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Old 03-26-2015, 01:47 PM   #1
knuteski
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Wide Stance Axle = Longer Trailer Towed Safely?

What do you all think of the wide stance axles?

I am comfortable towing a 25' trailer (non-wide stance) with my TV (which shall remain anonymous to keep out the towing vehicle wheelbase police). But I would say 25' is the absolute maximum I would tow with my TV (all driven by a short wheelbase on my TV). Assuming this and assuming the weights are well within my range, what does everyone think about the Bullet 243BHS with wide stance axle? It's 27' 10" but since sway is my biggest fear, I'm thinking the axle will compensate for the almost 3 more feet of length.
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Old 03-26-2015, 02:00 PM   #2
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Not to sound "insincere" or "trite" but you're giving us "half the info" and withholding the parts that "shall remain anonymous to keep out the towing vehicle wheelbase police" and wanting someone to "tell you it's OK".

I don't think you'll find very many people who would take that kind of "half information" and fill in the blanks so you can feel good about a choice none of us know enough about to offer wise or reliable advice....

Wide stance suspension systems do offer more stability (in some situations) but certainly won't overcome a "match made in hell" type of tow vehicle/trailer combination.

Hmmmmm
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Old 03-26-2015, 04:22 PM   #3
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Stance plays a small part in it. Wheelbase, overhang and hitch to axle length on the trailer are more important IMHO. Not to mention CG, you could have a wide stance with a high CG vs a narrower unit with a lower CG. The lower CG would most likely be more stable. One of the reasons Airstreams tow as well as they do.

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Old 03-26-2015, 04:31 PM   #4
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If you're talking about the axles being separated by a foot and a half as being wide stance, that's more Kool-Aid than anything. In fact the axles configured that way put a lot more side load on the tires, axles, and frame in a turn than do the more normal stance.. I had one and I'll never have another..
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Old 03-26-2015, 05:25 PM   #5
sourdough
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If you are at your maximum limit pulling a 25' trailer (although you didn't give any specific info), you are at your limit.....regular axle separation or a foot and a half (wide stance) as Javi said.
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Old 03-27-2015, 11:38 AM   #6
knuteski
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Note that I am "over" my length already at 25'. But, I'm only taking this sucker on trips within the State (no big hills either). I don't want the conversation to turn into "Is Knuteski's tow vehicle enough" either...nor am I looking for approval.

I guess the simpler question is this:
If you were at your maximum comfortable towing length at 25 feet with a normal trailer, would you be comfortable towing a 27' 10" camper that has the wide-stance axles (split, whatever you want to call the ones that are 1 1/2 feet apart). I have only towed a 12' box popup with a Pacifica (My old TV) so I have absolutely no experience towing a camper. That's why I ask.

I know it'll put wear on the tires.
I know that it'll suck backing it into the space.
I'm willing to deal with those if the wide-axle makes it safer to tow.

When I read on other sites that talk about them it seems to do so. For those of you that have experience with them, does it in fact feel like you are towing a much smaller trailer?
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Old 03-27-2015, 12:56 PM   #7
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Based on the updated information... no.

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Old 03-27-2015, 08:39 PM   #8
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^^^What he said x 2. If you're at your maximum comfortable length at 25', that's your maximum. Spread axles won't "magically" give you any more stability than your "maximum comfortable length".

For the record, most accidents occur within 25 miles of home, so towing close to home or a thousand miles away, when you lose control, it really doesn't matter how far from home you are... It's a fallacy to think roads closer to home are somehow "safer" than roads over in the next state.

If you're at your limit now, adding an extra 3 feet will put you over your limit regardless of the axle configuration.
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Old 03-28-2015, 03:31 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knuteski View Post
Note that I am "over" my length already at 25'
Why do I feel that the next post will be he is looking for a new TV ?

We all see this too many times, small TV big trailer.
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Old 03-29-2015, 12:52 PM   #10
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Not sure I have seen length as part of the equation. That said I pulled a 250BH for 2 years with a Suzuki Equator. Weight numbers all within trailer and truck specs. Traded TV for full sized longer wheel based truck.
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Old 03-29-2015, 02:31 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by talk2cpu View Post
Not sure I have seen length as part of the equation. That said I pulled a 250BH for 2 years with a Suzuki Equator. Weight numbers all within trailer and truck specs. Traded TV for full sized longer wheel based truck.
Basic physics, falls under "leverage". The longer the distance between the trailer axles and the hitch versus the wheelbase of the towing vehicle. Longest lever usually wins in a bad situation. That is the simplistic version, WDH and sway control are part of the equation. It is enough to give an engineer nightmares.

