Moving a battery to under the bed...

Torchster · 03-25-2022, 12:09 PM

I'd like to upgrade to a Lithium. I don't have the money to go fancy with Battle Born (wish I did). Will probably go with a cheaper Amazon battery. I fully understand the differences and issues going this route.

The bigger issue, is that I would like to put the battery under the bed (and maybe someday get more if needed). These darn things are expensive and I would rather have it more protected inside the trailer than hanging outside. BUT, looks the wiring is a little too complicated. I have a 2704RK with the 400i package. That means that I have the new fun Giggy box, 2000 watt inverter, an inverter connection box, a charge controller, and somewhere a shunt.

I blew all my money on the trailer and don't have the big bucks that a dealership would charge to move it. Also, during my walk around, they didn't know what a Giggy box was, had no idea that there was controller box for an inverter, didn't know if my charge controller was set to work with lead acid or how to access it or how to change the settings...I gave them a 20 minute lesson (and I had a crowd of like 8 people from the dealership listening and all of the sales people were gone by the time I did my walk around-these were the folks who actually work on the trailers listening to me) on Solar and just left. It was very disappointing! I give the dealership an F. I have zero faith on them doing the upgrade anyway.

Now there appears to be a single positive wire from the battery to the Giggy box, and I understand that. Smaller guage wire-the Giggy box just is not designed for large amperage draws and I am comfortable with that.

Now, I have these huge maybe 0 gauge wires going from my battery to this connection box for the xantrex controller (please let there be a fuse in here). My guess is that shunt is somewhere in this box too. Then more 0 gauge wires actually going to my inverter. Makes sense.

The phrase that pays for today is "Distance equals resistance." This is what worries me. Putting another 5 feet (total guess) of wire going just from the battery (now under the bed) to that controller box for the inverter on the tongue that in turn has like another 6 feet of wire to the actual inverter. That 2000 watt inverter can draw a ton a amps. Butt load of amps going through all that wire...well that equals fire.

The chances of getting a wiring diagram from Keystone are well, ZERO. If I do this the chances of voiding my warrantee are well, 100. Maybe it is best to leave a couple hundred amps of lithium on the tongue and hope for the best? Any thoughts?

(Sorry this post is so long).

Thanks for any advice.

dutchmensport · 03-25-2022, 04:12 PM

I don't care what kind of battery it is, even a flash light battery, it's NEVER a good thing to have them under the bed. You're asking for a disaster, or wake up suffocated some day.

**chuckster57** · 03-25-2022, 06:04 PM

I would invest in a locking battery box.

**sourdough** · 03-25-2022, 06:11 PM

There are a lot of things I will and won't do. Among the "won't do", at the top of the list, is putting a rack of batteries under my bed. That is just, well, ....not quite thought out maybe??

**JRTJH** · 03-25-2022, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sourdough

There are a lot of things I will and won't do. Among the "won't do", at the top of the list, is putting a rack of batteries under my bed. That is just, well, ....not quite thought out maybe??

^^^ This !!!

Granted there is supposed to be a technological difference between Lithium ion batteries (like the ones that grounded the Boeing 787 fleet) and Lithium iron batteries (that are reported to be much safer) but aren't completley foolproof. I wouldn't want to be sleeping in a remote area with those under my bed, have some type of "short circuit" occur and start overheating the batteries "with my pillow 8 or 10 inches above them....

Give me at least a fighting chance to see the flames flickering through a window and the chance to get out of the trailer before my pillow is engulfed in flames..... YMMV...

notanlines · 03-26-2022, 08:36 AM

I realize we're not talking apples and apples, but to go along with what has been recommended so far, here is a photo of an ion-booster car battery charger left in the open cupboard of an Airstream in our park to recharge. Damage amounted to about $2,000 and one dead battery.

Torchster · 03-28-2022, 10:44 AM

Actually, I have zero issues with having a battery under the bed. The reality is that for a long time now batteries have been installed under and inside all kind of RVs. In 5th wheels, they are in a compartment underneath the bedroom. In the big class A's (something I will never have $ to own), they are under the living room up front usually). In the Class C's they are sometimes under the steps. In the class B's - well, in those tiny things they are inside where ever they can find the space. Elon Musk installs them peoples garages all time (see Tesla Wall).

