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Old 01-05-2022, 11:14 PM   #21
jsb5717
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Yeah, I disagree that big trucks cause most of the accidents. Whenever I'm towing the 5er (or not) it isn't the big trucks that are making stupid, careless, irresponsible moves in and out of traffic... Just sayin'

That's why I also have a dash cam
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Old 01-06-2022, 04:13 AM   #22
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"Drivers who are speeding, tailgating, conducting illegal U-turns and attempting to pass trucks who are trying to change lanes are much more likely to cause accidents. These are all common behaviors on America's interstates."
That was from a University of Virginia bulletin. Nowhere online did I find any statement that trucks caused most or all major interstate accidents. In fact, just the opposite.
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Old 01-06-2022, 05:50 AM   #23
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I drove for many years and my son is a driver now and believe me most of the accidents are caused by four wheelers filling the space in front of a semi or cutting them off.This is one reason most of the new tractors today have cameras inside and out along with accident avoidance, lane departure and any sudden braking recorded and sent back to companies. Keeps track of drivers and gives proof in court of liability. We all should show some respect for the men and women that keep us supplied with ALL of our needs.
Agree! I don’t know how anyone that's towed any "full sized" camper for any length of time haven't experienced this. Perhaps it's me but it seems the larger the camper the more idiotic drivers act around it. I find myself regularly saying "that's it, make sure you get inftont of the truck and trailer so you hit the damned brakes!", typically followed by "I can't imagine being an 18 wheeler these days".

It's another example of the cavalier approach in this country towards driving IMHO. My father began teaching me how to drive when I was barely old enough to ride a bike. By that I mean I always had an intense interest and he would tell me what he was doing and why. He would tell me to watch his hands when he was parking or watch his feet when he shifted gears. He also taught me to judge speed and distance and how to enter a curve, steer thru it, and accelerate out of it.

I was physically driving before I was a teenager. When I was in HS my mother worked at the Maryland State Police headquarters in charge of payroll. Yes, the troopers liked her a lot. She asked the driving instructor there to "teach me a few skills". I honestly beleive she thought they would scare me and slow me down. WRONG! Anyway after a week of their "training" he told my mother that he hoped he would never get in a car chase with me driving ahead of him. Now days, you don’t even have to parallel park to get your license.
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Old 01-06-2022, 07:17 AM   #24
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I'm not going to pretend that all truck drivers are perfect by any means. With the constant need for drivers the industry has lowered the standards for entry level personnel to a questionable status.

The truck driving schools don't teach anyone how to be a truck driver, their only concern is teaching the students three maneuvers. How to offset back a rig, straight line backing, and alley docking. The courses are generally only three weeks and this is what the schools get paid for.

That said, getting a non CDL license these days is pretty much like getting a participation trophy. Read a booklet answer some questions and you're good. I don't even think drivers education is a requirement anywhere today.

This is what my wife and I drive:

https://www.bing.com/images/search?v...t=0&ajaxserp=0

We cringe at the thought of metro areas in places like Chicago, LA, anywhere in NJ or NY, etc. Nobody is taught how to merge anymore. I can't tell you how many times when I'm unable to move left because of traffic at an on ramp and yet the passenger vehicle merging into my lane thinks this 80,000 pound truck is responsible to yield to them. They actually blow their horn at us and give us the finger!

And all the cars that pass us (while we are going the posted speed limit) and then get in front of us and slow down. Or cut across three, four traffic lanes to get to the off ramp! No one wants to be behind the big truck.

https://www.bing.com/images/search?v...t=0&ajaxserp=0

These are just a few of the reasons that so many don't want to be truck drivers any more.
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Old 01-06-2022, 08:46 AM   #25
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Our highways are a direct reflection of our life anymore; a lack of respect and responsibility combined with no experience, training or any thought of possible consequences for ones actions gets us to where we are today. The "me" generation/mindset in play on the freeway; "I don't have any idea what I'm doing nor do I care....it's YOUR responsibility to deal with it"..... As far as merging, that's an unknown skill for most drivers nowadays, it's still the "I don't know what I'm doing....YOU figure out what I'm doing and adjust". And heavens, a 4 way stop? There's no order, just a bluffing, kamikaze experience you have to deal with and hope to avoid being hit.

As far as truck drivers it's a mixed bag anymore as it always has been. I remember as a kid standing (early 50s) in the pasture and watching Mack trucks with Jimmy Walker oilfield trucking company racing side by side down Hwy. 18 in NM, black smoke rolling. Have no idea what they would have done if there was oncoming or someone pulled out of the many oilfield side roads.

These days I tell my wife; look at the truck, if it's a national carrier he will probably be at the speed limit or below, cruising professionally, courteous and taking care of business. If you see that 80s tractor and a beat up trailer with "Wild Willie's Trucking" etc. on the side, running 80+, tailgating and cutting folks off.....those are the ones you want to avoid like the plague - I've even had them try to run me off the road in the middle of the night.

Like everything else there is the good and bad and much/most of it goes right back to my first comments. As far as bad drivers in cars vs trucks; cars win by a huge margin.
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Old 01-06-2022, 08:57 AM   #26
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Okay, I'll bite. What's your point about the "the big trucks that are in (caused) all or most multiple vehicle crashes."
You keep them big trucks out of Texas!

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Old 01-06-2022, 09:14 AM   #27
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You keep them big trucks out of Texas!

