"Payloads"

[CWtheMan]

Those of you that follow any of my postings must know by now that I stick the regulations and study and update my responses as regulations and standards change.
In this thread the facts are always muddied because the general facts are unknown. All the years we traveled hauling a fiver we were licensed and had vehicle registrations from FL. Our home of record was FL. Generally speaking, the laws of the home state are honored by all other states.

Vehicle ratings are not set by the USA DOT. The vehicle builder sets them. There may be numerous weak links that are equal. Seldom is a consumer in a position to know all of them. When the vehicle manufacturers set GVWR/GAWRs, that’s it. They then can only be changed by the vehicle manufacturer or a certified vehicle modifier. Generally all GAWRs are set with spare load capacity reserves. Those reserves are intended to protect the vehicle and are not something that are extra because when used as extra something else is going to be overweight.

A tire load capacity does not cause a wheel to carry extra weight. To get an OE wheel to be overloaded, the GAWR will be overloaded.

The regulation for RV trailer MAX weight is very simple and is listed something like this in the standard: The vehicle manufacturer's recommended tongue weight, when added to the vehicle's total GAWR weights must be equal to or greater than vehicle GVWR. Here is a reference to the actual wording: FMVSS 571.120 paragraph S10.2 On RV trailers, the sum of the GAWRs of all axles on the vehicle plus the vehicle manufacturer's recommended tongue weight must not be less than the GVWR.

Remember, brand names are not mentioned in FMVSS standards. In the eyes of the regulation writers all tires within a size designation and load rating are equal.

The tire designated size depicted on your vehicle tire & load placard or vehicle certification label are the same and are the MINIMUM standard for that vehicle. The load capacity they provide will be the minimum for that vehicle as long as the placards are not modified. Therefore, replacements MUST provide (via inflation pressures) a load capacity equal to or greater than what the OE tires provide.

Here is where consumers/installers get confused. All references to tire inflation pressures revolve around the recommended cold inflation pressures for those OE tires. Therefore, when different designated sizes are used as replacements a new recommended cold inflation pressure must be set. It must allow those replacement tires to have a load capacity equal to what the OE tires provided. NHTSA allows the use of auxiliary placards to be used adjacent to the originals to depict the new tire sizes and recommended cold inflation pressures for them. REF: USTMA, easiest, any tire retailer that provides on-line PDFs for replacement tire procedures. TOYO/BRIDGESTONE have the best descriptions.

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by quaddriver

actually, you can change the door stickers. no they dont issue new ones, but you can change what they mean on your paperwork. I cannot speak for other states than PA as I am only licensed to do it in pa, but to my knowledge all other states are similar.


I detailed this before, here, there, everywhere but there are 3 things you have to worry about


1) how much you can drive, and how much you can tow.

the magic numbers for most states are drive 26K or less, tow 10K or less. If you have to exceed this, its a license issue.


2) how much can you weigh - registered weight. You can register down (to save money) or you can register up to haul more. as long as the trailer weight is under what you can pull with your license and what it is registered for, its weight is immaterial to the tow vehicle, other than the imputed tongue or pin weight. You can make your registered weight be above any number on your door sticker. In my state its a couple forms, a few signatures etc etc.



3) axle max. the published axle max's are tough to register over, but you can. My dear ole departed 1990 f150 was possible to register up to PA class 3 (9klbs) ...I dont recommend that on ford 8.8s....but I digress


anything after that you can do if you have a tool set from heck. My 1990

f150 I could have made register the same as a F350 drw by bolting a few things on. ok, a lot of things but coincidentally I happen to know how ;-)



in my state, mis-licensed pinches are the most expensive. but the easiest to fix. just take the test, pay some $$.


If you see a truck/tt on the side being pinched, and it aint for speeding its generally a weight class violation...they are easy to spot. But at the same time, like 3/4s of the big outfits on the road, dont have the right license (but thats ok, like 90% of the cycles on the road aint driven by licensed riders)

Your post states "you can change" that's incorrect. It CAN be changed BY SOME LISCEND TO CHANGE IT. You cannot take it upon yourself to take a sharpie to it because you added a set of airbags. I'd like to see the stat's where you found the data fot that last paragraph.

[wiredgeorge]

I believe this thread topic has been down this road countless times before. Guess no one has changed their minds as the same characters present the same arguments. This is like watching a rerun of the evening news you saw earlier in the evening.

