Changes Coming for RV Parks??

**sourdough** · 06-07-2021, 12:10 PM

Here is a link to an article in yesterdays RV Travel newsletter. The information is interesting and concerning. Might be time to hit the road and camp....while we can still can - or can afford it.

https://www.rvtravel.com/andy1003/

Weldon · 06-07-2021, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sourdough

Here is a link to an article in yesterdays RV Travel newsletter. The information is interesting and concerning. Might be time to hit the road and camp....while we can still can - or can afford it.

https://www.rvtravel.com/andy1003/

That is truly scary. Thankfully one of our favorite places to stay (Wind Creek in AL) still have full hookups for $25 (give or take) a night. Granted there are 500+ spots, so it's a bit busy.

Our other favorite is Jekyll Island, our favorite annual spot. Almost double the price of Wind Creek, but there are 2/3 less campers and the entire island has a max capacity. We normally go in Sept (out of season) but this time we're going in June. I expect our experience will be quite different this year.

dutchmensport · 06-07-2021, 12:36 PM

I don't see where this specific article is casting new light on anything. This practice has been going on for many decades already, it just wasn't hitting campgrounds.

Around central Indiana, especially the counties around Indianapolis, growing up as a kid, I was surrounded on all side, and one could drive for miles and miles over roads with fields everywhere, corn, bean, and wheat. Thousands upon thousands of acers of fields. Back country roads, and occasionally, a car coming the opposite direction.

Fast forward, and those old-time farmers who worked their land beside their parents and now they inherited the farm, are tired and old themselves. Along comes some one who offers to buy-up 500 acres, a thousand acres for a million dollars. The offer is too great! It would take 20 years of back-breaking work in the hot sun (if they lived that long) to clear even a small percentage of that. Why not take the money and run!

So, farm after farm after farm sold out. Investor after investor swallowed up that land. They in-turn turned it over to a developer who developed all that wonderful open country into shopping malls, strip malls, businesses, and housing complexes, Home owner associations, more schools, more churches, more ... everything.

Now, driving from down-town Indianapolis to my mother's old house, you never know when you left Indianapolis and the conglomerate of a senseless hoard of roaches running in every direction imaginable.

And this is only one geographical region of the country. There are thousands and thousands of similar communities where the same thing has happened. And does anyone blame the working stiff for selling out, clearing a few million dollars and being able to live freer without all the financial responsibility that does nothing but lead to an early grave! Shoot no!

Especially with the changes in our society that have occurred over the last year with the pendamic, the RV industry has skyrocketed. And now the local mom-and-pop campgrounds are feeling the hard blunt of REAL RV ownership! Their ultimate dream has become reality! Every campsite filled, every night of the year! But at what cost? A LOT of added responsibility, frustration, planning, repairs, and adjustments than they every imagined. Given a chance to bail out, gain a retirement in the process ... why not?

But wait! Once the pandemic is declaimed no longer a pandemic, how many will return to the bowing allies, the bars and the night clubs and abandon their RV's, leaving their kids with baby sitters again! Campgrounds will begin to empty out again. Then those big time investors will be looking to sell again!

The bottom line is still the same.... If you don't like the policies established by local campground management, you don't have to patronize them. If enough people would do the same, their management would get the idea that their policies are not working, lower prices, change their pricing practices, and work to bring customers back. (or sell out themselves).

**flybouy** · 06-07-2021, 01:58 PM

Mom and Pop cgs are going the way of the dinasaurs. Nothing new, it's been happenenig to many buisnesses. Large companies like WalMart, or Target ran out the little stores long ago. Same with HD and Lowes ran outthe little hardware stores. Sunnhas boght out many desirable cgs and we camp in some of them. From my observation it's good and bad. I don't like the proliferation of cabins but from what I've seen they do make a lot of overdue improvments to the infastructure of the property.

I don't get to enjoy a $25 site out here in the Mid Atlantic region that's for sure but the increases haven't been that bad. If you want sticker shock go looking for a storage lot. We just did this as our daughjter is selling her house (where we did store it) and the sites for storage are few and far between. Luckily we found a very isolates place not far awqy for $85 a month. Yes, that is a bargin around here as we were quoted an average of $120 - $140 IF they have a space become available. Indoor storage? Are you ready for this? Over $500, no electric.

