RV Dealers Upset Over 'Pathetic Quality'

[linux3]

Most of us know this to be true.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efuS1g7GvHc&t=606s

[wiredgeorge]

Someone just posted a link to an RV Life article saying much the same thing. These dealers do expect a certain amount of return business which is in jeopardy since first time buyers are left with a bad taste in their mouth and the double whammy of being on the hook and slammed with repairs that never should have left the factory.

[notanlines]

When this was posted recently a DEALER made a comment that one unit they sold came back with over 40 repairs to be done.
Maybe his PDI tech was trained in Goshen, huh?

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by notanlines

When this was posted recently a DEALER made a comment that one unit they sold came back with over 40 repairs to be done.
Maybe his PDI tech was trained in Goshen, huh?

I noticed that same comment and asked myself, "If it left his dealership with that many problems, what did his PDI guy do other than lunch and coffee breaks?" If it came back with 40 problems, it should NEVER have left the dealership the first time.....

[Cbrez]

I don’t remember if it’s in this video or one of his others, but he talks about how dealers are offering to perform the PDI for the customer now. He chuckles as he discusses it and it’s hilarious. He not so subtly lets you know if you fall for this you deserve what you get.

[Uncoolron]

We got lucky with our 5th wheel camper that we just bought last March and took it for a cross country trip in July thru September with no issue. Will, actually the the tank level indicator is never accurate but other thank that she held up beautifully. Everything inside and out works great and nothing broke.

We love it so much we decided to get a different model either 24 RDS or the 1/2 ton series with mid- bank. But I guess we have to wait a little longer for the crazy RV issues to settle down. We could go private sale also but I like going through dealership for convenience and warranty works.

[jasin1]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEqSxk9vkXM

I saw this today…it’s kinda long but he does encourage people to get a rv inspector and choose your dealer wisely

[vampress_me]

Originally Posted by notanlines

When this was posted recently a DEALER made a comment that one unit they sold came back with over 40 repairs to be done.
Maybe his PDI tech was trained in Goshen, huh?

I’m not defending anyone here (dealers or manufacturers), but how many of the issues were new owner imposed? I’m sorry, but the shear number of new owners who have never set foot in a camper before and expect them to work exactly like a S&B home is incredible. I’m a part of the FB groups for our new camper. The number of “newbies” on there that break something/ do something that cannot done on a camper, and then blame the manufacturer makes me and others who have owned campers for a while shake our heads. Of course, I also think this will be a good reason to stay away from used units for the next few years…

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by vampress_me

I’m not defending anyone here (dealers or manufacturers), but how many of the issues were new owner imposed? I’m sorry, but the shear number of new owners who have never set foot in a camper before and expect them to work exactly like a S&B home is incredible. I’m a part of the FB groups for our new camper. The number of “newbies” on there that break something/ do something that cannot done on a camper, and then blame the manufacturer makes me and others who have owned campers for a while shake our heads. Of course, I also think this will be a good reason to stay away from used units for the next few years…

Lynette you make excellent points. I don't know that we know how many folks take possession of a new trailer, having never seen one, flip, dip, pull and pop trying to make something do something it was never designed to do....then complain.

Past winter 2 new 5ths came in to park. Both RVs had a terrible time trying to get a trailer in a back in slot....a large slot. They both had the truck all over the place and the trailer all over the different spaces. Finally in they began to hook up (5th next to me); a circus, knew nothing of hooking up, using the convenience center, had no sewer connections etc. etc. Went back and forth between trailers (on each side of the road) trying to "figure out" what's what. They CUT OFF the end of their sewer hose trying to "adapt". Went to try to help and they were happy to take the free parts I gave them to help get the connections going but had no interest in further assistance..... Tore into the furnace and pulled it out because he didn't know how to start it.... Yep, and they will get tired of it with who knows what done to it but it will be in "pristine" condition I'm sure.

