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Old 03-20-2017, 03:40 PM   #41
Javi
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Being in Texas I use 15-40 Motorcraft, oil and filter change $95 ... oil & fuel filters $178 at my local Ford dealer.

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Old 03-20-2017, 03:47 PM   #42
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I was quoted $180 for a full synthetic Oil change on my 2016 diesel today. The every other oil change swap of both fuel filters was quoted at $285. Yes maintenance is expensive but I understand the extra capacity in towing is worth it. Those quotes were at a Ford dealer.


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I pay just shy of $100 for my oil changes and I change every 5k miles. I think I've read the diesel will go more? Also, I think it's all the little "things" that bother me the most. Having to carry/add DEF all the time (I understand the Cummins doesn't require it), fuel additives, water separators, multiple oil/fuel filters. I'm sure it's just norm for folks used to them, and would be to me after doing it a while, but it sure seems the engine has lots of "things" to keep track of. I don't want to belabor it because I imagine I'm going to get one anyway; just like to be prepared as much as possible. Thanks.
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Old 03-20-2017, 04:16 PM   #43
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I have a Ford Crewcab with a 6 3/4' bed and use a Superglide hitch. SRW and have never had a problem towing my Montana
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Old 03-20-2017, 04:20 PM   #44
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It does seem steep. Is it worth the extra $$ to go full synthetic? Unfortunately all the Ford dealers within 1.5 hours of me are part of the same ownership group. FWIW I'm going to go ahead and get some other quotes tomorrow too. According to the CARFAX the truck was always maintained at a Cadillac dealer. I can't get the service department to answer the phone so I can't tell exactly what the did when they did the "recommended service".


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Old 03-20-2017, 04:33 PM   #45
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Oil, filter, lube, and change both fuel filters in my Ram is about $325 at the dealer. Every 15,000 miles...
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Old 03-20-2017, 04:36 PM   #46
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Shortbed will give you higher payload. Not sure how much and not sure if it matters or not.


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Old 03-20-2017, 05:01 PM   #47
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sourdough,

I'm thinking your "reluctance" is more a "fear of the unknown" than an actual reluctance to diesel ownership.... Much of what you noted as "concerns about upkeep" are not really an issue. As for DEF, I haven't added any in the past 5000 miles and it's just now under 1/2 full. I'd guess you'll be looking at about 5 gallons of DEF every 10K miles or thereabouts. Fuel filters are every 20K miles, cost $58 at Amazon and take 10 minutes to change in the driveway. Oil and filter change with 15 quarts of Motorcraft 15W40 is $89 at the local Ford dealer and every 4th change is free. That is the "oil change special" which includes tire rotation.

It's my understanding that ALL current model diesel trucks use DEF. There was a year or two that Ford/GM used it and Chrysler found a way to avoid, but now, they all use it as far as I know.

The biggest issue (and I think it's just getting used to it) that I've found about diesel ownership is having to "stand in oil" at the fuel pump" and always carrying a rubber glove with you so your hands don't stink after a fillup. I solved that problem with a quick trip to Harbor Freight for a $5 box of exam gloves which lasts a couple of years and a set of WeatherTech floor mats. Of course living where there's salt and ice all winter, good floormats are a must for any vehicle, not just a diesel.

As for the "old fart step". It folds into the tail gate, the pole folds also. In 2016 and earlier models, the pole sat in a cavity on top of the tailgate, in the 2017 models, Ford fixed that and it all sits "level and out of sight". On most models, it's a $375 option, well worth it in my opinion.

Just "stepping into diesel ownership" does seem daunting, but in reality, if you read the owner's manual (what man really would, but you should) it's pretty much a "no brainer" and with today's trucks from any manufacturer, the computer reminds you of almost every maintenance action except for the car wash and waxing..... Well, maybe not quite that thorough, but almost.....
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Old 03-20-2017, 05:24 PM   #48
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Thanks all. It probably is a "fear of the unknown" as much as anything. I've worked on gas engines, rebuilt them, replaced them and been under a hood or under a vehicle working on them for decades.

All those years of dropping to the ground, contorting under the hood, trying to squeeze your arm into unreachable places....they're gone as far as I'm concerned due to reasons stated earlier. I just had a nice, long, enjoyable visit with Javi about some of those issues and my concerns. Diesels have come a long way since I drove them and with the all the computer reminders as well as the "conveniences" they build into the trucks now it's probably not as big a deal as it seems. I run about 20k a year in my truck so I'll have to calculate those costs.

John, I know I see diesel spilled all the time at a pump and I'm always trying to avoid it. I assumed it was due to negligent folks (more than most it appeared). Is that not correct? Is there something about the diesel fueling process that just "makes it spill"? Is it something that can't be avoided? I have Weather Tech in all my vehicles but my wife hates diesel smell.

