Fuzion vs Raptor

[jasin1]

Looking at toyhaulers…I like the graphics on the raptor ..not a big fan of the multicolored blue and black on fuzion… is the fuzion and raptor built on the same frame? The basement looks like it’s deeper on the Fuzion and lastly can you get the glass patio doors on the raptor?

Just looking for now but I realized now that the set up time for bike racks and blow up paddle boards and kayaks is becoming my least favorite part of camping.

Would like to be able to take hard kayaks and put the bikes in the back…maybe a golf cart sometimes or my atv…would like the extra room for family visits also

[Mike Honcho]

Like a Camaro and a Firebird. Basically same thing with different features. Pick your favorite flavor.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by Mike Honcho

Like a Camaro and a Firebird. Basically same thing with different features. Pick your favorite flavor.

I was going to say Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile... All "mid level luxury" that's better than the entry level but not as luxurious as the top of the line, custom brands...

Essentially, it's more about floorplan offerings, color schemes, a few options available in one brand but not in the other.

Each has a few "exclusive to this brand only" features, but for the most part, as said, "basically the same thing with different features"...

[jasin1]

I guess I should have been more specific…mainly the frame differences The fuzion has a different profile up front and I’ve heard about wide frame and drop frame…couldn’t find any specs on keystone website showing the difference between the two models…I’ve since watched a video that appears to show 3 season doors on the back of the toy hauler on both fuzion and raptor but even that isn’t fully explained.

[Mike Honcho]

While there may be differences due to layouts the construction is the same. Components are the same.

The 3 season patio doors are nice but be aware they create a limitation to what you can haul. They block the sides by 8" or so and that prevents us from driving our golf cart straight up and close to the wall. Now it takes up more room. Also once the ramp door is closed you must have room to get to the double glass door inside to latch it before travel. You see many of these doors offered for sale due to this.

Kinda worked out for me as my sons are grown and take their trucks so we load a couple bikes or the 4 wheeler in those. But I used to pack our old one solid including a KX 85 sideways held in place as I closed the ramp door.

[JRTJH]

Some of the "subtle differences" I noticed are:

1. Raptor has propane "on demand water heater" Fuzion has 12 gallon DSI gas /electric

2. Fuzion lists "Suburban 22" range/oven. Raptor shows "Furrion 22" range/oven.

3. Both have 18 cuft Gas/elec refrigerator, Raptor has residential optional.

4. Both have "max turn front caps" painted/molded differently (think grill differences on automobile brands)

5. Frames are Lippert, 10/12" combination on smaller models and 12" on larger models.

6. Fuzion has Equalizer 6 point Auto Level system while Raptor has "unbranded" 6 point leveling system (possibly LCI brand ???)

I think you'll find most of the differences are based on things like these. The basic construction techniques, competence of line workers, quality control, adherence to established standards of construction and those types are issues are, for the most part, more dependent on the day and the worker than on the brand being produced. All the cabinets are made in the same cabinet shop, all walls in the same structure lamination shop, all the frames in the same "Lippert welding shop", all the pin boxes in the same "off site supplier shop", etc.

So, which (if any) preferences you have are, for the most part, going to be a "what saddle fits your rear" more than "which is built with the better materials by more skilled workers".....

[jasin1]

Originally Posted by Mike Honcho

While there may be differences due to layouts the construction is the same. Components are the same.

The 3 season patio doors are nice but be aware they create a limitation to what you can haul. They block the sides by 8" or so and that prevents us from driving our golf cart straight up and close to the wall. Now it takes up more room. Also once the ramp door is closed you must have room to get to the double glass door inside to latch it before travel. You see many of these doors offered for sale due to this.

Kinda worked out for me as my sons are grown and take their trucks so we load a couple bikes or the 4 wheeler in those. But I used to pack our old one solid including a KX 85 sideways held in place as I closed the ramp door.

Originally Posted by JRTJH

Some of the "subtle differences" I noticed are:

1. Raptor has propane "on demand water heater" Fuzion has 12 gallon DSI gas /electric

2. Fuzion lists "Suburban 22" range/oven. Raptor shows "Furrion 22" range/oven.

3. Both have 18 cuft Gas/elec refrigerator, Raptor has residential optional.

4. Both have "max turn front caps" painted/molded differently (think grill differences on automobile brands)

5. Frames are Lippert, 10/12" combination on smaller models and 12" on larger models.

6. Fuzion has Equalizer 6 point Auto Level system while Raptor has "unbranded" 6 point leveling system (possibly LCI brand ???)

I think you'll find most of the differences are based on things like these. The basic construction techniques, competence of line workers, quality control, adherence to established standards of construction and those types are issues are, for the most part, more dependent on the day and the worker than on the brand being produced. All the cabinets are made in the same cabinet shop, all walls in the same structure lamination shop, all the frames in the same "Lippert welding shop", all the pin boxes in the same "off site supplier shop", etc.

So, which (if any) preferences you have are, for the most part, going to be a "what saddle fits your rear" more than "which is built with the better materials by more skilled workers".....

Thanks for the reply’s. I appreciate the feedback…I guess this pic shows what I was referencing about the frame…the picture of the fuzion shows a much lower fascia on the front with three baggage doors…wasn’t sure if this means it’s a wider frame all around or a step down frame or just a different fascia and same frame dimensions every where else.

[Mike Honcho]

Just a drop down. You do gain a nice extra cabinet on top that is where I keep power cord and some folding chairs. the other 2 doors shown are generator and propane locker.

