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Old 01-31-2021, 06:34 PM   #41
aaron_huber
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Originally Posted by jasin1 View Post
I just found it ironic that you said you would be all for a truck that was more capable with electric motors and massive torque yet you probably are over payload on your current truck and could upgrade now and not wait 15 years. It’s none of my business .. I also had that combination until recently...it just seemed like you were being argumentative either “for your cause”or “just because” ....it was my attempt at sarcasm Hope you don’t take offense
No offense taken. I'm looking forward to a new 3500 with more payload in a few years but I'm close enough to feel safe for now. My post was just trying to point out that almost everyone was replying as if the article said that they would only offer battery powered vehicles which isn't the case.

15 years out is a couple of trucks away for me. I'm hoping the technology will be what they clearly expect it will be by then. If the new drivetrains aren't ready then obviously they will keep selling what people want or risk losing all of their sales to a competitor who will, which is why they stated it as a goal instead of a promise.
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Old 01-31-2021, 06:50 PM   #42
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We, the public, take the "Tim Allen Toolman" approach when it comes to our trucks, and consider them "heavy duty", but in reality, a F250 is considered a class 2B light duty truck. A F350 is a class 3 medium duty truck.

Heavy duty trucks start at 26001 GVW and are Class 7 trucks.
Obviously that term means different things depending on the context, but I was just assuming that they when they say they expect all vehicles including "heavy duty trucks" to be electric, they were referring to the two products that they call heavy duty trucks - the 2500HD and 3500HD. Their announcement wasn't terribly detailed on what exactly they plan to sell in 15 years so I guess time will tell who's assumption is correct.
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Old 01-31-2021, 06:57 PM   #43
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I was looking for what GM actually said (vs. all the press interpretations of it) and I assume this is the announcement everyone is referring to:

https://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/...28-carbon.html

That specifically says only "light-duty" vehicles so I guess we don't have anything to worry about just yet.
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Old 01-31-2021, 07:39 PM   #44
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The problem, at least the way I see it, is "committing ALL government vehicles to electrical power" is doomed to fail.
I agree, but at least they're doing it in the right order. Not like "here's a health plan you're required to pay for, but we don't," "here's a retirement plan you're required to pay into, but we don't," "here's a gun restriction you're required to obey, but we don't."
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Old 01-31-2021, 07:42 PM   #45
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This is probably our future lol
What's wrong with that? It looks big enough to hold a good size tent, two sleeping bags, and a s'mores kit!
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Old 02-04-2021, 08:12 AM   #46
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The reason they are moving to electric is because the new batteries coming out can power vehicles as far or further than gas and diesel. Buggy whips disappeared because something better came along. Same thing here.
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Old 02-04-2021, 08:47 AM   #47
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"Clean" Electric Vehicles

Nothing like having a clean electric vehicle that runs on coal, natural gas, of nuclear fuel.
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Old 02-04-2021, 08:54 AM   #48
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Well, saw a list the other day of all the stuff that is made from fossil fuels. Kinda wonder how they are going to make toothpaste and lipstick from solar and wind energy?? I don't think our gas or diesel is going away in my lifetime but seems there are some in Gov't that are hell bent on trying. Can't wait until I pull up to refuel my Duramax and fuel is $10/gal ($7 tax).
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Old 02-04-2021, 09:29 AM   #49
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Nothing like having a clean electric vehicle that runs on coal, natural gas, of nuclear fuel.
FYI: Do some research. My home is 130% renewable fuels. Many countries are almost 100% renewable. with proper design, solar, hydrogen, wave and wind still provide power at night and when there is no wind. Most coal plants are shutting down. They are no longer cost efficient. Dinosaur powered vehicles do not last as long as electric and hydrogen. The only reason we aren't using safe hydrogen now is because of public opinion. The USA can remain in the 19th century and dish out a large portion of its gnp to other countries, or enter the 21st century and be financially viable in the future. I often think that people defending fossil fuels want the mid-east to have all our money. You all have short memories. Most of us are old enough to remember seeing brown domes over our cities and kids picking up toxins from playground sand, and seeing people in china a brazil needing to wear masks in the cities because of the toxic fumes. Why would you not want vehicles that have just as much power, or more, and are much, much more reliable?
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Old 02-04-2021, 09:53 AM   #50
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Things will get better

I have been reading about the Rivian truck and if the forecast is correct; it will have move power and carrying capacity the my 3500HD.
If they can produce a electrical truck that has distance, carrying-and tow capacity I would be all in.
The combustion engine is old technology and it’s time for a change. This would also benefit our environment.
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Old 02-04-2021, 10:12 AM   #51
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FYI: Do some research. My home is 130% renewable fuels. Many countries are almost 100% renewable. with proper design, solar, hydrogen, wave and wind still provide power at night and when there is no wind. Most coal plants are shutting down. They are no longer cost efficient. Dinosaur powered vehicles do not last as long as electric and hydrogen. The only reason we aren't using safe hydrogen now is because of public opinion. The USA can remain in the 19th century and dish out a large portion of its gnp to other countries, or enter the 21st century and be financially viable in the future. I often think that people defending fossil fuels want the mid-east to have all our money. You all have short memories. Most of us are old enough to remember seeing brown domes over our cities and kids picking up toxins from playground sand, and seeing people in china a brazil needing to wear masks in the cities because of the toxic fumes. Why would you not want vehicles that have just as much power, or more, and are much, much more reliable?
How far will your home power a ram 3500 on a cross country trip?
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Old 02-04-2021, 10:15 AM   #52
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They are phasing out gas and diesel light duty vehicles only by 2035. I’m figuring there will still be heavy duty pickups available at that time.
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Old 02-04-2021, 11:02 AM   #53
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FYI: Do some research. My home is 130% renewable fuels. Many countries are almost 100% renewable. with proper design, solar, hydrogen, wave and wind still provide power at night and when there is no wind. Most coal plants are shutting down. They are no longer cost efficient. Dinosaur powered vehicles do not last as long as electric and hydrogen. The only reason we aren't using safe hydrogen now is because of public opinion. The USA can remain in the 19th century and dish out a large portion of its gnp to other countries, or enter the 21st century and be financially viable in the future. I often think that people defending fossil fuels want the mid-east to have all our money. You all have short memories. Most of us are old enough to remember seeing brown domes over our cities and kids picking up toxins from playground sand, and seeing people in china a brazil needing to wear masks in the cities because of the toxic fumes. Why would you not want vehicles that have just as much power, or more, and are much, much more reliable?