I'm glad they fold the "old fart step" handle. It always just looked odd on my neighbor's truck just sticking in the air.

I do appreciate all the input and assistance. As I believe I've said.....having gone back into having an RV, and now going on the 3rd truck in a little over 2 years, DW is wondering if I've lost my mind so I'm trying to make sure I get it right or......I might have to put a light in the doghouse
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Old 03-20-2017, 05:56 PM   #49
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I knew we needed a dually to safely handle the weight of our 371 Fuzion. Kind of living on borrowed time hauling it with son in laws F-250 shortbed. Over on the hitch weight and having to use a sidewinder not to hit the cab. Bit the bullet real hard and got the dually. The 6.7 is quiet compared to the older 6.9 and 7.3 Ford diesels in the late 80's and up! My fuel mileage has been averaging 15.5 for the first 450 miles and the ride is rough but not bone jarring with the long wheelbase. 48 gallon fuel tank is nice on the long WB trucks and being this is going to be my daily driver I'm glad I live in the country. People need to analyze what they need for a tow vehicle for their needs present and what they may upgrade to later. Bumper pull ratings and payload capability when pulling a 5th wheel are two different scenario's so take time to do your homework before making an expensive mistake. Very little price difference between a 3/4 and a one ton so get what you need.
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Old 03-20-2017, 06:02 PM   #50
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I pay just shy of $100 for my oil changes and I change every 5k miles. I think I've read the diesel will go more? Also, I think it's all the little "things" that bother me the most. Having to carry/add DEF all the time (I understand the Cummins doesn't require it), fuel additives, water separators, multiple oil/fuel filters. I'm sure it's just norm for folks used to them, and would be to me after doing it a while, but it sure seems the engine has lots of "things" to keep track of. I don't want to belabor it because I imagine I'm going to get one anyway; just like to be prepared as much as possible. Thanks.
All the newer engines require the DEF fluid. A couple of years ago I had a rental Ram 2500 with the Cummins and it had the DEF fill right next to the fuel neck.
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Old 03-20-2017, 06:23 PM   #51
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...
John, I know I see diesel spilled all the time at a pump and I'm always trying to avoid it. I assumed it was due to negligent folks (more than most it appeared). Is that not correct? Is there something about the diesel fueling process that just "makes it spill"? Is it something that can't be avoided?
For the most part, diesel isn't spilled any more often than gasoline. It's just that gas evaporates, almost before it hits the ground while diesel, being a "heavy oil" doesn't evaporate, but rather just "lays there getting greasy"...

Most of it is carelessness, not paying attention, not letting the nozzle "drip freely into the filler neck" before pulling it out to replace in the pump.

Honestly, there are a couple of "very busy stations" around here that I just won't use. I've found two or three that do clean up the spills, use "oil absorbant" and keep the aprons clean. When on the road, usually the truck stop "trucker's lanes" are dirty while the automotive lanes and the RV lanes don't seem to get as much use, so the ground is cleaner.

I haven't had any "really bad experiences" refueling, but there have been more than my share of "straddling a puddle of diesel" so I didn't track it back into the truck.
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Old 03-21-2017, 05:00 AM   #52
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Maintenance costs??? How many miles do you driver per year? Oil changes are every 10k at most with the new trucks and oil. I have done oil analysis and it is still very good oil at that point. Fuel filters are every 20k miles or so. Allison uses a sin on tranny filter as well, again every 20k miles. For most people, you could do a complete service and just change everything once per year. For me, the Allison filter is $9, the fuel filter $35, the 10 qt oil change runs me about $5, I use Mystik oil, but DElvac, Rotella, and Delo are all good and about the same price. May as well change the air filter as well, so another $35. I do all of my own work so that is it. As for worrying about anything else, the diesel warranties are 100k miles, I doubt you'll be paying for any repairs anytime soon.
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Old 03-21-2017, 05:46 AM   #53
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I have an oil change every 5-7000 miles at my local Ford dealer and it runs about $118 for their Motorcraft semi synthetic oil. I do my own fuel filter change every 3rd oil change (~15,000 miles) per the owner's manual. The cost for this is 'dirt cheap' at about $50 via AMAZON and it takes all of 15 minutes in my driveway. There are some cautions with doing a Ford diesel fuel filter change - use a strap wrench and not the cast on nut and once the canister is loosened, unscrew it 3 turns and then drain. The under hood filter change amounts to flipping a couple clips, pulling two hoses loose then reversing yourself to install the new one. This entire operation is easier then a gas pickup fuel filter hidden somewhere on the frame and requiring a special tube release tool then yanking and pulling, all the while waiting for that gasoline bath.