The same issue effecting the cg are thye ones storage lots face. The land becomes more valuable as it's developed around them. Thjere are other factors of course, family inherited buisnesses are no longer attractive to the offspring of the owners. Who wants to work 18 hrs a day, shoulder all the responsabiity of running a small buisness and put up with restrictive regulations when they can join the 9 to 5 corporate world for 6 figures with benefits?

Campgrounds are going the way of the small private airports. Then packed up and sold out in the late 1980's early 1990's. The only way for most small independent shops to survive is if they offer a niche service. There's a small shoe repair shop that we have used for 35 + years. The owner's father ran it and he keeps it going because he specializes in the need for people to have one shoe built up to compensate for leg length disrepancies or to accomondate a brace. It's nearly impossible to find an independent fuel station, tire shop, clothing store, autoparts store, etc.

**sourdough** · 06-07-2021, 01:58 PM

You are correct in that this sort of thing, in the bigger scope (outside RV campgrounds), has been going on for years. As the numbers of RV owners, read campground users, continues to spiral upward, the takeaway is that these things may come in the sights of "big business"; those megabuck companies that exist only to make profit....not take care of campers or their needs. We see it all the time in the corporate world.

We stay at owner operated RV parks almost exclusively. We like it that way. We do stay at KOAs from time to time but that is the exception. I think any evolution toward "daily rates", or demand pricing, is a bad thing for RVers in general - at least to me since I plan all my trips ahead. Anyway, it was food for thought.

notanlines · 06-07-2021, 02:20 PM

Right along the same line, DW and I stopped at Silver Palms in Okeechobee (another Sunland RV owned park) just last Thursday. A very nice young lady told us a lot in their park, full hookups, is $1575 plus electric averaging $75-$100 per month. Any takers? We're paying 1/3 of that at the other end of town (the medical district more or less) but we have no pool or gates. Hmmmm

**flybouy** · 06-07-2021, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notanlines

Right along the same line, DW and I stopped at Silver Palms in Okeechobee (another Sunland RV owned park) just last Thursday. A very nice young lady told us a lot in their park, full hookups, is $1575 plus electric averaging $75-$100 per month. Any takers? We're paying 1/3 of that at the other end of town (the medical district more or less) but we have no pool or gates. Hmmmm

Wow, Yogi Bear campgrounds around here charge $80 to $100 or more PER NIGHT!

**sourdough** · 06-07-2021, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notanlines

Right along the same line, DW and I stopped at Silver Palms in Okeechobee (another Sunland RV owned park) just last Thursday. A very nice young lady told us a lot in their park, full hookups, is $1575 plus electric averaging $75-$100 per month. Any takers? We're paying 1/3 of that at the other end of town (the medical district more or less) but we have no pool or gates. Hmmmm

What I worry about is that the hungry corporations look at the cash cow that the RV campground business could become they will be incentivized by the sales stats, few campgrounds being built and the knowledge that many campground owners want out so they don't have to deal with the growing problems. Then we will have what you experienced on steroids. The opportunities are there and as they take them over the rates will climb; as they do the private owners will follow suit etc.

As far as an 80-100 a night example we've paid that but that is nightly. Most places offer highly discounted (from nightly) monthly rates. Nightly rates at Yogi Bear Hill Country outside San Antonio are 82 a night but in comparison to your example they are $503 mo. plus electric so big difference, and no, I'm not a taker.

77cruiser · 06-07-2021, 05:46 PM

Stayed at one Yogi campground only because it was on the way. I sure didn't see anything special about it.

Jim2366 · 06-07-2021, 08:17 PM

I think the individually owned campgrounds competition is State Parks and government Recreation areas. They have 100's of acres, lakes and they can stay operating even if they lose money.

