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Old 03-07-2015, 11:57 AM   #21
denverpilot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron View Post
Dealers are so overwhelmed with warranty work because these things we spend big bucks for are built like junk...

This. When you sell junk you have to service junk. I don't think the industry has really figured that out yet. They're right in the middle of learning that pain right now. Dealers are getting slowly and continuously hurt and their profits eaten and are slowly losing customers to the unintended bad faith stuff that happens when the dealer is pitted against the manufacturer.

Example: Keystone won't be my first choice to replace my trailer someday or upgrade. Why? The roof issue I just had. Warranty didn't cover it, trailer less than a year old, roof peeled back from the front attachment points. Hey I'm a big boy and I wrote the check and fixed it... But am I going to put Keystone on the top of my "they make me happy" list of things in life? Not a chance.

Dealers are in a tough spot. Not too many non-junk brands out there anymore...

I'm a relative latecomer to the new RV game, after all the bankruptcies and mergers, but I know what the build quality of my grandparent's and parent's units were.

The build quality of mine isn't even close. It looks nicer inside and is a lot lighter than theirs, so I can tow something bigger than they could, but no way mine lasts as long as the previous units in the family.

(Grandparents had an Aspen TT and wife's parents had a pre-cheap Coleman. Both lasted decades. Multiple. With minimal work on them. Both were overbuilt and heavy as heck for what they were. In fact the poor Coleman rolled down the road and was useable from 1983 or 4 until two or three years ago. It literally self-destructed on its last trip
and was towed to the dump by my brother in law. Not kidding. We took our honeymoon in it and this year is our 15th anniversary. It was over a decade old when we did that trip. Toward the end, the Coleman needed $100 worth of work or parts annually. Maybe $150.)

I just dropped a check worth 10% of the entire cost of my 5er to fix the roof. It wasn't $150. And it's a year old. It does that every year? I'm out.

Worse than a boat. Or an airplane. And I have an airplane. I avoid owning boats like the plague.

There weren't any cheesy stories about "Dicor cracks" destroying the whole leading edge of the roof on the Aspen or the Coleman, but they had a real darn roof made out of aluminum that wrapped around and no one expected some fancy caulk to maintain the integrity of the entire roof system. The Aspen never leaked and the Coleman leaked after hail punched 50 or more holes in the aluminum one summer, but the sealant we put in the holes lasted years and years before we had to do it again.

Check the Dicor garbage quarterly?! YGBKM.

I will now, of course, but my past experiences with TTs didn't prepare me properly for this significantly lower quality junk.

II'll stay on top of it (pun intended) now that I know what a dealer has to charge now to do a repair.

Junk is junk. And this stuff really is, junk. Junk can be maintained, it just takes more work.
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Old 03-07-2015, 12:20 PM   #22
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typical deal with many dealers.

as for your idea about a law dealing with this, there is a law called, 'take it to another center.' that is about all you can do other than complain to other people about poor service.
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Old 03-07-2015, 12:29 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denverpilot View Post
This. When you sell junk you have to service junk. I don't think the industry has really figured that out yet. They're right in the middle of learning that pain right now. Dealers are getting slowly and continuously hurt and their profits eaten and are slowly losing customers to the unintended bad faith stuff that happens when the dealer is pitted against the manufacturer.

Example: Keystone won't be my first choice to replace my trailer someday or upgrade. Why? The roof issue I just had. Warranty didn't cover it, trailer less than a year old, roof peeled back from the front attachment points. Hey I'm a big boy and I wrote the check and fixed it... But am I going to put Keystone on the top of my "they make me happy" list of things in life? Not a chance.

Dealers are in a tough spot. Not too many non-junk brands out there anymore...

I'm a relative latecomer to the new RV game, after all the bankruptcies and mergers, but I know what the build quality of my grandparent's and parent's units were.

The build quality of mine isn't even close. It looks nicer inside and is a lot lighter than theirs, so I can tow something bigger than they could, but no way mine lasts as long as the previous units in the family.

(Grandparents had an Aspen TT and wife's parents had a pre-cheap Coleman. Both lasted decades. Multiple. With minimal work on them. Both were overbuilt and heavy as heck for what they were. In fact the poor Coleman rolled down the road and was useable from 1983 or 4 until two or three years ago. It literally self-destructed on its last trip
and was towed to the dump by my brother in law. Not kidding. We took our honeymoon in it and this year is our 15th anniversary. It was over a decade old when we did that trip. Toward the end, the Coleman needed $100 worth of work or parts annually. Maybe $150.)

I just dropped a check worth 10% of the entire cost of my 5er to fix the roof. It wasn't $150. And it's a year old. It does that every year? I'm out.

Worse than a boat. Or an airplane. And I have an airplane. I avoid owning boats like the plague.

There weren't any cheesy stories about "Dicor cracks" destroying the whole leading edge of the roof on the Aspen or the Coleman, but they had a real darn roof made out of aluminum that wrapped around and no one expected some fancy caulk to maintain the integrity of the entire roof system. The Aspen never leaked and the Coleman leaked after hail punched 50 or more holes in the aluminum one summer, but the sealant we put in the holes lasted years and years before we had to do it again.