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

I believe this thread topic has been down this road countless times before. Guess no one has changed their minds as the same characters present the same arguments. This is like watching a rerun of the evening news you saw earlier in the evening.

George this is true if you watched the morning news. If you only see the evening news then you are unaware of the repetition. The information is repeated for the benefit of those that are "just tuning in" to use your analogy.

[quaddriver]

Originally Posted by flybouy

Your post states "you can change" that's incorrect. It CAN be changed BY SOME LISCEND TO CHANGE IT. You cannot take it upon yourself to take a sharpie to it because you added a set of airbags. I'd like to see the stat's where you found the data fot that last paragraph.

Yes, YOU can download the forms and YOU can drive to a person like me who has correct license and it will either be done, or will not be done, depending on what you are asking. The rules are allllllllll online. Coincidentally I have the big tool set AND have done it before. Might even do it again. How much you got to spend?


My post was correct. "You can change" indicates events that you can put into motion. Just like 'you can get married', no YOU cant, YOU aint a minister or JP and YOU cannot issue the license, but you can still get married. I suspect you understood the distinction before you hit reply....tell me Im wrong



as for the last paragraph, in order: 1) my brother. 19 year CHP who pinches tow rigs for offenses other than speeding. I would assume his data is correct 2) Z&M HD Greensburg PA who state they almost never sell a bike to those with a license. And 2a) Progressive and nationwide insurance (of which I have both) who assert that very few bike policies they write are for class M holders. I assume THEY know what they are talking about as well.



Lemme guess, you dont have either license? ;-)

[CWtheMan]

Originally Posted by quaddriver

Yes, YOU can download the forms and YOU can drive to a person like me who has correct license and it will either be done, or will not be done, depending on what you are asking. The rules are allllllllll online. Coincidentally I have the big tool set AND have done it before. Might even do it again. How much you got to spend?


My post was correct. "You can change" indicates events that you can put into motion. Just like 'you can get married', no YOU cant, YOU aint a minister or JP and YOU cannot issue the license, but you can still get married. I suspect you understood the distinction before you hit reply....tell me Im wrong



as for the last paragraph, in order: 1) my brother. 19 year CHP who pinches tow rigs for offenses other than speeding. I would assume his data is correct 2) Z&M HD Greensburg PA who state they almost never sell a bike to those with a license. And 2a) Progressive and nationwide insurance (of which I have both) who assert that very few bike policies they write are for class M holders. I assume THEY know what they are talking about as well.



Lemme guess, you dont have either license? ;-)

What you cannot change is the ratings = GAWR or GVWR.

[Ken / Claudia]

CW did a great job explaining. The GVWR and Payload have many moving parts that are frankly confusing. Each state adds to that confusion.
What I mean is since I have been down this roads to many times. Dealers improperly license pickups and light trucks by mistake or fraud. DMV at least in Oregon has workers who do not follow the rules either. Many allow the consumer to tell them what GVWR to register the vehicle.
Than its the cops who need to weed through all that and write tickets that sometimes really upsets the driver/owner.
Even here in Idaho DMV did not really help me. My F350 is GVWR 11500lbs on VIN plate.
Employee asks what I want it licensed at. I say 11500lbs, she says I can give you 15,000lbs license after that it costs extra and yes it has 15,000lbs listed on the registration. If I was stopped and weighted in at 15,000lbs I would expect a overweight ticket.

[quaddriver]

Originally Posted by CWtheMan

What you cannot change is the ratings = GAWR or GVWR.

Yes, GVWR is changed for your registration by using PA form 1005, MV41 or MV4ST and MV1 depending on what how why


GAWR is changed by materially rebuilding the vehicle with higher rated axles (springs, brakes etc, if applicable) and getting a reconstruction inspection from a reconstruction inspection mechanic (current locations online), to re-title at the new higher weight using MV41 and MV1. Not as many people do this as it requires a big tool set and mechanical ability of a little past oil changes and brake jobs.


At the end of either path, the title and vehicle reg will state different values than previously.



This is PA, YMMV in your state and form number etc. FWIW, its probably done the MOST in Cali. The nutball car community builds a lot of stuff...

[markcee]

Originally Posted by Ken / Claudia

Even here in Idaho DMV did not really help me. My F350 is GVWR 11500lbs on VIN plate.
Employee asks what I want it licensed at. I say 11500lbs, she says I can give you 15,000lbs license after that it costs extra and yes it has 15,000lbs listed on the registration. If I was stopped and weighted in at 15,000lbs I would expect a overweight ticket.