where'd you come up with electric vehicles lasting longer than combustion engine vehicles? There's an extremely short list for comparison when it comes to electric vehicles. Furthermore, most combustion engines out last the rest of the vehicle now days.
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Old 02-04-2021, 11:10 AM   #54
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GM is a business. They can say what they want, but I believe it to be a juvenile statement at this point in time. No doubt they are playing the current government for some subsidies. Right now there is no money in electric vehicles outside of subsidies.... This is quoted from an article i'm sure many of you have seen:


"A debate rages over the past four quarters whether Tesla is profitable over the past year, or whether it is still losing money at this time. What is not debatable is that the only way the firm can report a profit is because – for regulatory reasons – other car manufacturers are forced to purchase “regulatory credits” from Tesla. Because other companies do not produce enough electric cars in their fleet, according to federal government regulations. Tesla booked $782 million in payments from traditional auto manufacturers in the first half of the year. Tesla reported a profit of $16 million in Q1 and $104 million in Q2 2020, meaning it would show a loss without the “regulatory credits” forcibly paid by its competitors. "

If GM wants to stick with their statement, that's fine. I imagine they can create a new business name and just stick the GM name on their small fleet vehicles to make good on their promise. Such as Chrysler did with changing the Dodge name to Ram badge for trucks. A little insider information.... a particular Japanese company is predicting their major turn to electric in about 8 years. GM sure would hate for that company to cash in on American taxpayer dollars instead of them.



Just curious..



1.where are the battery recycling centers?

2.How much does it cost in labor to change those batteries?

3.What would a current 7000# vehicle weigh if powered by batteries and what would that wreck look like?
4.How much are our power bills going to cost because a gallon of fuel oil/gasoline is mostly tax?
5. How is all of this electricity going to be made? Windmills have trouble with deteriorating blades. Certain groups think nuclear and coal is the worst thing ever.
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Old 02-04-2021, 11:12 AM   #55
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some years back the democrats in sacramento wanted a mandate for only electric cars. but stoped calling for it when the pop said the state could only own electric cars and trucks. including the personal cars for all elected officials.
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Old 02-04-2021, 11:37 AM   #56
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I believe everyone can understand the benefits of an electric motor, quiet and powerful but it how it get that electricity will be the real key. The mining needed for today batteries tech, forget which countries they come from along with the lack of electrical grid capacity to charge them, will keep gas and diesel around for long time. At the risk of ridicule , I had a Prius for 10 trouble free years and it was a great commuter car that sipped fuel. As btw, if no one buys EV's, the company will go under, remember the GM Volt. Tesla gets a lot of attention but their model line (design) is getting long in the tooth. We are a consumer driven economy (for the moment) and we get a say in the direction. Stopping here b4 I get on a longer rant...
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Old 02-04-2021, 11:59 AM   #57
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LOL I guess I'm "famous" for my longer rants, but I'll spare the grief (for now)...

Just suffice to say that GM is also stating in that same release that they are going to "smaller boosted internal combustion engines" which is the same direction Ford went in 2011 with the EcoBoost 3.5, while GM was laughing about it and the all aluminum body "tool box commercial", which GM now is phasing into many of their lines, in an attempt to lighten the vehicles to improve the fleet fuel average. Which, as I'm being told by "insiders at GM" is the main reason the electric HUMVEE is being produced. GM hopes to "cash in on the novelty" while every one sold means they can raise the average fleet fuel "tally" and sell one more "big liter gas/diesel engine in another HD truck"....

It's all about playing the numbers while meeting the regulations and managing to still provide what the customers will buy.

The current "speculation" that GM will have an all fleet electric truck to replace the internal combustion trucks currently being sold, at least to me, means that there'll be a lot more drivers towing with RAM and Ford diesels in 2035 than even GM expects.... All of that, subject to "government directions, regulations and subsidies, of course......
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Old 02-04-2021, 12:31 PM   #58
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I dont think you have anything to worry about, there have been ton of people and companys coming out in recent months already saying there is not enough lithium currently being produced to supply the amount need to have all cars battery powered. Since Biden is so environmentally conscious he wont allow new mines to come online to supply demand. I think GM just putting a date out there.
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Old 02-04-2021, 12:54 PM   #59
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I dont think you have anything to worry about, there have been ton of people and companys coming out in recent months already saying there is not enough lithium currently being produced to supply the amount need to have all cars battery powered. Since Biden is so environmentally conscious he wont allow new mines to come online to supply demand. I think GM just putting a date out there.
Note that China has abundant lithium reserves that they currently aren't exploiting, and is the dominant purchaser of lithium mines worldwide.
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Old 02-04-2021, 01:53 PM   #60
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The reason they are moving to electric is because the new batteries coming out can power vehicles as far or further than gas and diesel. Buggy whips disappeared because something better came along. Same thing here.
My experience is that if a product advancement is clearly superior, no government mandate is needed to force it on consumers. I don't remember a law mandating Model Ts or banning buggy whips.
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