[Canonman]

From this recent press release I don't think anything is going to change any time soon.
A local Forest River dealer told me that FR is producing 160 Travel Trailers a day in their Elkhart facility. I'm pretty sure Keystone is running at those types of numbers as well. How much QC can be expected at those run rates??

"THOR INDUSTRIES REVENUES UP 105.7%, GROSS PROFIT MARGIN IMPROVED BY 240 BASIS POINTS AND EARNINGS PER SHARE UP 665.1% FOR THE THIRD QUARTER OF FISCAL 2021."
"Demand for our products continues to grow at both the retail and wholesale levels. While our pace of production and shipments has accelerated, demand is so high that independent dealer inventories of THOR Industries products continue to decline while dealer sales are increasing. This increasing consumer demand has driven our order backlog to more than $14 billion at the end of the quarter and includes units that will be needed to restock depleted dealer inventories. Since a significant number of units in our backlog have already been retail sold, we currently believe the restocking cycle will extend well into calendar 2022,"
Backlogs and high demand mean almost no discounts for buyers so the profit margins will continue to stay high while QC will continue to suffer.

[Balvar24]

I hope my dealer is one of them. It'd be good for him to be able to empathize with his customers!

[dutchmensport]

We are going into our 4th year with our current Montana. After the first year of ownership and what seemed like a total rebuild of our unit, it's a great camper now! After the first year, the only problems that crept up are the ones I've introduced myself .... except for a broken slide cable once.

[bfisher003]

We bought a new 2019 Montana 3121RL 20 Year Anniversary Edition fiver in late ‘18 and are very happy with it after almost 40,000 miles of towing it. We had several initial warranty issues with it, including a new rear axle, but Keystone stepped up and resolved everything to our satisfaction. Only problem since then was our High Pointe microwave/convection oven died earlier this year and after a appliance repair place evaluated it we replaced it with a Whirlpool microwave. I do keep up with minor problems as they come up and do regular preventative maintenance.

[Badbart56]

After I retired from law enforcement in 2011 I had a traveling bug and was offered a job delivering RV's. It sounded lucrative at the time and I already had a one ton dually so off I went, hauling from Elkhart to all points south. I learned a lot about the industry from the company I drove for along with former RV sales company owners.

The first thing I learned was that the goal of the dealership is to hit Keystone, a term used to describe what basically amounts to doubling the price they pay for each unit. Yeah, I was shocked to learn that the markup was that high.

I hauled exclusively for Heartland and this was during the time that Camping World was buying up all the mom and pop dealers across the nation. I watched service personnel walk off their jobs on a Friday at one dealer after being promised a better rate of pay only to get their paychecks that morning and find that not to be true.

I watched the service department at each location check in the RV I delivered, some going over it with a fine toothed comb, some telling me to drop it in the lot. Amazingly, some found upwards of 30 "issues" worth notating on the PDI.

I have hauled some back to the plant after Heartland determined that they had issues that could only be resolved by an engineering crew there. One in particular had caught fire. I asked the guy that checked me in what became of these rejects and was told that they would disassemble these units and rebuild them. I said, and then what? He said that they would make someone an incredible deal on it!

So if you're in the market for an RV, understand that the MSRP is double what the dealer paid for it. Although that's not likely to help you since Camping World has monopolized the market now and if you don't buy it someone else will.

Heartland was building 35 fifth wheels a day and 35 bumper pulls a day back then. I'm sure they're well above that figure today.

[Uncoolron]

I think what helps the explosion of RV sales are the influencers also. I’ve been researching RV camping for about 4 years and watching YouTube channel about RVing or camping and I noticed that during the pandemic all their views have gone up.

Most of them glamorizing the RV life and camping so people that have no clue are convinced to try it. But amazingly with the abundance of readily available information out there, many buyers are still too lazy to research. So most of them buy them having high expectations.

Funny story is, most of my friends that say they like to try RVing too so they ask for tips about RV camping. First thing I tell them is yes it’s a lot of fun but it’s also a lot of work. I tell them about the travel day prep and setting up process and they all say, oh that’s a lot of work. Then I tell them about good driving speed of 60 to 65MPH and planning every gas stop and every camp site and they all say, that’s a lot of work.

