3500 dually new law

[jsmith948]

Originally Posted by Ken / Claudia

I just need to add what others have mentioned it is real difficult to know/understand laws by reading the shorten version. The web site listing all states towing laws is just a guide. The Oregon laws printed on it mix comm. vehicle towing with RV towing and some points where wrong. The OR, DMV web site took a law in print that is 17 lines to 7 lines and made it real difficult to read and not easy to understand. Last night I showed the web page to the comm. truck inforcement officer at work, He said it was messed up.

Add to that the 'interpretation factor' that can affect whether or not you get cited. No offense meant to any LEOs, but they are human and tend to read things in their own way. Guess that's why we have judges

[Ken / Claudia]

Jack, I was taught not to only know the law but, understand why and what was the intent of each law before attampting to inforce it. But, I think we know that is not always happening. And to be honest when laws change we do not always get that information at a timely manor.

[outwest]

Originally Posted by Ken / Claudia

Jack, I was taught not to only know the law but, understand why and what was the intent of each law before attampting to inforce it. But, I think we know that is not always happening. And to be honest when laws change we do not always get that information at a timely manor.

That's good to hear. I know a fellow that got a citation in Iowa for not having a CDL. Thing is, he was driving a station wagon! LEO that cited him did so because he transported some of his own business equipment across state line into Iowa. Supposedly the cop said that any time you transport business related stuff across state line, regardless of vehicle type, you have to have CDL. Um, if that's the case, then everyone with a work related laptop, cell phone, etc., needs a CDL

[glenalt]

Originally Posted by Festus2

glenalt -
I think he means that the rear portion of the tow vehicle looks like it is overloaded and has too much weight on it, causing it to sag or "squat".

Thanks. I wasn't sure if he meant that or illegal overnight parking that I have heard referenced as squatting.

[Festus2]

Originally Posted by glenalt

Thanks. I wasn't sure if he meant that or illegal overnight parking that I have heard referenced as squatting.

That is another explanation that I didn't think about and would also "fit right in". Perhaps CW will see your question and clarify what he meant by "squatting".

[christopherglenn]

Originally Posted by bsmith0404

I looked at the final sentence that states RVs for personal use fall into this class. That tells me that a class c is all that is required for personal use regardless of rv weigh. It doesn't say RVs for personal use that meet the weight requirements fit into this class

The sticking point is we are not operating an RV, we are operating a pickup (assuming the trailer is over 10k). A MDT/HDT tagged as an RV would be exempt.

[Ken / Claudia]

Chris go back to my posts #35 and # 39. If you choose not to beleive me than look it up for your self www.Oregon.DMV.com Oregon drivers manual 2010-2015, form 735-37, pages 2 and 3. In Oregon you normally operate a motor vehicle by driving it. Anything else that you are pulling, pushing by a motor vehicle on a roadway is normally called a vehicle and it is being operated by the driver of the motor vehicle. I am not sure what your talking about a MDT/HDT could you post what those mean.

[christopherglenn]

MDT (class 4-7 truck) HDT class 8 truck. I was referring to modified with a kitchen / toilet / etc to be registered as an RV.
and the link you wanted was likely http://www.oregon.gov/ODOT/DMV/pages...manuals.aspx#c



"You may also tow:
• A single vehicle which has a loaded weight and GVWR of 10,000
pounds or less.
• A travel trailer for personal use."

You are correct, the top of page three..

[Ken / Claudia]

That explains it, we do not have any rules/laws like that regarding what we are talking about. Without looking it up and cut/paste the rv law. Oregon says a RV is a vehicle including a truck camper that is made to live in. A truck camper must have a min. lenght and floor to ceiling size. (sorry but, that is the shorten version)
DO you still believe a RV must be under 10,000 lbs. with a class c and any trailer bigger is a comm class license. If so cut/paste/copy the whole 100% of what is printed under class c license on a post and I willl explain the best I can from that information so everyone can follow along.