Wing-in-it · 06-08-2021, 12:41 AM

Give it time, with the new administration in office and the rising cost of fuel and inflation, I believe the RV industry is going to crash along with the campgrounds. I pray not…..but the writing is on the wall.

notanlines · 06-08-2021, 02:16 AM

Mark, we'll put your name on the list of all those people who said the industry is going to crash as soon as the pandemic is over and the people with new RV's will be dumping them at pennies on the dollar. I'm holding my breath.

wiredgeorge · 06-08-2021, 03:32 AM

Many RVs are like exercise bikes you see stashed in people's garages. Bought on a whim and then not used. The RV is a MUCH larger ticket item so goes unsold because the owner discoverers the delightful fact of depreciation. I think the china flu had people buying out of boredom who were looking for a wholesome way to pass the time rather than sit in their basement and once things are back to normal the buying frenzy will abate but they will have huge investments sitting in their driveway they can't afford to sell because they are so far upside down in the camper's value. I do think their will be a glut of RVs but perhaps down the road a bit as folks realize they are not using that thing in their driveway.

Laredo Tugger · 06-08-2021, 04:31 AM

Corporate investors are like criminals (some literally) that wait for the perfect opportunity to act. Obviously now is the time to act, with skyrocketing sales of RVs comes the question at a board meeting, "Where will these people use their RVs?" and hence you have this article, albeit from an owners perspective.
With the overwhelming demand comes the (easier) opportunity for change. The re-shaping of an industry so to speak. Nothing new, just not what we were expecting.
I feel very fortunate to have recently purchased a parcel in a dedicated RV subdivision. It is located about 2 hours from home and is few minutes from beautiful beaches. My trailer will be parked this "towing season" and I will get to enjoy it without a high cost per night fee, someone's kids or dogs running around the place, boom box music I do not care to listen to, and, well you get the idea. For the same cost as 3 nights in a popular nearby park I can pay my full utility bills for a month. I do not know how I got so lucky to "disengage" from this looming campground fiasco at a perfect time and I am not trying to brag, but like I said just fortunate I guess.
RMc

gearhead · 06-08-2021, 04:45 AM

We try to stay in government parks as much as possible. If we need just a 1 nighter I'll stop at something that is easy to get in and out of.
I do agree that the trend is very much anti-RV. We are seen as wasting resources to build the RV and to get it down the road. If 20 somethings are into traveling and camping they seem to gravitate towards the small teardrop trailers and converted vans.
With oil prices climbing, with government blessings, we will be dinosaurs.

**flybouy** · 06-08-2021, 04:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laredo Tugger

Corporate investors are like criminals (some literally) that wait for the perfect opportunity to act. Obviously now is the time to act, with skyrocketing sales of RVs comes the question at a board meeting, "Where will these people use their RVs?" and hence you have this article, albeit from an owners perspective.
With the overwhelming demand comes the (easier) opportunity for change. The re-shaping of an industry so to speak. Nothing new, just not what we were expecting.
I feel very fortunate to have recently purchased a parcel in a dedicated RV subdivision. It is located about 2 hours from home and is few minutes from beautiful beaches. My trailer will be parked this "towing season" and I will get to enjoy it without a high cost per night fee, someone's kids or dogs running around the place, boom box music I do not care to listen to, and, well you get the idea. For the same cost as 3 nights in a popular nearby park I can pay my full utility bills for a month. I do not know how I got so lucky to "disengage" from this looming campground fiasco at a perfect time and I am not trying to brag, but like I said just fortunate I guess.
RMc

Some corporate investigators are criminals but that has jo bearing on this discussion. What they are doing is just huisness and capitalism. This happens everyday and everyone with a 401k or retirement plan are happy when it does. Jo one is holding a gun to a cg owner msking them sellout. I'm happy for your good fortune in finding your "ideal site" but don’t take it for granted. It can be gone without warning.

There's a marina near me that was privately owned since the 1960s. I kept various boats there for several decades. We sold our boat and stopped boating but one day all the boat owners there received a letter stating they were closing and any boat not removed in 30 days would be sold. All those folks thought they had a "forever" spot. The propery sat vacant for several years before being sold and reopened in late 2019. Then Covid and I guess they couldn't take last years losses as it's again closed.

