not difficult to do. It just takes some time and usually at least a couple times to get it right. Can't say if it is changing the ball angle, tightening chains, or adjusting bars...it all depends on your system. I wouldn't be to anxious to change the truck until you work with your current system for awhile.

tommy_z · 04-05-2016, 04:42 AM

I'm open to adjusting the WD setup, which is a ProSeries 49903. However, I'm not so sure the issues can be fixed with setup. That's what I'm trying to figure out.

The main problem I see is having too much TW. I think I can reduce it to 930, a 150# savings. I will assume most of that weight comes directly off the rear axle too, which will bring it down to ~4510. That still leaves me over on rear axle weight.

My front axle is currently right back to normal, which seems like a great thing. What would be the next best adjustment to make? My nearest scale is 1hr away, so experimental tweaks aren't easy. I'm hoping for a couple recommendations to try.

jsmith948 · 04-05-2016, 05:12 AM

Adjusting your WD setup will move some weight around, but it won't reduce the the total weight. It appears that you have to move some weight to the rear of your trailer axles. That might be hard to do with the water tank near the front of the trailer. You need to be at or under the Gross Axle Weight Rating of the steering and drive axles. The problem that arises here is that your front and rear axle weight ratings add up to more than your vehicles's Gross Weight Rating. You stated that your GVWR is 7700# - loaded TV on the scale without the trailer is 6760# - 7700-6760=940# of available payload. Seems to me that you have to get the tongue weight of your trailer down to that number. Then you can adjust the WD to get your vehicle level, then you can determine if you are over on one of the axles. I think you are looking at trading to a vehicle with a higher GVWR. Good luck.

Ken / Claudia · 04-05-2016, 10:35 AM

Tommy, It was real nice to read that another member (Javi) was willing to talk with you over the phone about your set up. I bet that phone call was worth more than any posts we can make on here. Good Luck and safe travels. Ken

TallEddie · 04-11-2016, 07:29 AM

It looks like your hitch is set up properly. The WD bars are designed to transfer some of the TW to the front end. I see from your weights, that without the bars, a lot of weight was taken off the front end, when the bars were hooked up, the weight was replaced. The owners manual of the truck will specify measurements you can take to set up the bar tension. It usually involves cutting the front end rise in half. If your front end rises 1.5 inches with the trailer attached, you should adjust the bars so that is rises only .75 inches. But based on the weights, I think they are set right.

The only way I can think to balance it out is to move stuff around in the trailer. You may be able to get the weights just under the limit. Really need a bigger truck.

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