When this topic comes us here (and on every other RV and truck forum I read) I can't understand how it's legal and what purpose it serves. Unlike in Ken's example - where he states some clerk's don't follow the rules - I've seen other posts where states routinely allow registration to a higher amount.

There are some forum members (again here and elsewhere) that don't give a hoot about payload capacity - exceed it all you want, just don't exceed the axle rating. Others (myself included) believe that all ratings are there for a reason and you can't pick and choose which to follow.

I understand a licensed shop altering a truck in such a way to legally increase GVWR (and affixing a new ratings plate), but allowing a one-ton SRW to be registered by the DMV at 15K GVWR will certainly cause every manufacturer's rating to be exceeded and if it's not even going to preclude the operator from getting a ticket if pulled over, what is the point in doing so?

I can see being allowed to 'under register' a truck's GVWR, perhaps to save some registration fees. No harm/no foul there. But going up on paper only seems pointless (and potentially dangerous).

[travelin texans]

Originally Posted by quaddriver

Yes, GVWR is changed for your registration by using PA form 1005, MV41 or MV4ST and MV1 depending on what how why


GAWR is changed by materially rebuilding the vehicle with higher rated axles (springs, brakes etc, if applicable) and getting a reconstruction inspection from a reconstruction inspection mechanic (current locations online), to re-title at the new higher weight using MV41 and MV1. Not as many people do this as it requires a big tool set and mechanical ability of a little past oil changes and brake jobs.


At the end of either path, the title and vehicle reg will state different values than previously.



This is PA, YMMV in your state and form number etc. FWIW, its probably done the MOST in Cali. The nutball car community builds a lot of stuff...

Why spend countless $$$$ to rebuild something that wasn't suited to the task when you could most likely spend less on something else that is better suited to handle it to begin with?
And registering something for less on paper with the DMV may save you a little $$ at registration time or register for more that doesn't show where a DOT officer isn't likely to look doesn't make much sense either.
If you buy a 12k+ lb rv buy a truck (it won't be a 1/2 ton of any brand) to handle it!! Don't let some guy rebuild your Ford Focus to haul a 12k lb 5th wheel just because they say they can!

[quaddriver]

Originally Posted by travelin texans

Why spend countless $$$$ to rebuild something that wasn't suited to the task when you could most likely spend less on something else that is better suited to handle it to begin with?
And registering something for less on paper with the DMV may save you a little $$ at registration time or register for more that doesn't show where a DOT officer isn't likely to look doesn't make much sense either.
If you buy a 12k+ lb rv buy a truck (it won't be a 1/2 ton of any brand) to handle it!! Don't let some guy rebuild your Ford Focus to haul a 12k lb 5th wheel just because they say they can!

Easy, a week or so ago I was in the southside on the last 80 degree day, launching Chris for one last swim and while navigating the residential streets (its complicated) I saw a 1980-ish Square K15 pickup, someone converted to a narrow duallie (all wheels within the confines of the bed) with 8 bolt axles. People do this stuff and there are countless examples of people that want more ability.


According to my insurance agent/underwriter...they all ask how many trips you are going to take on the application - your rate is based off that. She insists that by year 5, best intentions be damned, the majority of RV owners dont do 2-3 trips a year. so if you are looking at pennies and gas etc, why buy a full size new truck that starts in the 40's and averages in the high 50s with most luxo versions in the 60's for a couple trips per year? Back in the early 2000's, like very early, gas took off - for good - to high prices. Since I mostly boat in the summer, people are forced to travel with a 15mpg truck to the ramp to pull 2 minutes from storage to water and back. So the new sexy became re-purposing of older vehicles to keep at storage, permanently coupled to the trailer. Since most peoples boats are under 5Klbs on the hoof, used 2wd truck, the extinct full size wagon or even smaller body on frame suvs. So lo and behold, I ended up doing a couple articles for trailer life magazine on turning a $400 purchased full size GM v8 wagon into a dedicated tow vehicle. Ultimately, I restored 6 wagons but the subject of the write up was a 1985 pontiac 'caprice' with the LG4 and another was how to make lighting converter boxes to isolate trailer lights from the vehicle lighting system (mice chew boat trailer wires *a lot*). EVen did a 91 Blahzer LT just to highlight THAT choice. and all thru the first decade, the whole idea was insanely popular. People drove from home/lake in the car and drove the tow vehicle a couple dozen times a year - extremely cost effective. One of the reasons I am using my show truck to pull Betty (we named it finally) is because we mostly camp the anf...my other house is in the middle of it. Even if we do 1 or two bigger trips a year, we will still not likely see 1500 miles a year - the payments on a new truck to do 1500 miles a year when it will likely be rusted before the loan matures? I can refresh a MkIV BBC for about the cost of 1 payment on a new truck....