Javi · 06-08-2021, 05:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

Many RVs are like exercise bikes you see stashed in people's garages. Bought on a whim and then not used. The RV is a MUCH larger ticket item so goes unsold because the owner discoverers the delightful fact of depreciation. I think the china flu had people buying out of boredom who were looking for a wholesome way to pass the time rather than sit in their basement and once things are back to normal the buying frenzy will abate but they will have huge investments sitting in their driveway they can't afford to sell because they are so far upside down in the camper's value. I do think their will be a glut of RVs but perhaps down the road a bit as folks realize they are not using that thing in their driveway.

I know that I stayed up until past midnight on the 25th of May so that I could book a spot in our favorite COE park for Thanksgiving... There are 14 sites that are full hookup.

At 11:58pm the 25th they were blocked and at 12:01am the 26th they were all booked...

What are the odds that there were 14 people with their finger poised to hit the enter key at exactly 12:0001 am

Two years ago before the China Virus, you could pretty much book a site for the weekend on Thursday afternoon... and now you are having to stay up until midnight exactly 6 months in advance to MAYBE get a site...

**sourdough** · 06-08-2021, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laredo Tugger

Corporate investors are like criminals (some literally) that wait for the perfect opportunity to act. Obviously now is the time to act, with skyrocketing sales of RVs comes the question at a board meeting, "Where will these people use their RVs?" and hence you have this article, albeit from an owners perspective.
With the overwhelming demand comes the (easier) opportunity for change. The re-shaping of an industry so to speak. Nothing new, just not what we were expecting.
I feel very fortunate to have recently purchased a parcel in a dedicated RV subdivision. It is located about 2 hours from home and is few minutes from beautiful beaches. My trailer will be parked this "towing season" and I will get to enjoy it without a high cost per night fee, someone's kids or dogs running around the place, boom box music I do not care to listen to, and, well you get the idea. For the same cost as 3 nights in a popular nearby park I can pay my full utility bills for a month. I do not know how I got so lucky to "disengage" from this looming campground fiasco at a perfect time and I am not trying to brag, but like I said just fortunate I guess.
RMc

We've done the same thing (owned a beautiful piece of property we could use) in several places. The problem for us is that it's fun....for a while, then it gets pretty boring going to the same place every time you want to "go somewhere new" but it reality you're not going anywhere, just to the same old place that you know inside out, where you exhausted the "new" years ago.

Javi · 06-08-2021, 05:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sourdough

We've done the same thing (owned a beautiful piece of property we could use) in several places. The problem for us is that it's fun....for a while, then it gets pretty boring going to the same place every time you want to "go somewhere new" but it reality you're not going anywhere, just to the same old place that you know inside out, where you exhausted the "new" years ago.

Yep.. I've owned 2 different lake properties (houses) and 2 different ranch properties... After a while it's just like staying home, just the other house...

We said when we sold the last ranch that that was it for us... we want to go different places when we're ready to go different places..

now the problem is getting a spot...

Laredo Tugger · 06-08-2021, 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flybouy

Some corporate investigators are criminals but that has jo bearing on this discussion. What they are doing is just huisness and capitalism. This happens everyday and everyone with a 401k or retirement plan are happy when it does. Jo one is holding a gun to a cg owner msking them sellout. I'm happy for your good fortune in finding your "ideal site" but don’t take it for granted. It can be gone without warning.

There's a marina near me that was privately owned since the 1960s. I kept various boats there for several decades. We sold our boat and stopped boating but one day all the boat owners there received a letter stating they were closing and any boat not removed in 30 days would be sold. All those folks thought they had a "forever" spot. The propery sat vacant for several years before being sold and reopened in late 2019. Then Covid and I guess they couldn't take last years losses as it's again closed.

My parcel is "privately owned", by me. I have certified title on the parcel.
The business practices of Walmat, Target, HD and Lowes are pertinent to this discussion how? Wouldn't you say that narrative is the same as corporate strategies?
As for being bored in "the same place". I have towed two trailers for 5 years around most of this country and I am not done, my trailer can roll at anytime. Just thinking if I am going to take a season off, this (year) would be the one.
RMc

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