Now, until recently, they had to be careful with venting issues with some of the lead acid stuff. But there are zero venting issues with lithium.

Also, since weight isn't as much of an issue with lithium (lithium is like about 1/2 the weight of lead acid) it actually becomes more of a space issue. If you want to get serious about batteries, the hitch area of a regular travel trailer doesn’t have the space, so really big battery systems have to go inside on a travel trailer - sometimes the pass thru which is under the bed and very often under the bed.

FSI (the people really behind Keystone's Solar Flex) has been installing lithium inside RVs for literally years now, with no safety issues. These batteries, at least the ones I am looking into, have a built in BMS (battery management system). This system keeps the battery safe in too many ways for a short post.

As far as a fire issue, I think a much bigger issue the 40 pounds of propane sitting on the hitch of trailer next to a battery. I think you would see a mili-second of bright orange light and be dead long before you might notice any flame coming from the front of the trailer.

As was mentioned, older chemistries of Lithium have had issues. But that is comparing apples to oranges. They are different now. And while there is a known with the Bolt for example, those are a different kind of cell (and actually for those to fail it actually take two different failures to occur at the same time to have the roughly 20 fires out of the about 150,000 sold.) The prismatic cells in the batteries I am looking to get, again, apples to oranges.

For me, it’s more of a wiring issue. While I have done a lot research, that DOES NOT make me an electrician.

**chuckster57** · 03-28-2022, 11:08 AM

In evry application I have seen in ANY RV over the years, no matter what the battery type, they have always been vented to the outside of the coach. I understand sealed batteries don’t NEED to be vented, but I wouldn’t be comfortable with them underneath me in the cabin and not vented. JMHO, YMMV.

Enzof104 · 05-31-2022, 01:22 PM

Putting the should you or shouldn't you conversation aside, did you ever go through with this? I'm in the process of upgrading to a Lifepo4 battery and was planning on putting it in the passthrough as well. Curious on how your set up came.

And regarding the Lifepo4 batteries, think of all those van-lifers that have the exact setup in the back of the van with them. Modern Lithium Phosphate are not the batteries of old.

NH_Bulldog · 05-31-2022, 02:55 PM

As a Firefighter and Fire Investigator (CFEI), ANY battery in an occupied space is a disaster waiting to happen. Sleeping on top of a battery is about the most foolish thing I can imagine (I am being overly kind here). If you think YOUR battery is “special”, think again, you are rolling dice with lives at stake. Buying budget batteries from Amazon only stacks the odds against you further. Even a Tesla Power Wall home storage battery installed under applicable NFPA standards is not installed inside an occupied living space. The stench of burnt human flesh is an odor that I cannot begin to describe. Do us First Responders a favor and DON’T DO IT!

notanlines · 06-01-2022, 04:16 AM

Rob, you've been here a long time, read thousands of posts and I'll bet you can sense those who come here looking for approval of their action, not info to make a good decision. Enzof and Torchster both have that sense around their posts.
I only hope others who have come to this thread will heed your advice.

Enzof104 · 06-01-2022, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notanlines

Rob, you've been here a long time, read thousands of posts and I'll bet you can sense those who come here looking for approval of their action, not info to make a good decision. Enzof and Torchster both have that sense around their posts.
I only hope others who have come to this thread will heed your advice.

Sorry notanlines. Not the case for me.
While this may have been my first post, it is not posted to get approval from anyone. I was simply asking if he moved forward on this and that I have also seen a ton of setups where the Lifepo4 was placed in the basement, so I was curious on what he did. I agree this is not ideal and appreciate the feedback from Bulldog.

My issue is that I cannot find a battery box that will fit the battery I purchased and squeeze between the camper and propane tanks on my tongue.

I’ve been researching this subject for over a month and looking at all options.

Stircrazy · 06-02-2022, 04:34 PM

I have no issues with LFP chemisty batteries under the bed, but I would put them in some sort of box and have a smoke detecter riged up into the senario just to be safe.
I have mine in my camper in the living space so the furnace keeps them warm. you can wire them to the same point just use a wire thickness rated for the current and distance. I use the charts that give you a rating bassed on a 1% loss. then if it calls for 4ga I will go one size bigger and fuse it aproperatly at the battery.

Steve

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