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Old 03-30-2015, 04:47 AM   #12
knuteski
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Thanks for your help everyone. Guess we'll stick to the hybrids. So, now that I made my decision. Let's take this sucker off the rails.
Ready?
My Tow Vehicle is:
2000 Land Rover Discovery II.
Yes, the infamous one that can tow 7,700lbs in low but has a miniscule 100" wheel base and 550# towing weight capacity (although that's because LR says not to use WD hitches due to it's adjusting suspension. A suspension system which I don't have on mine so WD hitches are fine).

OK, tow police ready? I'll start...
Sell the LR and get a real TV (no, not selling it, it was given to me by my boss when we moved away and I really just have it for towing purposes).

With that wheel base, you shouldn't be towing anything. After all, it's not even on the wheelbase to trailer length chart. (Point taken and ignored. I'll go 24' with a good (Equalizer or better) hitch.
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Old 03-30-2015, 05:00 AM   #13
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A good friend and former co-worker used to pull his TT from Visalia, CA to Pismo Beach with a CJ-5. Trailer sway caused them to leave the road on Cottonwood Pass (sr 41). The rig ended up 200 ft down the embankment. His wife spent 2 months in the hospital. He never thought it could happen to him.....but, it did.
I wish you luck.
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Old 03-30-2015, 05:08 AM   #14
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IMHO towing weight is an objective measurement, while towing length is subjective. There are too many variables to apply a one-size-fits all calculation. I'm well within my towing capacity, but by some calculations, over my length capacity.
I think the hitch weight, WD system, TV suspension, and whether it's unibody or conventional will affect this.
I used to tow a 19' hybrid with a minivan, and now tow a 25' Passport with an SUV. The minivan had a longer wheelbase towing a shorter RV, but the SUV is way more stable.
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Old 03-30-2015, 05:43 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knuteski View Post
Thanks for your help everyone. Guess we'll stick to the hybrids. So, now that I made my decision. Let's take this sucker off the rails.
Ready?
My Tow Vehicle is:
2000 Land Rover Discovery II.
Yes, the infamous one that can tow 7,700lbs in low but has a miniscule 100" wheel base and 550# towing weight capacity (although that's because LR says not to use WD hitches due to it's adjusting suspension. A suspension system which I don't have on mine so WD hitches are fine).

OK, tow police ready? I'll start...
Sell the LR and get a real TV (no, not selling it, it was given to me by my boss when we moved away and I really just have it for towing purposes).

With that wheel base, you shouldn't be towing anything. After all, it's not even on the wheelbase to trailer length chart. (Point taken and ignored. I'll go 24' with a good (Equalizer or better) hitch.
I'm not really sure what information you want (or expect) from anyone on the forum. From your statements, you've already decided what you're going to do and you have stated in "Plain English" that you aren't going to change your mind. I have to consider whether you're trying to "bait people" into an anonymous argument on the forum or if you're legitimately seeking advice even though you've stated that you've already decided what you're going to do.

Your tow vehicle is a 2000 model. If you look at the Michigan Antique Vehicle Registration Requirements, you'll see that it is already 3/5th the age to qualify for "antique plates". If it holds the "sentimental value" you describe above, it likely won't "live long enough to qualify" for those plates, so what's the difference in abusing it by towing too much trailer or selling it to get an appropriate tow vehicle? Either way, it won't make that 26 year mark.

Sentimental value isn't in the criteria for towing and many 15 year old vehicles are used daily to tow. So, why the comments? If it does hold that kind of sentimental value for you that you don't want to part with it and you're considering pushing a short wheelbase vehicle that's already 15 years old beyond its manufacturer's recommendations and not willing to consider changing your mind, I don't think you'll find anyone on the forum willing to plead a case for or against your "solid convictions".

As stated by jsmith948, many people are convinced, "It won't happen to me". I second his closing remark, "I wish you luck"........
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Old 03-30-2015, 09:02 AM   #16
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If or when he gets the trailer into a uncontrollable side to side sway from the general roads conditions, wind or speed. I bet a longer TV will be in his plans.
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