Personally, I think a 10Klb box...pulled ANY WAY, is the max for 'civilians'. My same ChP bro cleans up a lot of wrecks off the PCH, 101, 5 etc cuz people buy 1 ton 400hp trucks, hook up a 15klb 5th trailer and proceed to storm up the road at 75mph. They always end up in pieces. Its not a matter of if but when.



Anecdote, my last build/restore I did for sale was a 1981 F100. Its build page is still on the ford truck enthusiast site. I upgraded that from a 4700gvw to 5450 using, well, parts from an 89 (springs, new hangers, 3L55 8.8) and we towed our 24ft sunline satellite with it. with a 122hp 300-6 and an SROD! Why? Because I could. You have to know what your limitations are, driver, truck, scenario. Just because you cannot pass people going up the grapevine, does not mean its inadequate.



Im about to commit blashpemy: I generally dont even use sway control. Load it and drive it right, you dont have to. 700lb before WD is more than enough tongue weight on an 8K or less trailer (yes, I know its not even 10%) and if you do load up to 1Klbs on these front passthru trailers (sadly almost all today) then just throw the sway in the river.

[notanlines]

“ why buy a full size new truck that starts in the 40's and averages in the high 50s with most luxo versions in the 60's”
Between this statement and the sway bar comment, your forum cred’s took a terrific hit.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by markcee

When this topic comes us here (and on every other RV and truck forum I read) I can't understand how it's legal and what purpose it serves. Unlike in Ken's example - where he states some clerk's don't follow the rules - I've seen other posts where states routinely allow registration to a higher amount.

There are some forum members (again here and elsewhere) that don't give a hoot about payload capacity - exceed it all you want, just don't exceed the axle rating. Others (myself included) believe that all ratings are there for a reason and you can't pick and choose which to follow.

I understand a licensed shop altering a truck in such a way to legally increase GVWR (and affixing a new ratings plate), but allowing a one-ton SRW to be registered by the DMV at 15K GVWR will certainly cause every manufacturer's rating to be exceeded and if it's not even going to preclude the operator from getting a ticket if pulled over, what is the point in doing so?

I can see being allowed to 'under register' a truck's GVWR, perhaps to save some registration fees. No harm/no foul there. But going up on paper only seems pointless (and potentially dangerous).

I bolded a part of your response and that's the part I want to address, but first, I completely agree with you that vehicle manufacturers design a vehicle to "work within specific criteria" and they define that criteria for a reason. Staying within those limits usually results in safe vehicle operation, although even then, some "things mechanical" will fail. The "intended consequences" most vehicle manufacturers depend on, is that when something mechanical does fail, the remaining parts that aren't overloaded, will still function within their design limits and the outcome won't be a catastrophic failure, but rather a "recoverable event with no casualties"... in other words, when something breaks, the whole clock isn't wound so tight that it all flies apart.....

Now, as for "DMV's allowing higher/lower registrations"....

From what I can tell, most state DMV's will allow an owner to declare and pay as much as they want (within reason)... I can "donate as much money as I want to the state's DMV by declaring any weight rating I want and paying the excess charges... I can license my 3/4 ton truck as a commercial vehicle for hundreds more or register it as a private vehicle for hundreds less.... The "crisis hits the fan" when something happens and my vehicle, although licensed for Y and Z, is only rated by the manufacturer for X.... In other words, being woefully ill prepared for what I'm licensed to do is no excuse to do it anyway....

On the other hand, some states also allow an owner to buy a 15K truck and license it for less capacity, knowing they'll never use it at the highest rating. As an example, a 25000 pound GVW schoolbus that someone is going to convert to a 4 passsenger motorhome. Some DMV's will allow them to register it at 15000 pounds, pay less for registration, and as long as they are under that 15K if stopped and weighed, they're paying for what part of the asphalt they damage.... On the other hand, if they are stopped and weigh 20K, they'd be subject to citation because effectively, they're "stealing road use by damaging the roadway more than they're paying for"... Or something to that affect....