[christopherglenn]

I guess I was not clear, what I ment to say was you are correct, in the Oregon drivers handbook, it says that travel trailers are allowed under the class c non commercial. What a judge would require is a statute stating that 5th wheel rv and travel trailers are exempt, which I cannot find.
In California the ticket would be "driving out of class", and you may get the option of dropping the trailer at the side of the road. The CHP I talked to stated it ranks right up there with pulling doubles without the endorsement - no one knows until you get pulled over for something else, then it hits the fan.

[Ken / Claudia]

Here we cite out of class also but, alittle different we use"no drivers license" and than state on the cite "out of class" A/B etc.
You read what the law says, here is what that means, it is because of the context of what they are saying, hope it makes sense.
Class C may also tow:
#1 A (which means Any and All) single Vehicle under 10,000 lbs but, because they list trailers next this is not a trailer, it is a vehicle think of a car being towed by another car say by a rope etc. Nothing in that is regarding pulling a trailer, only pulling another Vehicle. Pulling any trailer with a class C is listed seperately in the #2 and #3 sections.
#2 A (means Any and ALL) travel trailers for personal use, that includes all 5th rvs as a travel trailer. No wt. listings.

#3 A trailer (means Any and All) of any weight. As long as the TV and TLR are under 26,000 lbs. This would be any trailer other than a rv. This excludes for hire.

In this listing they made, they spell out what a type of trailer class c can pull in #2 and #3. And #1 is a vehicle under tow not any trailer. It is not well written and normally any mention of a vehicle includes anything moved by a motor vehicle but, here they define trailer and vehicle. Since I type to slow, I shorten up each point.

[C130]

Originally Posted by jtyphoid

Not that I'm against anyone moving to Texas (after all, I did), but Texas requires anyone towing 10K or more to get a class A license - either a CDL if for profit or a non-commercial class A if for personal use.

At least the class A non-commercial is only $10 and a fairly simple written and driving test.

Forgot to add that this applies to any tow vehicle, even SRW.

Where is this stated? Not saying it isn't true but I have never heard of this and neither I nor anyone I know that pulls a 5th wheel has the Class A license.

[jtyphoid]

Originally Posted by C130

Where is this stated? Not saying it isn't true but I have never heard of this and neither I nor anyone I know that pulls a 5th wheel has the Class A license.

It's on the Texas DPS web site where it describes the different classes.

It is NOT clearly written, which has led to confusion and differing opinions, even among DPS personnel. There is another thread specifically about the Texas law. I'll see if I can find it and point you to it.

Edited to add link.
Found it. Start at the beginning of this thread.
http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/showthread.php?t=19339

[SLO]

I'm in California. I think chuckster57 is right, except you have to take a driving test and fill out a medical questionnaire (but does not need doctors signature). This is for any trailer rated over 15,000. 10,000 to 14,999 just has to take the written test. Has nothing to do with SRW or DRW, Unless things have changed in the last 6 months.

[ocho]

Originally Posted by jtyphoid

Not that I'm against anyone moving to Texas (after all, I did), but Texas requires anyone towing 10K or more to get a class A license - either a CDL if for profit or a non-commercial class A if for personal use.

At least the class A non-commercial is only $10 and a fairly simple written and driving test.

Forgot to add that this applies to any tow vehicle, even SRW.

That made me question my "Legality", so I looked it up. It states that I would need a Class B non commercial if equal to or greater than 26,000lbs. This was from Towingworld.com. I couldn't find it on any official TX DOT website. Do you have a link?

[Javi]

Originally Posted by ocho

That made me question my "Legality", so I looked it up. It states that I would need a Class B non commercial if equal to or greater than 26,000lbs. This was from Towingworld.com. I couldn't find it on any official TX DOT website. Do you have a link?

https://www.txdps.state.tx.us/intern...Forms/DL-7.pdf

The license classifications start on page 3..