Check the Dicor garbage quarterly?! YGBFKM.

I will now, of course, but my past experiences with TTs didn't prepare me properly for this significantly lower quality junk.

II'll stay on top of it (pun intended) now that I know what a dealer has to charge now to do a repair.

Junk is junk. And this stuff really is, junk. Junk can be maintained, it just takes more work.
If your unit was under a year old, this should have been a warranty repair unless there was a sign of impact/damage.

I have to repectfully disagree with your assesment of quality on the older units. I sell between 350-400 new and pre-owned RV's every year and quite honestly, it is rare that we get any brand of older (1970's-1980's) that has not leaked.
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Old 03-07-2015, 01:57 PM   #24
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I've got a 2 year old boat I ain't done anything to, a Grand Cherokee that has been trouble free, a F350 that has only needed a free reprogaming, a Corvette that has had one minor recall and a new Montana that I couldn't use for 5 months because of an incompetent dealer. I've spent upwards of $2,000 out of my pocket to make it useable. It's getting a wet bolt kit now so I won't be stuck in the middle of nowhere with broke down springs.
I'm giving it 5 years max. Sell for a loss, lick my wounds, stay in a Hilton.
You can bet few congress people own RV's or it would be very different.
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Old 03-07-2015, 02:36 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denverpilot View Post
This. When you sell junk you have to service junk. I don't think the industry has really figured that out yet. They're right in the middle of learning that pain right now. Dealers are getting slowly and continuously hurt and their profits eaten and are slowly losing customers to the unintended bad faith stuff that happens when the dealer is pitted against the manufacturer.

Example: Keystone won't be my first choice to replace my trailer someday or upgrade. Why? The roof issue I just had. Warranty didn't cover it, trailer less than a year old, roof peeled back from the front attachment points. Hey I'm a big boy and I wrote the check and fixed it... But am I going to put Keystone on the top of my "they make me happy" list of things in life? Not a chance.

Dealers are in a tough spot. Not too many non-junk brands out there anymore...

I'm a relative latecomer to the new RV game, after all the bankruptcies and mergers, but I know what the build quality of my grandparent's and parent's units were.

The build quality of mine isn't even close. It looks nicer inside and is a lot lighter than theirs, so I can tow something bigger than they could, but no way mine lasts as long as the previous units in the family.

(Grandparents had an Aspen TT and wife's parents had a pre-cheap Coleman. Both lasted decades. Multiple. With minimal work on them. Both were overbuilt and heavy as heck for what they were. In fact the poor Coleman rolled down the road and was useable from 1983 or 4 until two or three years ago. It literally self-destructed on its last trip
and was towed to the dump by my brother in law. Not kidding. We took our honeymoon in it and this year is our 15th anniversary. It was over a decade old when we did that trip. Toward the end, the Coleman needed $100 worth of work or parts annually. Maybe $150.)

I just dropped a check worth 10% of the entire cost of my 5er to fix the roof. It wasn't $150. And it's a year old. It does that every year? I'm out.

Worse than a boat. Or an airplane. And I have an airplane. I avoid owning boats like the plague.

There weren't any cheesy stories about "Dicor cracks" destroying the whole leading edge of the roof on the Aspen or the Coleman, but they had a real darn roof made out of aluminum that wrapped around and no one expected some fancy caulk to maintain the integrity of the entire roof system. The Aspen never leaked and the Coleman leaked after hail punched 50 or more holes in the aluminum one summer, but the sealant we put in the holes lasted years and years before we had to do it again.

Check the Dicor garbage quarterly?! YGBKM.

I will now, of course, but my past experiences with TTs didn't prepare me properly for this significantly lower quality junk.

II'll stay on top of it (pun intended) now that I know what a dealer has to charge now to do a repair.

Junk is junk. And this stuff really is, junk. Junk can be maintained, it just takes more work.
Nailed it!

I have been messing around with RV's for close to 40 years. Rebuilt more than a few. Funny thing is even the so called "quality" units from years ago had issues, but you fixed them and moved on. There are a few units today that are somewhat better built than others, good luck on finding them. People today want features and shop price... they get what they want... Quality Price Features pick two.

I was just thinking about my first TT... it was a 1970's Pathfinder. Used it for deer camp and beach camping. It had its issues, but it was dead simple and easy to fix. They were notorious for having the rear wall rot out, but you could peel the siding back and replace the rotten framing add some sealant and be good to go for another 15 years.

I have had a couple of vintage Airstreams too... my 1975 was built by a bunch of stoners, whole series of screwups, but at least it didn't leak... much.

Aaron
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Old 03-07-2015, 03:52 PM   #26
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I am wondering what rehashing existing or past issues others may have had with their dealer and/or Keystone does to provide any constructive suggestions for the problems outlined by socalhd, the OP. It seems that he is now, after a very lengthy and frustrating wait, on his way to having his problems finally resolved by the dealership.

