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Old 09-08-2021, 03:51 AM   #1
RickV
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Keystone is really on top of things

On Monday April 5th I sent this email to Keystone Tech support.

Hi, I purchased a 2021 Alpine 3790FK last week VIN ################. Yesterday I disconnected it from shore power and a few hours later my wife noticed that the refrigerator had stopped working. I plugged the shore power back in and it worked again. I tried it again this morning and as soon as I unplugged shore power the Refrigerator went dead. Shouldn’t the inverter have kept the Refrigerator running? I have noticed that the dealer only installed one battery while there is provision for two. Could that be the problem? Is there some switch for the inverter?

Ten minutes ago I received this email from a Customer Experience Agent in response. Good thing it wasn't anything important. Doesn't this instill confidence in Keystone Tech Support?

Good Morning,

I would have an authorized dealer look at it. The inverter should be kicking on.

Thank you,


Not gonna post the agent's name just thought it was hilarious. BTW I resolved this issue the next day by talking directly to the inverter manufacturer
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Old 09-08-2021, 04:00 AM   #2
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I might be mistaken, but I think all warranty claims do get processed through a dealer. Not sure why you contacted Keystone directly. In all honesty, my experience is that the dealers are far more knowledgeable.

But please do post how you fixed it! Thx.
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Old 09-08-2021, 04:23 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Scttw View Post
I might be mistaken, but I think all warranty claims do get processed through a dealer. Not sure why you contacted Keystone directly. In all honesty, my experience is that the dealers are far more knowledgeable.

But please do post how you fixed it! Thx.
I was just trying to be funny and show how unattentive Keystone can be to their customers. A lot dealers are not much better. As for the issue first off the "Dealer tried to cheap out on me and only installed "One" group 24 battery when specs called for "Two" group 27's. I brought it up during the walk through and they said they'd talk to service about it. After the walk through it was about 45 minutes before they brought the 5er out to us so, I 'assumed" they had made the changes (my bad). When I got home I checked it and they had not. I live about an hour from the dealer. I called and they apologized and offered to send me a check for $300 so I could buy the correct batteries which I did. As for the inverter it was placed in a spot where I could barely even get to it, there was a three way rocker switch which had not been switched to run off battery power.
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Old 09-08-2021, 04:30 AM   #4
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Got ya - thanks for the update. That actually VERY interesting .....
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Old 09-08-2021, 06:16 AM   #5
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Rick, "As for the inverter it was placed in a spot where I could barely even get to it" I firmly believe they are designed with this problem in mind. RV manufacturer engineers (insert smug face here) laugh around the campfire talking about inverter locations.
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Old 09-08-2021, 07:17 AM   #6
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I'm not surprised by the response from Keystone. Without an open, unresolved ticket they have nothing to reference and then you are stuck with a bubble gum chewing person that worked the midnight burger shift at McDonalds last week. You don't want them to advise you on a resolution to your problem. The dealer is always the best bet for initial contact.

As far as the batteries ALWAYS visually verify anything that is supposed to be done. 2 trailers ago I told them I wanted 2 batteries on the trailer and not one. They said OK and there were 2 battery boxes on the tongue when I picked it up. Assumed all was well and went on my merry way. Little did I realize the second, newly added battery was some crud covered Camco thing they must have had sitting in a junk heap somewhere. I found that out when the batteries died; the Camco had cannibalized the other, new battery and killed them. Make them show them to you would be my suggestion.

Like Jim mentioned, I think the designers sit around the break room and discuss how they can make things as difficult as possible for new owners. Many times the logical, easy path/location for something is totally ignored and it is placed in the most difficult, illogical place requiring you to contort and/or stand on your head. Ha! The last laugh is on them, little do they know those years of training to be a clown prepared me perfectly for dealing with their shenanigans!!
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Old 09-08-2021, 08:07 AM   #7
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... As for the inverter it was placed in a spot where I could barely even get to it, there was a three way rocker switch which had not been switched to run off battery power.
Sort of brings me back to things like having to pull the engine to change the #8 spark plug, having to pull the fuel tank to get to the fuel pump (inside the tank), and the lastest and greatest: Having to pull the entire truck cab to access the turbo.....

It's not "just Keystone" that engineers in some very questionable access to components......

And: I'd never consider emailing Ford/Dearborn to complain that my truck won't start or the radio won't turn on.... That's a "trip to the service department, not an email to the factory".....
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Old 09-08-2021, 11:14 AM   #8
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Technically, we are not Keystone's customers. None of us bought anything from them. The dealers Keystone sells through are Keystone's customers. We are the customer of the dealer we purchased from.