In short, you can "license the vehicle for as much as you want, and it's up to you to assure the vehicle meets all the requirements to work in that capacity, or you can license the vehicle for less than it's rated to do, but if you do that, you can't exceed the declared rating, even though the vehicle is rated for much more than you're paying for in license fees.....

Registering fees and separate from and don't necessarily always align with design limits for vehicles.... Sort of like owning a private acrobatic airplane engineered for +/- 8 g's... That doesn't mean you can't fly grandma to Denver in it without making her pass out doing "High G turns" At the same time, owning a Cessna 172 doesn't mean you can expect the wings to stay on the fuselage if you try to make a 6 g "assault landing at a 600' grass strip on the side of a mountain..... Neither has anything to do with pilot rating or licensing

[CWtheMan]

Originally Posted by quaddriver

Yes, GVWR is changed for your registration by using PA form 1005, MV41 or MV4ST and MV1 depending on what how why


GAWR is changed by materially rebuilding the vehicle with higher rated axles (springs, brakes etc, if applicable) and getting a reconstruction inspection from a reconstruction inspection mechanic (current locations online), to re-title at the new higher weight using MV41 and MV1. Not as many people do this as it requires a big tool set and mechanical ability of a little past oil changes and brake jobs.


At the end of either path, the title and vehicle reg will state different values than previously.



This is PA, YMMV in your state and form number etc. FWIW, its probably done the MOST in Cali. The nutball car community builds a lot of stuff...

No state can over rule the federal regulations. Here they are.

https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-4...ter-V/part-567

[Essvar]

Originally Posted by CWtheMan

No state can over rule the federal regulations. Here they are.

https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-4...ter-V/part-567

This appears to conform with QuadDriver's statements.

§ 567.7 Requirements for persons who alter certified vehicles.

(a) With respect to the vehicle alterations it performs, an alterer:
(1) Has a duty to determine continued conformity of the altered vehicle with applicable Federal motor vehicle safety, Bumper, and Theft Prevention standards, and

(2) Assumes legal responsibility for all duties and liabilities for certification under the Vehicle Safety Act.


(b) The vehicle manufacturer's certification label and any information labels shall remain affixed to the vehicle and the alterer shall affix to the vehicle an additional label in the manner and location specified in § 567.4, in a manner that does not obscure any previously applied labels, and containing the following information:
(1) The statement: “This vehicle was altered by (individual or corporate name) in (month and year in which alterations were completed) and as altered it conforms to all applicable Federal Motor Vehicle Safety, Bumper and Theft Prevention Standards affected by the alteration and in effect in (month, year).” The second date shall be no earlier than the date of manufacture of the certified vehicle (as specified on the certification label), and no later than the date alterations were completed.

(2) If the gross vehicle weight rating or any of the gross axle weight ratings of the vehicle as altered are different from those shown on the original certification label, the modified values shall be provided in the form specified in § 567.4(g)(3) and (4).

(3) If the vehicle as altered has a different type classification from that shown on the original certification label, the type as modified shall be provided.

[Falcon67]

why buy a full size new truck that starts in the 40's and averages in the high 50s with most luxo versions in the 60's

Because even though the RV only weighs about 7K, we pull a race trailer - tagged as a Texas RV - at least twice a month that weighs 13,900ish. And I drive the truck daily. It's nice. It's a 2020 F-350 with a GCWR of 24,000lbs, max trailer 16,500.

Yea, the DOT CDL thing at 26,001 lbs and larger still is about "For Hire." Even in Oregon a large semi tractor pulling a RV is not a CDL issue if it is not for hire. Watch and look you might see them in every state. On the side doors Big lettered words "This vehicle is not for hire."

Yea...sure. Ask any of the people pulling race cars in trailers and they'll tell you "Not For Hire" doesn't mean squat. There's plenty of racers getting tagged as "commercial" even when they are not, having to go to court to prove otherwise. Re: the DOT "Horse Exemption". After you look that up, be glad you're just dragging an RV down the highway LOL.

If I get stopped and they ask how much I'm towing, I can easily say "yes". The big "RV" is rated at 14,400 GVWR.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

I bolded a part of your response and that's the part I want to address, but first, I completely agree with you that vehicle manufacturers design a vehicle to "work within specific criteria" and they define that criteria for a reason. Staying within those limits usually results in safe vehicle operation, although even then, some "things mechanical" will fail. The "intended consequences" most vehicle manufacturers depend on, is that when something mechanical does fail, the remaining parts that aren't overloaded, will still function within their design limits and the outcome won't be a catastrophic failure, but rather a "recoverable event with no casualties"... in other words, when something breaks, the whole clock isn't wound so tight that it all flies apart.....