As far as the rest of the maintenance - yep, it's more costly but you really don't need much until over 75,000 miles and if you are concerned, a Ford extended warranty works very nicely.

Towing power - Ford and Dodge work very nicely and have to assume GMs do as well but have zilch experience with the GM products.

Like I said way above, it IS what you are comfortable with but also be aware that the gasser will need to work harder but still may be the right choice if your towable isn't too big and your towing miles fairly low.
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Old 03-21-2017, 06:08 AM   #54
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John, I know I see diesel spilled all the time at a pump and I'm always trying to avoid it. I assumed it was due to negligent folks (more than most it appeared). Is that not correct? Is there something about the diesel fueling process that just "makes it spill"? Is it something that can't be avoided? I have Weather Tech in all my vehicles but my wife hates diesel smell.
I think some of it might have to do with how diesel "foams". I've accidently spilled a little a couple times trying to "fill" it more than you are supposed to and not waiting for the foam to subside.

As for the Anderson hitch mentioned awhile back, I had looked into it and yes, it does require chains. That was kind of a deal breaker for me.
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Old 03-21-2017, 09:21 AM   #55
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I think some of it might have to do with how diesel "foams". I've accidently spilled a little a couple times trying to "fill" it more than you are supposed to and not waiting for the foam to subside.

As for the Anderson hitch mentioned awhile back, I had looked into it and yes, it does require chains. That was kind of a deal breaker for me.
I know this is veering off topic but I reviewed the Andersen hitch video(s) yesterday and didn't see any chains being used. Where would they go and for what purpose? I assume some sort of breakaway insurance but 5th wheel hitches don't use them....right?
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Old 03-21-2017, 10:03 AM   #56
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Gooseneck hitches much use them. There should be connection points to the frame.

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Old 03-21-2017, 08:04 PM   #57
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My thoughts, being on my 3rd truck in 4 years.
I didn't want to spend big money on new truck and have it sit outside. My garage is deep, 28ft, so a crewcab long bed fit. Comparing CC, LB, 4x4, diesel, almost loaded, 1 ton, SRW, I found that Ford has lowest payload 3100-3400#, Chevy next 3600-3750#, and Ram the highest 4000-4200#. So check those yellow stickers on shortbeds to see if they compare similarly if you think you will go to a 5th. The diesel is a no brainer, do it. To me the Ford is a higher revving hot rod and the Cummins is a low rpm motor. If you go Ford read the owners manual about towing, severe service, and using 5W-40 synthetic oil. Cummins recommends 15W-40 regular oil unless in very cold weather. I run Shell Rotella T5 semi syn 15W-40. Drive a new diesel and engage the exhaust brake. You will love it.
Research the Andersen hitch. I "think" they have one with an offset for short beds. The one rig I looked at with an Andersen didn't have safety chains. All that said I would be happy with any of the 3 trucks if the payload capacity works for you. Add about 1,000# to the advertised pin weight.
add: East Texas is full of shortbed diesels. Look around here. I think if you do the Ram "Build & Price" you can plug in a zip code and search. Use mine: 77575.
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Old 03-22-2017, 05:40 AM   #58
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It doesn't mention that they are "required" but here they are. I thought for ball mount hitches chains were "required" period, whether on the bumper or in the bed.

http://www.andersenhitches.com/Produ...onnection.aspx

http://www.andersenhitches.com/catal...onnection.aspx

And you are correct, 5th wheel hitches don't use safety chains.
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Old 03-22-2017, 07:30 AM   #59
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It doesn't mention that they are "required" but here they are. I thought for ball mount hitches chains were "required" period, whether on the bumper or in the bed.

http://www.andersenhitches.com/Produ...onnection.aspx

http://www.andersenhitches.com/catal...onnection.aspx

And you are correct, 5th wheel hitches don't use safety chains.
The Andersen isn't a gooseneck mount, so chains are not required for most locales. Some may require chains due to not realizing the difference, like ignorantly saying every black rifle is an M16 assault rifle.

My 24K rated Andersen does not have, nor does it need chains...legally or otherwise.
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Old 03-22-2017, 07:52 AM   #60
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The Andersen isn't a gooseneck mount, so chains are not required for most locales. Some may require chains due to not realizing the difference, like ignorantly saying every black rifle is an M16 assault rifle.

My 24K rated Andersen does not have, nor does it need chains...legally or otherwise.
Ok, thanks. So after reading some questions and answers pertaining to this it seems they got it approved as a 5th wheel hitch so in most locales it doesn't require chains. It also seems that currently only Indiana "requires" chains be used with it.
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