I'm not sure what, if anything, is being accomplished by these series of posts in which members describe their own problems - some of which have appeared on the forum earlier. We have heard about unresponsive, incompetent and uncaring dealerships. We've heard about the shoddy workmanship from Keystone. Maybe it's time for the negativity and "ranting" to stop and wait for socalhd, the OP, to get back to us with a concluding report and hopefully a final and positive resolution to his issues.
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Old 03-08-2015, 06:54 AM   #27
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We did not buy from Camping World but have used them from South Carolina to Arizona with mostly good results. The one that was not great was in a small town in Northern AZ in the winter when they were snowed in part of the time. They had a lot of employee turnover but did manage to get our warranty work done without a lot of hassle. The others were great.
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Old 03-08-2015, 05:46 PM   #28
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Hook it up to your truck and drag it out in front of the dealership with a sign that says "ask me how I'm getting treated". See if that gets any movement...
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Old 03-08-2015, 06:58 PM   #29
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He was apologetic and did not make any excuses, nor did he try to deny his Service Advisor dropped the ball and let the rig sit for 2 weeks. Some of the issues have now been fixed but they need to find out what happened to the original warranty claim and parts that were ordered. He has his best tech on it and will stay on it. He gave me his phone number and email and assured me he will do a better job of keeping me informed. Hopefully we will reach a timely resolution.
Stew -

What could possibly be gained by him driving his rig up to the dealership with a sign that says "Ask me how I am getting treated"? At this point, it seems that the dealership is now actively involved and committed to getting socalhd's issues "fixed" as well as trying to make amends for the mistakes they made. It looks like there has been some "movement" that doesn't involve the OP having to haul his RV down to the dealership and park it there with some sarcastic sign on it.
Let's just wait for socalhd to fill us in on how this all ends rather than offer suggestions that would do nothing more than to sour the relationship that has finally been made between socalhd and the dealer.
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Old 03-09-2015, 05:54 PM   #30
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Socalhd..is the dealer located in San Marcos by any chance?..I just dropped mine off for some warranity work this morning
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Old 03-09-2015, 06:40 PM   #31
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Socalhd..is the dealer located in San Marcos by any chance?..I just dropped mine off for some warranity work this morning
I am holding off identifying the Dealership Publicly.
And to all thanks for the support. Camping World is not involved other than being across from this Dealer.
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Old 03-09-2015, 11:11 PM   #32
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if you had a problem that was about a year old montana would have responded to it. i've had numerous problems over the years and montana, with sometimes numerous phone calls, has responded positively to my issues.

sorry about your issue but the quality of rvs is all the same to me.
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Old 03-10-2015, 06:24 AM   #33
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Hey all, just to be clear. My thread here was not intended to blast Keystone or their product. I purchased the rig with eyes wide open knowing these are houses on wheels and things move. Camping World is in no way involved with this issue and at this point it appears the problem has narrowed to a Single Employee within this Dealership.
I've already received 2 follow up emails from the Manager.
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Old 03-11-2015, 09:24 AM   #34
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So moving Forward, the Manager has been keeping me updated. Unfortunately it all has to start over and a new warranty claim has been sent to Keystone to be reviewed. I have no idea how long this will take.
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Old 03-11-2015, 02:37 PM   #35
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I'm glad to hear you are getting it worked out. I can relate to tthe frustration you must have been experiencing.
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Old 03-11-2015, 10:35 PM   #36
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So moving Forward, the Manager has been keeping me updated. Unfortunately it all has to start over and a new warranty claim has been sent to Keystone to be reviewed. I have no idea how long this will take.
On this note the thread will be closed until socalhd requests the Moderators re-open it so that he can submit a final report on the resolution of the issues he has had with his RV. We hope that the claim is dealt with in a timely manner and resolves the problems he has had to his satisfaction.
Thank you for your participation.
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Old 04-02-2015, 10:20 PM   #37
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Here we go/venting --- Update

Moderator's Note -
The OP has requested that the thread be reopened so that he can post an update on the issues that he reported on earlier in the thread.

The thread will be reopened to allow socalhd to submit a concluding update.
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Old 04-03-2015, 09:00 AM   #38
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Looking for a good outcome for you SoCal
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Old 04-03-2015, 09:56 PM   #39
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After 6 weeks in their shop I got her back yesterday. The rig was completely detailed including a Cleaned roof. The Service Manager was outstanding thru the process once I was able to reach him. Most of the work has been completed but they identified some other issues Mostly cosmetic they want to fix but waiting on those parts. They sent a warranty claim in on the front door warped but that had to go thru Lippert. They got that approval yesterday but unkown when those parts will arrive.
Realizing this rig has been sitting for awhile the Service Manager had the shop perform an axle service at no cost to me.
We are out in the desert with it right now on another shake down run. Happy to have it back.
1 other note. The Manager said they will come and pick up the rig. When parts arrive and deliver it when the work is done.
All is good.
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Old 04-04-2015, 06:38 AM   #40
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socalhd -
Glad to hear that your issues were solved and that your dealer came through for you.
A happy ending for all and an appropriate way to "close the curtain" on this thread.
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