2021 Fuzion 379 -- Solar and Inverter Install

Essvar · 08-13-2021, 08:57 AM

Good Morning, I haven't seen a whole lot of information or details on the installation of Solar/Inverter on the new Fuzions.

I'll start with the solar, my unit was pre-wired from the factory for Jaboni solar products, so I decided to keep it simple and go that direction. For those looking to purchase Jaboni products, Future Sales RV is where I ended up purchasing. https://www.futuresalesrv.com//index...product_id=210

I opted for the 30amp controller and a single 300W panel. Everything with the Solar install is really straight forward and matches the YouTube video provided by Jaboni. Find your wires coming from the roof and going into the floor. Easy Cheesy (behind the wall in your passthrough storeage). The only big issues was the remote.... the new Jaboni remote does NOT use a RJ connection as is pre-wired. It has its own 4wire comm line that is only 4' long. So I ended up using some sprinkler control wire to splice in an extension. Kinda Janky but it worked. The other major issue is the new Jaboni remote has the control wire coming from the bottom of the remote and NOT through the back. If you are looking for a clean install you'll need a grommet of some sort.

Now, onto the inverter. After much research I opted for the Xantrex Freedom 2000XC. My choice was based on my presumed max watts needed and also these units have a built in 30amp transfer switch.

The inverter Pre-Wire is lackluster at best in these units, there is NO passthrough to the battery compartment for wiring so I used some 6G wire and made my own battery post terminals and drilled from the storage into the battery compartment. Second "unknown" was why the inverter pre-wire was a romex loop... as I found through much digging this is because the romex comes from the converter and goes outbound to the pre-wired parts of the unit. Easy enough, cut the wire turn on shore power and find the hot side.

After everything was wired in and running I'll note the inverter pre-wiring runs these items. 1 GFCI in the kitchen, 2 GFCI in the master bedroom and the living room TV. Pretty lackluster as my main use for the inverter is to run the outdoor Fridge and TV as they are A/C only. So I go to the main breaker panel looking for how they wired the inverter... well the Pre-Wiring completely bypasses the main breaker panel so in order to power more items I'll need to splice into the only inverter hot wire that runs behind the panel.

I hope this helps anyone trying to do this themselves. PS: I am not an electrician and yes, I'll be adding an inline fuse going from the battery to the inverter

Essvar · 08-13-2021, 09:19 AM

Just to note, my install was not intended for a true OTG. I was only looking to run the two fridges and maybe a TV or two. I wasn't looking to run AC units or Microwave. This was my $1,700 solution to the $5,500 I was quoted from the dealer.

Vinnie · 08-19-2021, 08:23 PM

Nicely done! My non-electrician self would have been too intimidated by measurements I don't understand to take the install that far.

Essvar · 08-24-2021, 11:49 AM

If anyone is interested I figured I'd finish my inverter/converter saga

As established previously the prewired outlets in this unit comes in from the converter and out to the outlets. My inverter has a 30amp transfer switch so no big deal, when i'm running the inverter only it powers the outlets and when i'm on shore power it acts as a 30amp transfer.

The issue comes when thinking about running more outlets than the Pre-Wired. As the pre-wired outlets bypass the main panel if I just "tapped back into the main bus" I would be creating a loop when i'm on shore power.

So... my non-electrican mind at work... since the pre-wire bypasses the main bus... if I find the breaker that powers the outlets I want and remove it from the main bus... then i'm bypassing the main bus entirely and therefore i can't backfeed when i'm on sore power.

That's I did... I removed the wire labeled GFCI from the main panel and heated it up with my pre-wired inverter power. And... AWESOME I have power to all the outlets that I wanted! Test shore power.... OH NO I've got a backfeed somewhere as the inverter stopped powering (passthrough safety)

So the only thing I could think of is there must be a junction box somewhere and there's an additional wire coming from the GFCI that's feeding back to the converter.

As it turns out, I was correct. the GFCI in the 1/2 bath has 1 romex in and 2 romex out. One of which I traced that bridges to the kitchen receptacle that also had 1 romex in and 2 out. After another trace I found the romex that backfeeds to the converter. Removed and capped that wire and now... ALL IS Wonderful. My inverter runs all the receptacles in the unit and is working as a transfer switch when on shore power.

As noted earlier, this isn't true OTG so no big power items are running here, just TV's and Fridges

valonzo · 09-27-2021, 04:46 AM

Wow thanks for this. Info is really sparse and I appreciate it.

Siily Question please - on the romex loop on initial setup. When connected to shore to test, did you use the line that was not hot or the hot one?

Thanks!

Essvar · 09-27-2021, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by valonzo

Wow thanks for this. Info is really sparse and I appreciate it.

Siily Question please - on the romex loop on initial setup. When connected to shore to test, did you use the line that was not hot or the hot one?

Thanks!