So once they get a little educated they start getting discouraged and very few of them are actually wants to give it a try.

I wish more potential RV buyers will do their due diligence to research properly before buying. As the old saying say, “knowledge is power”.

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by Uncoolron

I think what helps the explosion of RV sales are the influencers also. I’ve been researching RV camping for about 4 years and watching YouTube channel about RVing or camping and I noticed that during the pandemic all their views have gone up.

Most of them glamorizing the RV life and camping so people that have no clue are convinced to try it. But amazingly with the abundance of readily available information out there, many buyers are still too lazy to research. So most of them buy them having high expectations.

Funny story is, most of my friends that say they like to try RVing too so they ask for tips about RV camping. First thing I tell them is yes it’s a lot of fun but it’s also a lot of work. I tell them about the travel day prep and setting up process and they all say, oh that’s a lot of work. Then I tell them about good driving speed of 60 to 65MPH and planning every gas stop and every camp site and they all say, that’s a lot of work.

So once they get a little educated they start getting discouraged and very few of them are actually wants to give it a try.

I wish more potential RV buyers will do their due diligence to research properly before buying. As the old saying say, “knowledge is power”.

Years of boating taught me that there are people that LOVE boating, ON SOMEONE ELSE'S BOAT. No work, no expense, just fun! When it comes time to visit the fuel dock, or clean and wax the boat, well good luck finding those "freinds".

Now, many folks with that image of camping by the lake, 500 watts of lights blazing, campfire roaring and wildlife peacefully looking on. When folks ask me about "camping" I suggest they rent a cabin or trailer in a campground first. Find out if "it fits your family" and if it meeys your expectations before taking the financial "leap". Very rarely will it be like the idyllic ads, at least not close to most large metropolitan areas. Then don’t close that calculatorr app when looking at the cost of an RV. Just like boats, the cost to get into it is just the start.

[wiredgeorge]

Ever notice that most exercise equipment ends up in the garage until the owner gets sick enough of this stuff eating garage space and then it is in a garage sale or donated to Goodwill, etc.? With the pandemic, folks looked to recreational activities that they hadn't in the past and RVing is and was glamorized on the television. The person(s) get the bug and run to a dealer expecting the same level of quality as if they went to a new car dealer. They buy their camprer and the small things and big things they find are causes to come to brand forums, like this one, and vent.

Others will go out once or twice and after getting their hands dirty setting up and taking down and trying to figure things out, well.... they have a very expensive exercise equipment that will sit in their drive until they get sick of looking at it and will sell at a loss due depreciation being so far upside down on their note. In a few years, the market will cool as life hopefully gets back to normalcy and there just might be a glut of campers and heavy duty trucks; of which I still won't be able to afford (or don't want to shell out the cash). Is quality bad right now; probably somewhat with a dose of newbie inability to fix small things.

[notanlines]

We followed a few shows on Travel Channel of a couple with a small child who travel, roughing it, all over Canada and US. Also watched the episode on the Liard Highway, and camping beside it. We left 97 and took 77 and 7 to the town of Liard four years ago (Just so we could say we had been in NWT)
It was NOT a pleasant 120 miles, and the mosquitos could stand flat-footed and assault a tom turkey.
Along the same lines as Ron and a couple others of you are trying to get across, this RV'ing is NOT like TV depicts things.

[Bob Landry]

There are many posts from new owners complaining about something electrical that doesn't work, yet they don't have a clue of the difference between 12VDC and shore power and what operates what.

[Kzneft]

Wow, they have gotten worse ! I didn't think they could get any worse. I tell people looking at RV's, "you better be good at mechanical things and electrical, or have lots of time and money to keep bringing it back to the dealer". There is always repairs, upkeep, etc when owning a RV. When someone tells my wife and me they put together RV's we loose all respect for them. haha. I must say though after all my repairs my Carbon 349 has been a good rig!