[ocho]

Originally Posted by Javi

https://www.txdps.state.tx.us/intern...Forms/DL-7.pdf

The license classifications start on page 3..

Now I'm not the sharpest stick in the bunch, but I've read this several times and no where can i find the requirement for a commercial license if my truck weighs under 10k and I'm towing a trailer less than 26k. It does dance around those numbers, and its quite confusing, but i think a class C license covers my rig. No?

[christopherglenn]

10k GVWR or greater rv trailer in TX is a Class A, Less then 10k GVWR & driven for personal use is Class C.



Page 3,

Classified Driver Licenses

Individuals who operate any of the following vehicles are exempt from obtaining a CDL but may need a Class A or Class B driver license because the type of vehicle driven still meets the definition of a commercial motor vehicle.

3. A recreational vehicle driven for personal use.


Class A Driver License Statute:
A Class A driver license permits a person to drive:

2. A vehicle or combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 lbs. or more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of the vehicle(s) towed is in excess of 10,000 lbs .

Class B Driver License
A Class B driver license permits a person to drive:

2. A single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of 26,001 lbs. or more and any such vehicle towing either a vehicle with a GVWR that does not exceed 10,000 lbs. GVWR or a farm trailer with a GVWR that does not exceed 20,000 lbs.


Class C Driver License
A Class C driver license permits a person to drive:

2. A single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of less than 26,001 lbs. towing a trailer not to exceed 10,000 lbs. GVWR or a farm trailer with a GVWR that does not exceed 20,000 lbs.

[Javi]

The problem is you have reworded the text.

I agree with your assessment and have said so many times on this forum but that is NOT how it is worded. I've looked up the actual law and it is worded just as the handbook.

Class A Driver License

A Class A driver license permits a person to drive:

1. Any vehicle or combination of vehicles described under a Class B or Class C driver license; and

2. A vehicle or combination of vehicleswith a gross combination weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 lbs. or more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of the vehicle(s) towed is in excess of 10,000 lbs.

I have asked the DPS twice for clarification and have received two different opinions from them. one in favor of Class A and one saying Class C. I have asked a third time but have yet to receive an answer.

The GCWR of my pickup and trailer is 22,500 pounds which does not meet the criteria of 26,001 pounds. However the trailer is over the 10,000 pound limit.

The way both the law and the handbook is written unless your GCWR is in excess of 26000 pounds the class A is not required.

That leaves us with a problem because neither Class B or Class C allow for a towed vehicle in excess of 10,000 pounds.

From this I have drawn the conclusion that a Class A is the only way to go if the GVWR of your trailer is in excess of 10,000 pounds. But I do not have confirmation of that conclusion from the DPS.

[ocho]

Class A Driver License Statute:
A Class A driver license permits a person to drive:

2. A vehicle or combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 lbs. or more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of the vehicle(s) towed is in excess of 10,000 lbs .

Ok, this is how I interpret this. If you have a vehicle or combination of vehicle that have a GCRW of 26k or more "AND" a trailer the weighs in excess of 10k THEN" you need a Class A.

If my truck and 5er together have a GCVWR of 26k or less (which it does), then I don't need a Class A.

If my truck has a GVWR of 26k or less, (which it is), AND my 5er has a GVWR of less than 10K, then I don't need a Class A.

If my truck has GVWR of 26k or more AND the 5er has a GVWR of 10k or more, then I do need a Class A.

Now, my truck has a GVWR of 9200 lbs., and the 5er is around 14K give or take depending on options. That's well below the 26k combined.

I think what this is meant for is someone that is some hauling say a Dually and a trailer with a heavy backhoe on it that has a GCVWR of 26k or more. Or a dump truck with a trailer. OR a single vehicle that has a GCVWR of more than 26k.

Again, this is how I interpret this rule. But, I don't always interpret things correctly so a call to TX DOT is in order. LEt yall know what they say.

Im open for comments.