On the Romex loop, My inverter has a pass through feature, so the hot side went to the AC IN part of the inverter, and the cold side went into the AC OUT.

If you don't have a pass through inverter (which I don't recommend) The hot side would need to be capped and the cold side would be wired into the AC out of the inverter. Note, if this is the route you go, the inverted outlets will not work unless you are running the inverter.

Hope that helps.

roadglide · 10-01-2021, 06:11 AM

How is the 300 watt system keeping up with the outside frig? I had nothing prewired in my toyhuler it was straight forward running the no 6 wires from the roof Panel to the 60 amp charge control in an out to the inverter to the 2 Poll relay fully automatic. I ran 14 Romax wire drilling a hole to the under belly . Pulling the Romax Through a hole by the refrigerator and removed the breaker panel connected 2 breakers . One receptacle For the camper and 1 breaker for the 4 watt refrigerator . I have a switch for the aims inverter Inside to turn it off and a nice small meter connected to the batteries that show %, volts and temperature that always stay cooler then out side temp it has on off button .

Essvar · 10-03-2021, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadglide

How is the 300 watt system keeping up with the outside frig? I had nothing prewired in my toyhuler it was straight forward running the no 6 wires from the roof Panel to the 60 amp charge control in an out to the inverter to the 2 Poll relay fully automatic. I ran 14 Romax wire drilling a hole to the under belly . Pulling the Romax Through a hole by the refrigerator and removed the breaker panel connected 2 breakers . One receptacle For the camper and 1 breaker for the 4 watt refrigerator . I have a switch for the aims inverter Inside to turn it off and a nice small meter connected to the batteries that show %, volts and temperature that always stay cooler then out side temp it has on off button .

With my outdoor fridge it’s no problem at all, my outside fridge only pulls 65watts when the compressor kicks on. I did add a THHN pigtail to my charge controller and use a 100w mobile panel so I can “chase the sun”. With my two 6v batteries I don’t need the generator except for AC/ Microwave or Coffee Pot

roadglide · 10-03-2021, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Essvar

With my outdoor fridge it’s no problem at all, my outside fridge only pulls 65watts when the compressor kicks on. I did add a THHN pigtail to my charge controller and use a 100w mobile panel so I can “chase the sun”. With my two 6v batteries I don’t need the generator except for AC/ Microwave or Coffee Pot

My frig is stamped 4 amp about 50 watts. I’m using 350 ah 12 volt AGM batters 500 watt solar. I can see by looking at my inside volt meter it pulls the volts down to 13. The 65 watt frig you have is close to 5 amps. I don’t use my frig on the inverter because I’m seeing volt meter drop. There is no way I could run the frig after the sun set late in the evening with out dropping into the 12 v . I think it will kill my batteries dropping low and getting recharged That happen . I’m going on 5 years with my batteries . There getting old but still charging up to 90 percent . The out side fridge that’s nice .

LCDMAN71 · 10-21-2021, 11:39 AM

I'm looking at doing the exact same thing (changing an outside 110V outlet to either inverted and shore power) on a Cougar with that is already wired to three inside outlets and found your interesting post. Does cutting that feedback wire to the converter mean the GCFI protection is removed from all the circuits?

Essvar · 10-21-2021, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LCDMAN71

I'm looking at doing the exact same thing (changing an outside 110V outlet to either inverted and shore power) on a Cougar with that is already wired to three inside outlets and found your interesting post. Does cutting that feedback wire to the converter mean the GCFI protection is removed from all the circuits?

No, the converter does not provide any GFI protection. There is still a GFI receptacle in my rear bathroom that provides GFI to the outlets I charged that were not pre-wired. The inverter provides protection for the pre-wired outlets.

If the outlet that you run power to is already on a GFI, tapping it into the inverter won't remove that GFI.

LCDMAN71 · 10-21-2021, 12:29 PM

Great, thanks for the quick reply. And thanks for your research/experimenting and thorough write up.
So, in my case (same Xantrex inverter as yours), I would just need to remove the hot wire for the outside receptacle from the appropriate circuit breaker, connect it to the hot wire coming from the inverter, and locate/cut/cap the return wire to the converter coming from one of my 3 inverted outlets - correct?
Go Ducks! I got my Master's there in 1973.

Essvar · 10-21-2021, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LCDMAN71

Great, thanks for the quick reply. And thanks for your research/experimenting and thorough write up.
So, in my case (same Xantrex inverter as yours), I would just need to remove the hot wire for the outside receptacle from the appropriate circuit breaker, connect it to the hot wire coming from the inverter, and locate/cut/cap the return wire to the converter coming from one of my 3 inverted outlets - correct?
Go Ducks! I got my Master's there in 1973.

Correct, almost. You will need to find the return wire coming from the circuit you removed from the main panel. That's where all my issues came from

I pulled the wire out of the main panel and it took quite a while to figure out why it was back feeding the converter because I completely removed it from the panel. lol

Mind you, this is specific to my trailer and yours may or may not be wired the same way. Heck, even a 2021 Fuzion 3 months later in build date might be wired differently.

