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Old 11-28-2020, 06:52 AM   #1
Wohnmobil
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Are my Batteries Shot or is it Something Else?

I apologize for the lengthy post in advance.

I’ll get straight to the issue. DW and I have been living in our 5er since the beginning of October. When we stayed in Bend, OR and Winnemucca, NV (plugged into shore power) for overnighters the temps dipped into the upper teens and mid twenties. I noticed the power converter fan was on most of the time. I didn’t pay much attention to it as I thought maybe the cold was the issue.

When we traveled to warmer weather and more sun the fan did not come on and it seemed the batteries were holding a charge or being charged by the factory installed solar panel.

A couple days ago, we are now set up in Texas plugged into shore power, I realized I haven’t heard the converter fan and checked the In-Command panel and the batteries were at 10.7V. I turned on the lights and observed the battery voltage drop. Turned the lights off and the volts leveled off and slowly began to charge (I assume with the solar panel).

Note: I have checked the battery fluid levels every 2 weeks to be sure they were up.

That evening we broke out the lanterns and did not use any lights or draw from the 12v power. About 2am the refrigerator started beeping, I guess due to low power. The battery voltage on In-Command showed 6.8v. I turned off the refer and went back to sleep.

So yesterday (11/27) thinking the problem is the converter (WFCO model #WF9855) I replaced it with a new one. It shows a consistent 13.7v on In-Command, but the fan has been running constantly. After letting it charge the batteries for several hours (and the fan running) I turned it off and checked the voltage on the In-Command screen. It was holding steady at 12.8v. I left the converter off overnight and the batteries were at 12.7v.

On a side note: Last night while the converter was plugged in the fan sounded like it was on low speed and when I turned on the lights the fan sped up and slowed down when I turned the lights off. The voltage also fluctuated on the In-Command panel.

I turned the converter back on this morning and the fan started running again, but at the lower speed.

I am going to take my batteries in this morning to one of the auto parts stores to have them checked.
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Old 11-28-2020, 06:59 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wohnmobil View Post
I apologize for the lengthy post in advance.

I’ll get straight to the issue. DW and I have been living in our 5er since the beginning of October. When we stayed in Bend, OR and Winnemucca, NV (plugged into shore power) for overnighters the temps dipped into the upper teens and mid twenties. I noticed the power converter fan was on most of the time. I didn’t pay much attention to it as I thought maybe the cold was the issue.

When we traveled to warmer weather and more sun the fan did not come on and it seemed the batteries were holding a charge or being charged by the factory installed solar panel.

A couple days ago, we are now set up in Texas plugged into shore power, I realized I haven’t heard the converter fan and checked the In-Command panel and the batteries were at 10.7V. I turned on the lights and observed the battery voltage drop. Turned the lights off and the volts leveled off and slowly began to charge (I assume with the solar panel).

Note: I have checked the battery fluid levels every 2 weeks to be sure they were up.

That evening we broke out the lanterns and did not use any lights or draw from the 12v power. About 2am the refrigerator started beeping, I guess due to low power. The battery voltage on In-Command showed 6.8v. I turned off the refer and went back to sleep.

So yesterday (11/27) thinking the problem is the converter (WFCO model #WF9855) I replaced it with a new one. It shows a consistent 13.7v on In-Command, but the fan has been running constantly. After letting it charge the batteries for several hours (and the fan running) I turned it off and checked the voltage on the In-Command screen. It was holding steady at 12.8v. I left the converter off overnight and the batteries were at 12.7v.

On a side note: Last night while the converter was plugged in the fan sounded like it was on low speed and when I turned on the lights the fan sped up and slowed down when I turned the lights off. The voltage also fluctuated on the In-Command panel.

I turned the converter back on this morning and the fan started running again, but at the lower speed.