[jasin1]

Well thanks! …unfortunately I do like the profile of that front fascia better then the raptor…wish things like that didn’t seem so important to me ..ughh

Would probably bother me if I didn’t have it

[Essvar]

Originally Posted by Mike Honcho

Just a drop down. You do gain a nice extra cabinet on top that is where I keep power cord and some folding chairs. the other 2 doors shown are generator and propane locker.

Again, I agree with Mike. I've had a raptor without the extra storage never thought about it at the time but I use the heck out of the flat storage area of the Fuzion.



2 Folding tables, 4 directors chairs and a 100w solar panel. Which leaves plenty of room in the passthrough for my BBQ, Grill Box and outdoor rug.

[jasin1]

Yeah I’m just gonna think about this…my cougar is doing just fine for us right now…maybe wait for the prices to level out …I imagine if you buy high right now and the market corrects itself you could find yourself really taking a hit on resale value

[LHaven]

Originally Posted by jasin1

I guess this pic shows what I was referencing about the frame…the picture of the fuzion shows a much lower fascia on the front with three baggage doors…wasn’t sure if this means it’s a wider frame all around or a step down frame or just a different fascia and same frame dimensions every where else.

The third axle on the Fuzion implies some serious differences right there...!

[jasin1]

Originally Posted by LHaven

The third axle on the Fuzion implies some serious differences right there...!

The fuzion makes a tandem wheel version with the same lowered front end…the raptor makes a triple wheel with the same front as it’s tandem model with the shallow front end.

They market the raptor as the first true toy hauler…maybe they keep the profile that way for off-road obstacles when boondocking out in the desert and mountains

[Skillet173]

One tandem model is the 373 and the 419 is a tri axle with same layout bigger garage

[travelin texans]

Tandem axles creak crackle & the tires scrub pretty bad backing into a spot, but the triple axles will make you sick to your stomach watching/listening to them bind up backing in & looks like it's going to peel the tires off the rims.

[Essvar]

Originally Posted by travelin texans

Tandem axles creak crackle & the tires scrub pretty bad backing into a spot, but the triple axles will make you sick to your stomach watching/listening to them bind up backing in & looks like it's going to peel the tires off the rims.

So true! This is why I'll never have another triple axle, with my old Raptor I had nothing but issues with axle alignment which I attribute to tight turns parking at the various racetracks I was visiting back then.

[wifi_guy]

Originally Posted by jasin1

Looking at toyhaulers…I like the graphics on the raptor ..not a big fan of the multicolored blue and black on fuzion… is the fuzion and raptor built on the same frame? The basement looks like it’s deeper on the Fuzion and lastly can you get the glass patio doors on the raptor?

Just looking for now but I realized now that the set up time for bike racks and blow up paddle boards and kayaks is becoming my least favorite part of camping.

Would like to be able to take hard kayaks and put the bikes in the back…maybe a golf cart sometimes or my atv…would like the extra room for family visits also

If you are looking at new, they are basically the same. Walk through each, I think you'll find the Fuzion to be a little bit higher in quality. To be honest, I have no clue why they still make both. Chassis are the same, floor plans are darn near the same.

I have a Fuzion 428. The front is a modified drop frame "kind of" to accommodate the upper storage above the LP and Genny compartments. I will say this, that storage is worth gold!

[wifi_guy]

Originally Posted by jasin1

Thanks for the reply’s. I appreciate the feedback…I guess this pic shows what I was referencing about the frame…the picture of the fuzion shows a much lower fascia on the front with three baggage doors…wasn’t sure if this means it’s a wider frame all around or a step down frame or just a different fascia and same frame dimensions every where else.

The 2022 Fuzion's all come standard with the Instant On-Demand water heaters. I'm not sure I am fan of them.

[wifi_guy]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

Some of the "subtle differences" I noticed are:

1. Raptor has propane "on demand water heater" Fuzion has 12 gallon DSI gas /electric

2. Fuzion lists "Suburban 22" range/oven. Raptor shows "Furrion 22" range/oven.

3. Both have 18 cuft Gas/elec refrigerator, Raptor has residential optional.

4. Both have "max turn front caps" painted/molded differently (think grill differences on automobile brands)

5. Frames are Lippert, 10/12" combination on smaller models and 12" on larger models.

6. Fuzion has Equalizer 6 point Auto Level system while Raptor has "unbranded" 6 point leveling system (possibly LCI brand ???)

I think you'll find most of the differences are based on things like these. The basic construction techniques, competence of line workers, quality control, adherence to established standards of construction and those types are issues are, for the most part, more dependent on the day and the worker than on the brand being produced. All the cabinets are made in the same cabinet shop, all walls in the same structure lamination shop, all the frames in the same "Lippert welding shop", all the pin boxes in the same "off site supplier shop", etc.

So, which (if any) preferences you have are, for the most part, going to be a "what saddle fits your rear" more than "which is built with the better materials by more skilled workers".....

The last Raptor I saw had the same leveling system the Fuzion had. May have been ordered that way but it's the Equalizer System.

The Fuzion come standard with that system (Equalizer). I will say this, I've had two Fuzions and the Equalizer system is major step up. Fewer issues. Levels better. However, it a bit slower.

[Greggde]

Having owned both new from the Keystone Factory we would have given the edge to the Fusion, only because of my Bride's likes and sense of decorum.I do appreciate the higher front end for clearance reasons as 80% of our camping is off-grid.