Now, as for "DMV's allowing higher/lower registrations"....

From what I can tell, most state DMV's will allow an owner to declare and pay as much as they want (within reason)... I can "donate as much money as I want to the state's DMV by declaring any weight rating I want and paying the excess charges... I can license my 3/4 ton truck as a commercial vehicle for hundreds more or register it as a private vehicle for hundreds less.... The "crisis hits the fan" when something happens and my vehicle, although licensed for Y and Z, is only rated by the manufacturer for X.... In other words, being woefully ill prepared for what I'm licensed to do is no excuse to do it anyway....

On the other hand, some states also allow an owner to buy a 15K truck and license it for less capacity, knowing they'll never use it at the highest rating. As an example, a 25000 pound GVW schoolbus that someone is going to convert to a 4 passsenger motorhome. Some DMV's will allow them to register it at 15000 pounds, pay less for registration, and as long as they are under that 15K if stopped and weighed, they're paying for what part of the asphalt they damage.... On the other hand, if they are stopped and weigh 20K, they'd be subject to citation because effectively, they're "stealing road use by damaging the roadway more than they're paying for"... Or something to that affect....

In short, you can "license the vehicle for as much as you want, and it's up to you to assure the vehicle meets all the requirements to work in that capacity, or you can license the vehicle for less than it's rated to do, but if you do that, you can't exceed the declared rating, even though the vehicle is rated for much more than you're paying for in license fees.....

Registering fees and separate from and don't necessarily always align with design limits for vehicles.... Sort of like owning a private acrobatic airplane engineered for +/- 8 g's... That doesn't mean you can't fly grandma to Denver in it without making her pass out doing "High G turns" At the same time, owning a Cessna 172 doesn't mean you can expect the wings to stay on the fuselage if you try to make a 6 g "assault landing at a 600' grass strip on the side of a mountain..... Neither has anything to do with pilot rating or licensing

As an example of these comments;

When I purchased the current truck it was registered in TX and I was in FL and the paperwork was sent to me....I didn't even look at it just wanted the tags.

Came time for renewal and I did look at the registration; it was for 8800lbs. gvw. I took it in and asked the lady that ran the vehicle registration place about it and she said they always put that on a 1 ton because people didn't want to pay the extra fees. I told her I didn't think that was right and had her up it to 11,400 I believe. Doubled the fees. She said "you don't have to do that" and I told her yes I did because that is what my truck can haul and I'm positive I'll be over 8800lbs. quite often so that's what the fees are for.

All to point out that yes, it is only a paper number but like all the rest of the "numbers" that go with towing (and required equipment) there can, and possibly will, be a situation when what you do, right or wrong, will be put to the test....I want to pass.

[quaddriver]

Originally Posted by notanlines

“ why buy a full size new truck that starts in the 40's and averages in the high 50s with most luxo versions in the 60's”
Between this statement and the sway bar comment, your forum cred’s took a terrific hit.

why are my estimates for the costs of trucks too low? just how much over MSRP are they getting?



but aside, forum cred? what are we , in 8th grade? If I wanted 'forum cred' I would join g-d facebook. geesh.

[Falcon67]

Similar sentiment with our race trailer/RV. The RV tags are way cheaper. But I was able to show the shower, potty, etc which is an acceptable confirmation of an RV here. Only extra thing I had to do was get a weight on the empty trailer from a certified scale. We got out of Texas sales tax thanks to buying the trailer in Oklahoma. Either way - the paperwork in the glove box matches the connected unit.

As an aside, I have many times asked fellow racers "how much are you hauling with that rig?" And most times the answer is "have no idea". "Whats the speed rating on the tires?" Same people ripping down the highway at 75+.

[quaddriver]

Originally Posted by CWtheMan

No state can over rule the federal regulations. Here they are.

https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-4...ter-V/part-567

Nothing I stated is contrary to title 49 (read it)


AND, the fed does not regulate registration, states do. which is why you can drive a PA vehicle grand tour of the USA and have to add or subtract nothing. Each state must honor the.....(you know the rest). Since fed law does usurp state law where they collide, note the phrasing involves 'FMVSS, bumper and lighting...year of manufacture...blah blah blah' (should also say emission but the feds gave that one to the states as well)