I am going to take my batteries in this morning to one of the auto parts stores to have them checked.
On the days you noticed the converter fan running more often, were you using your propane furnace?
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Old 11-28-2020, 07:04 AM   #3
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On the days you noticed the converter fan running more often, were you using your propane furnace?
Yes we were.
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Old 11-28-2020, 07:14 AM   #4
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It would help if you shared what capacity batteries you have and what wattage the solar panel is. Sounds like the batteries are bad. Running a flooded cell battery to 6 volts will absolutely damage it, most likely beyond and usefulness.
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Old 11-28-2020, 07:35 AM   #5
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Make sure the place that checks your batteries does a load test on them.
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Old 11-28-2020, 07:36 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by flybouy View Post
It would help if you shared what capacity batteries you have and what wattage the solar panel is. Sounds like the batteries are bad. Running a flooded cell battery to 6 volts will absolutely damage it, most likely beyond and usefulness.
I have Interstate GC2 Deep Cycle Extreme (GC2-ECL-UTL) batteries and the solar panel I know is Zamp Solar 30A. Not sure of the wattage.
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Old 11-28-2020, 07:38 AM   #7
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Make sure the place that checks your batteries does a load test on them.
Thanks. I’ll make sure they do this. They should be under warranty, so I’ll bring them to a Interstate dealer and try to exchange them.
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Old 11-28-2020, 07:48 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Wohnmobil View Post
Yes we were.
That may be the reason the converter fan was running more often, since the furnace uses 12Vdc.

Note that the voltage display will be lower when there is a draw on the battery.

As others have stated, have the batteries tested before spending any more money.
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Old 11-28-2020, 08:17 AM   #9
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I think you probably have a "voltage detection issue" in the converter and there's NOTHING wrong with your system, it's likely just being "used incorrectly"...

Let me explain: Your converter has a voltage detection circuit that senses the battery voltage and only charges the battery when necessary. If the battery voltage is greater than about 12.8 to 13 volts, the converter/charger will only provide a "maintenance, trickle charge" to the batteries.

Now, you have the solar charger turned on, recharging the batteries as well, so the "electrical line going to the converter/charger is sensing the solar power on the battery lines (13.6 VDC) so the converter/charger is being "told the batteries are fully charged" and it isn't being "triggered to provide power to charge the batteries"....

The same thing happens when someone puts a 5 amp "stand alone charger" on their battery while plugged into shore power. Effectively, what that "stand alone charger" does is "totally shut the converter/charger off and disable the voltage detection circuit"....

So, the first thing I'd suggest is to turn the solar charger off. That will provide the "battery voltage (not the solar charger voltage) to the converter/charger detection circuit and will trigger it to provide a "bulk charge condition" to the batteries.....

Next, I'd expect the converter/charger cooling fan to run at high speed... That fan is "thermostatically controlled" and as the charger transformer warms up (from providing increased power) the fan will run faster, depending on how hot the converter/charger gets. That's a normal part of how it works... In other words, as the demand for power increases, the cooling fan RPM's increase to keep the converter/charger cool.....

In summary, My guess is that you're running two "competing charger systems" on the same battery and the "primary one is being "triggered to OFF" by the smaller charger output to the lines.

So, unplug/disconnect/turn OFF the solar charger, see if your converter/charger works as it's designed to work. You'll hear the fan come on, that's normal and expected.

Don't forget to check the electrolyte level in your batteries, they will "lose fluid" in dry, hot conditions and when being rapidly charged. So, they may well be "thirsty right now"..... Not only for an adequate charge but also for electrolyte replenishment.... Use distilled water only !!!!!
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Old 11-28-2020, 08:28 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
I think you probably have a "voltage detection issue" in the converter and there's NOTHING wrong with your system, it's likely just being "used incorrectly"...

Let me explain: Your converter has a voltage detection circuit that senses the battery voltage and only charges the battery when necessary. If the battery voltage is greater than about 12.8 to 13 volts, the converter/charger will only provide a "maintenance, trickle charge" to the batteries.

Now, you have the solar charger turned on, recharging the batteries as well, so the "electrical line going to the converter/charger is sensing the solar power on the battery lines (13.6 VDC) so the converter/charger is being "told the batteries are fully charged" and it isn't being "triggered to provide power to charge the batteries"....

The same thing happens when someone puts a 5 amp "stand alone charger" on their battery while plugged into shore power. Effectively, what that "stand alone charger" does is "totally shut the converter/charger off and disable the voltage detection circuit"....