Of course, the manufacturer still has a reputation they want to protect and will entertain questions from end users as best they can. However, anyone answering their phones or emails are not technically equipped to provide specific help...the dealers are.

Keystone, and other manufacturers, will likely get involved if an end user is unable to get any required service from their dealer since, I'm sure, Keystone, et al, place expectations on their dealers to represent them and the product well.

I doubt that Keystone intentionally turns a deaf ear to an end user's service need, but those requests really need to go to the dealer for a more timely response and resolution.
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Old 09-08-2021, 04:38 PM   #9
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I think the intent of the OP's post is to show it took Keystone 5 months to respond to an email and then the response was truly not helpful at all.
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Old 09-08-2021, 04:50 PM   #10
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I think the intent of the OP's post is to show it took Keystone 5 months to respond to an email and then the response was truly not helpful at all.

I think the OP sent an email to basically a 3rd party about a situation they knew nothing about. I can imagine the delay....expect it really.
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Old 09-15-2021, 10:16 AM   #11
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I've not had any major issues (thankfully). My local dealer is a dud and after no satisfaction from them on much of anything, I emailed Keystone in need of a replacement switch for my jack (mine broke within the 90 day full warranty window). They shipped one out very quickly and only asked if I felt I could competently replace the switch (for legal reasons, I assume). When I said yes, they didn't even laugh.
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Old 09-15-2021, 01:09 PM   #12
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I've not had any major issues (thankfully). My local dealer is a dud and after no satisfaction from them on much of anything, I emailed Keystone in need of a replacement switch for my jack (mine broke within the 90 day full warranty window). They shipped one out very quickly and only asked if I felt I could competently replace the switch (for legal reasons, I assume). When I said yes, they didn't even laugh.
Just like you know which neighbor's kid is going to "do something they shouldn't" when their parents aren't watching, Keystone knows which dealerships take care of their customers and which are "the ones that take advantage of a situation"... When you write Keystone about a dealership that's "known by them to be on top of things", Keystone will almost always refer you back to the dealership. If, on the other hand, you write them about a dealership that they "know has a reputation of not helping their customers", then Keystone will very likely use a different approach with dealing with your letter.....

When I first bought my trailer, there was an issue with the rear grill bracket. One dealership wanted to rebuild the entire back wall rather than construct a bracket that would use the same holes in the FILON. There was no way I was going to agree to tearing apart my entire rear wall. So I contacted the Keystone area rep for this area and, although he didn't come right out and say it in so many words, he "inferred" that Keystone is watching that dealership for upcharging repair work by doing it the most difficult way so they get a larger warranty reimbursement. It wasn't even a year after that discussion with the rep that the dealership was no longer selling Keystone products....

So, like any other business relationship, Keystone knows which dealers are taking advantage of their customers and also taking advantage of Keystone's warranty policies. If they know the dealer is giving a customer a hassle, the factory will handle it differently than if they know the dealer is being "blindsided by a customer who has become a "complainer"......

Customers may think they are "some unknown entity with Keystone", but based on who your dealer is and what documentation the factory has on your trailer's warranty trail, you'll likely see entirely different responses to a complaint sent via email from their website.

Disclaimer: The above is my perception and is based on my experiences of reading what people post here, my talks with Keystone owners in campgrounds and my conversations with dealers, salesmen and industry reps who also form opinions based on what they see and hear. It is not intended to be, in any way, an "official Keystone position"
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Old 09-16-2021, 08:14 AM   #13
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I might be mistaken, but I think all warranty claims do get processed through a dealer. Not sure why you contacted Keystone directly. In all honesty, my experience is that the dealers are far more knowledgeable.

But please do post how you fixed it! Thx.
Dealers are far more knowledgeable? I think not.
I have found many on this forum to be quite superior over the “technicians” at the dealer.
Secondly, many times the dealer will not attempt to help one find a solution over the phone as they have no way to charge the customer so the recourse is to the manufacturer, if they respond.