LCDMAN71 · 10-21-2021, 12:57 PM

Sorry, I'm confused. Are you saying that both the hot and neutral wires are removed from the circuit breaker and connected into the Romex from the inverter? Or am I missing something? Thanks.

Essvar · 10-21-2021, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LCDMAN71

Sorry, I'm confused. Are you saying that both the hot and neutral wires are removed from the circuit breaker and connected into the Romex from the inverter? Or am I missing something? Thanks.

Yes, I removed the entire romex wire from the main panel and tied it into the inverter.

valonzo · 10-21-2021, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Essvar

On the Romex loop, My inverter has a pass through feature, so the hot side went to the AC IN part of the inverter, and the cold side went into the AC OUT.

If you don't have a pass through inverter (which I don't recommend) The hot side would need to be capped and the cold side would be wired into the AC out of the inverter. Note, if this is the route you go, the inverted outlets will not work unless you are running the inverter.

Hope that helps.

Right on thanks man..

If I have a pass through inverter and wire it as above, are you saying that I would not need to turn the inverter on for it to work each time Im boondocking? I thought thats what the switch was for that you run the wire through to kitchen for? In that you'd have to turn it on each time you want to use it.

Essvar · 10-21-2021, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by valonzo

Right on thanks man..

If I have a pass through inverter and wire it as above, are you saying that I would not need to turn the inverter on for it to work each time Im boondocking? I thought thats what the switch was for that you run the wire through to kitchen for? In that you'd have to turn it on each time you want to use it.

Correct, when you are boondocking you will need to turn the inverter on and off when you want to use it. (that's why I added the remote so I can do this from inside instead of crawling into the basement) Xantrex does have a bluetooth remote that so you can turn the inverter on and off from your phone.

With a pass through inverter you won't need to do anything when you plug into shore power, the inverter automatically passes the power through it and powers the circuits.

Skillet173 · 12-01-2021, 05:03 AM

I have a question if you don’t mind. In my new Fuzion I have a residential fridge. Why? No idea why but anyway. Fridge pulls 3a startup and 2.3 running. I got dealer to go for 3 grp 27 “deep cycle” batteries. (88ah each)
I have a 2k inverter for that and a couple outlets and TV already installed from factory. If I go the way of Jaboni I’m thinking maybe 2 170w panels and a 30a charge controller? Not sure if I will go hardwired panel or Bluetooth, but that’s really not part of equation at this point.
My goal is to rest peacefully at night not worrying about batteries. I have onboard 5500 but would be nice to only use it occasionally for say microwave or AC.
Is this at least somewhat doable with current batteries ?

Essvar · 12-01-2021, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skillet173

I have a question if you don’t mind. In my new Fuzion I have a residential fridge. Why? No idea why but anyway. Fridge pulls 3a startup and 2.3 running. I got dealer to go for 3 grp 27 “deep cycle” batteries. (88ah each)
I have a 2k inverter for that and a couple outlets and TV already installed from factory. If I go the way of Jaboni I’m thinking maybe 2 170w panels and a 30a charge controller? Not sure if I will go hardwired panel or Bluetooth, but that’s really not part of equation at this point.
My goal is to rest peacefully at night not worrying about batteries. I have onboard 5500 but would be nice to only use it occasionally for say microwave or AC.
Is this at least somewhat doable with current batteries ?

We can run through the math but I'll just tell you from my experience. You'll be pushing it running that fridge all night with 160AH. I went with the single 300W panel on the roof and the 30amp charge controller. My experience this year with it was great. With the charger remote I could monitor the incoming watts throughout the day (avg 150-200 on sunny days) Which is plenty to keep everything going. However, with a roof mount panel you have quite a bit of 'off times' where you aren't getting full sun, lets say at least 12hrs out of each day during the summer. During those times I would pull 0-30w which was not enough to keep up with the fridge and parasitic draw.

With your setup you'll be looking at pulling 3AH from the fridge, and at least 1-2AH from parasitic draw, then add more AH if you are running the heater at night. With that much draw during non-charging times I think you'll be draining those batteries below where they should be. Worst case scenario the batteries drain too low overnight and you can't start the generator in the morning

(been there before, that's why I carry my Honda EU)

As I'm a proponent for "Try it First" I'd say use the batteries you have and see if its going to work for you. No sense throwing money at something we don't know is broken

Skillet173 · 12-01-2021, 01:16 PM

I just found information that the IN·Command system can be programmed to start generator if batteries hit 11.8v for 3 minutes, and run for an hour. Is that actually enough voltage to start the generator?
I apologize for questions, trying to use time trailer sits idle in barn to figure things out!
Will likely carry my old portable generator for first few OTG outings just in case anyway.

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