So, the first thing I'd suggest is to turn the solar charger off. That will provide the "battery voltage (not the solar charger voltage) to the converter/charger detection circuit and will trigger it to provide a "bulk charge condition" to the batteries.....

Next, I'd expect the converter/charger cooling fan to run at high speed... That fan is "thermostatically controlled" and as the charger transformer warms up (from providing increased power) the fan will run faster, depending on how hot the converter/charger gets. That's a normal part of how it works... In other words, as the demand for power increases, the cooling fan RPM's increase to keep the converter/charger cool.....

In summary, My guess is that you're running two "competing charger systems" on the same battery and the "primary one is being "triggered to OFF" by the smaller charger output to the lines.

So, unplug/disconnect/turn OFF the solar charger, see if your converter/charger works as it's designed to work. You'll hear the fan come on, that's normal and expected.

Don't forget to check the electrolyte level in your batteries, they will "lose fluid" in dry, hot conditions and when being rapidly charged. So, they may well be "thirsty right now"..... Not only for an adequate charge but also for electrolyte replenishment.... Use distilled water only !!!!!
That makes sense. The fluid levels are full and I’ll keep checking them regularly.
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Old 11-28-2020, 08:33 AM   #11
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While reading the last post I noticed I didn’t hear the fan operating. So I turned on the lights and the fan came on. I turned off the lights and the fan turned off. The fan was on a low speed. I’m hoping my batteries just needed time to charge and I was being impatient. I’ll monitor the situation through the weekend and see if that is the case.
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Old 11-28-2020, 08:42 AM   #12
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As the converter produces more amps ( based on demand) the fan will increase speed to provide more cooling to the heat sink in the converter, I wouildn't rely on it to be an indication of battery health o0r state of charge.
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Old 11-28-2020, 09:01 AM   #13
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As the converter produces more amps ( based on demand) the fan will increase speed to provide more cooling to the heat sink in the converter, I wouildn't rely on it to be an indication of battery health o0r state of charge.
I agree....

The fan speed is directly dependent on heat INSIDE the converter/charger. That heat is produced by the electronics inside the converter/charger as it changes 120VAC to 12VDC. The greater the demand, the more heat produced, the faster the thermostatically controlled fan will run....

That demand "could be" from a requirement to charge a dead battery, or from a large number of lights being turned on or from the furnace fan running or from the water pump running or from any combination of several of those... So, you could have a fully charged battery and the fan running from "other items drawing power" or it could be from a shorted/dead battery....

So, the fan speed is not a good indicator of battery condition.....
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Old 11-28-2020, 09:07 AM   #14
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After reading all of your sage advise I will get the batteries checked to be sure.

Thanks for the help.
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Old 11-28-2020, 09:55 AM   #15
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Reading through this I would say that the problem is probably the solar competing with the converter as John observed. I would turn off/disconnect it and let the converter do its job. The damage to the battery, if any, is unknown until you have them load tested. That would be the cheapest route to go to eliminate one additional aspect although there is a bit of work involved to get them out and into a place to test them. Good luck.
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Old 11-28-2020, 10:00 AM   #16
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I would first just turn off the solar charging system and see what happens in the next 4 or 5 hours. You may find that nothing is wrong, everything works properly and there's no damage other than a dead battery from not being able to keep up with demand with only a small solar charger that can't provide enough power to keep everything running.

With a Zamp 30 amp charger, if it's connected to a single 100 watt solar panel, it's only going to provide 100 watts (on a bright sunny day) or significantly less on a cloudy day. 100 watts at 12VDC is only 8.5 amps MAX and likely closer to 4 or 5 amps. If you're running the furnace, you can easily be using 15 or 20 amps from the battery with only a max capacity to replenish 8.5 amps. It's easy to see why the solar system can't keep up with demand, and if it's "voltage output keeps the shore power system turned off, well, it only takes a day or two to completely discharge the battery system.....
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Old 11-28-2020, 03:49 PM   #17
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I lugged both 6v batteries to the Interstate Battery dealer. He load tested them and informed me the batteries were in great shape and take awhile to charge.

As soon as I figure out how to turn the solar panel off I’ll do that. I only have one solar panel on the roof and suspect it is a 100w panel.
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