I no longer own a Keystone product but I have had a less than satisfying experience with their “customer assistance” program.
With the RV I now own I have found the need to contact the manufacturer with excellent results. Timely responses.
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Old 09-16-2021, 08:51 AM   #14
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This is why the dealer you deal with makes ALL the difference. Shop for a good dealer first. They are hard to find. Keystone also doesn’t have the reputation they should have, and should help the end user more than they do. I hope they get an ear full at the rally. Perhaps folks will get some positive responses to their issues.
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:04 AM   #15
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Hello, is this Johnson GMC Service Department? Let me talk to your fuel injection tech. I’ve got a little cold-start problem on damp mornings in my Dirty-Max!
Uh huh, like that’s going to happen.
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:22 AM   #16
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The price of the Keystone camper includes warranty repairs as outlined specifically in the warranty. It does not include "tech support" over the phone with a shop technician.
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:23 AM   #17
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Speaking of two batteries, I will say when we picked up our Cougar just over a year ago, there were two battery boxes and two batteries installed therein. However, on a rig with the factory OTG package I would have expected somewhat better batteries. At least a pair of group 27s. Nope. I got two AutoZone group 24 dual purpose batteries. And the jumper wires from the secondary battery to the primary was a pair of 10 gauge wires! I left them in the boxes until this spring. I then swapped out the boxes and batteries for a pair is Napa 6 volt deep cycle golf cart batteries. I used the factory hot wire, roughly 2 gauge, for the connection from the battery bank to the trailer, the factory ground wire as my jumper from the primary to the secondary, and replaced the ground wire with a 4 gauge automotive type 42 inch long ground cable to go from the secondary battery to the trailer frame. All works well. And having the twin 6 volts units wired in series, we were able to go over Memorial day weekend boondocking and never had to unload or start the generator.
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:29 AM   #18
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This is why the dealer you deal with makes ALL the difference. Shop for a good dealer first. They are hard to find. Keystone also doesn’t have the reputation they should have, and should help the end user more than they do. I hope they get an ear full at the rally. Perhaps folks will get some positive responses to their issues.
My perspective, for what it's worth: If you compare Keystone and Grand Designs, you'll find that GD is much more "helpful when you call". GD staffs their customer service department differently than Keystone. They also "factor in a much greater percentage of MSRP to be allocated for warranty work than Keystone....

As an hypothetical example: Keystone markets a 26' mid grade ultralight travel trailer for $35000. They calculate warranty claims of 3%. That's $1050 they can spend on that trailer and still not cut their profit margin. Let's say that's "Keystone's business model"....

Now, GD builds essentially the same trailer, using the same equipment, the same labor force in the same type plant. Their "cost to build" is going to be the same as Keystone's cost. But, they market their trailer at $41000, about 15% more than Keystone. They "know" that it's going to cost around the same "warranty costs" to repair their trailer as it does to repair the Keystone trailer. BUT, they have an additional $5000 to invest in "superior customer service and eager warranty repairs".... To them, it's a "customer perception that's worth the investment in increased MSRP." That's a "different business model"....

To the customer who has problems with his GD trailer, the perception is that GD's warranty is better. In reality, he paid a big chunk of change to get that warranty.

If you have a "problem trailer, the faster, easier to deal with warranty may seem a good deal. To the person who buys either brand and doesn't ever return to the dealership for warranty and never writes the factory about problems, there's a certain "lure of saving money" that comes with the Keystone business model.

I'd suppose that for someone who does their own maintenance and repairs, Keystone is a much better "investment"... On the other hand, someone who "expects an automotive warranty experience", maybe paying more for a GD may keep their expectations in the positive arena...

Bottom line is that for nearly every trailer, the Keystone warranty is going to fix things that break. The reality is that it's likely to take longer, with more frustration and more "owner involvement" than with the GD business model, but, you pay $5000 less with those frustrations... The "value for what you get" is an individual consideration.... Some prefer the eager to help attitude and are willing to pay for it. Some prefer to save the money. For them, the frustration is worth the savings....

Problem is, most people never look at any "situational picture" wider than their broken trim molding and think, "Keystone doesn't care".....
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:48 AM   #19
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The price of the Keystone camper includes warranty repairs as outlined specifically in the warranty. It does not include "tech support" over the phone with a shop technician.
Half of the calls would be about “ how do I wire up solar panels/ inverters? Can you walk me through it? ….I got plenty of time ….yes I am familiar with electrical procedures! ….What’s a multimeter?

They would need a staff devoted to just dealing with stupid questions
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Old 09-16-2021, 01:30 PM   #20
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We have the OTG package with 2000 watt inverter, enjoy the inverter AFTER I bought $58 remote switch. Leaving inverter on was draining my batteries and then if I didn't use for 3 days it turned itself off, when I wanted to use it... our remote switch fixes all...
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