Trucking has made many millions for many lawyers! We see these billboards everywhere.
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Old 01-06-2022, 09:35 AM   #28
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These days I tell my wife; look at the truck, if it's a national carrier he will probably be at the speed limit or below, cruising professionally, courteous and taking care of business. As far as bad drivers in cars vs trucks; cars win by a huge margin.
I agree with your statements, however, those big national carriers are often the training companies that hire direct (or sponsor) the trucking school trainees. While their speed is electronically limited and the trucks are equipped with thousands of dollars worth of safety equipment like interactive cruise control, lane departure alarms, etc. (my favorite is imminent collision), some of these drivers are fresh out of school doing their 160 hour training course.

Understand that DOT/FMCSA regulations only allow a driver to drive a max of 70 hours in an eight day period and you can understand how little experience they may have. In less than three weeks they can be turned out on their own. Some find this acceptable, some don't.

We've been there/done that. It's likened to survival of the fittest. These companies are willing to take a chance on you but the starting pay is low. I'm sure their insurance is through the roof. Experienced drivers I know are paying $250 a week and more (owner operators).

The company we started with was paying us .48 cents a mile. Now they are begging us to come back and offering .93 cents a mile.
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Old 01-06-2022, 09:41 AM   #29
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I agree with your statements, however, those big national carriers are often the training companies that hire direct (or sponsor) the trucking school trainees. While their speed is electronically limited and the trucks are equipped with thousands of dollars worth of safety equipment like interactive cruise control, lane departure alarms, etc. (my favorite is imminent collision), some of these drivers are fresh out of school doing their 160 hour training course.

Understand that DOT/FMCSA regulations only allow a driver to drive a max of 70 hours in an eight day period and you can understand how little experience they may have. In less than three weeks they can be turned out on their own. Some find this acceptable, some don't.

We've been there/done that. It's likened to survival of the fittest. These companies are willing to take a chance on you but the starting pay is low. I'm sure their insurance is through the roof. Experienced drivers I know are paying $250 a week and more (owner operators).

The company we started with was paying us .48 cents a mile. Now they are begging us to come back and offering .93 cents a mile.

Your comments are in line with what DW was told by the local prison warden when she was the manager of our local Chamber of Commerce; the #1 job for those leaving prison was being a truck driver.
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Old 01-06-2022, 10:58 AM   #30
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Trucking has made many millions for many lawyers! We see these billboards everywhere.
That trucker coming out the mountains in Colorado and causing a bad wreck got 110 years; his trucking community stood up for him and screamed and threatened to not drive Colorado roads and they reduced his sentence. 110 years is harsh even with fatalities. Sounded to me like he didn't have enough training and he was a young fella so couldn't have been driving long.
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Old 01-06-2022, 04:26 PM   #31
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That trucker coming out the mountains in Colorado and causing a bad wreck got 110 years; his trucking community stood up for him and screamed and threatened to not drive Colorado roads and they reduced his sentence. 110 years is harsh even with fatalities. Sounded to me like he didn't have enough training and he was a young fella so couldn't have been driving long.
I haven't heard the full story but my understanding is that he lied about his experience and/or training to his employer. That's a big problem with me. He bears all the responsibility on this.
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Old 01-06-2022, 04:41 PM   #32
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I haven't heard the full story but my understanding is that he lied about his experience and/or training to his employer. That's a big problem with me. He bears all the responsibility on this.

I agree that lying about experience warrants some scrutiny BUT how in the world did that "fake experience" pass muster with the new employer IF they actually vetted him as a new employee? If not, that's on them. Also, they say it happened due to brake failure, that's not something the company driver takes care of - that truck should have been checked (wheels off if required) to assure they were up to running the mountains...again that would have been on the employer.

The accident was horrific, terrible and sad. The culpability spreads across several areas IMO. 110 years for a truck failure you don't own, inexperience etc. - too much - premeditated murder gets less in many cases. Crap situation with poor choices made all round.
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Old 01-06-2022, 07:21 PM   #33
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I agree that lying about experience warrants some scrutiny BUT how in the world did that "fake experience" pass muster with the new employer IF they actually vetted him as a new employee? If not, that's on them. Also, they say it happened due to brake failure, that's not something the company driver takes care of - that truck should have been checked (wheels off if required) to assure they were up to running the mountains...again that would have been on the employer.

The accident was horrific, terrible and sad. The culpability spreads across several areas IMO. 110 years for a truck failure you don't own, inexperience etc. - too much - premeditated murder gets less in many cases. Crap situation with poor choices made all round.
I'm understanding the "brake failure" was caused by him not knowing how to use the engine braking system. Instead he used the foot brake all the way down the mountain and overheated the brake drums resulting in brake fade. So not really a true "brake failure".

Again, this is what I'm hearing, I have no access to the reports, but if true it would be operator error.

While we're on the subject, take a look at this:

https://www.freightwaves.com/news/fe...-pilot-program
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Old 01-06-2022, 07:45 PM   #34
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I'm understanding the "brake failure" was caused by him not knowing how to use the engine braking system. Instead he used the foot brake all the way down the mountain and overheated the brake drums resulting in brake fade. So not really a true "brake failure".

Again, this is what I'm hearing, I have no access to the reports, but if true it would be operator error.

While we're on the subject, take a look at this:

https://www.freightwaves.com/news/fe...-pilot-program

Well Jeff, I don't know about you but that scares my socks off!
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Old 01-06-2022, 08:07 PM   #35
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Well Jeff, I don't know about you but that scares my socks off!
Yeah, the roads are about to get more dangerous if this gets the green light.

Most if not all companies vett there drivers, especially if they are recent school graduates. But I can see where someone could slip through the cracks at a smaller company, such as the guy that got the 110 years.

And, yeah, that 110 years sounds excessive, but it appears that his actions cost lives. I think we'll hear more about this.
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Old 01-06-2022, 08:49 PM   #36
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I recall the driver in question was hauling logs and passed by several runaway ramps he didn't take for reasons that are not clear. Perhaps log haulers don't have the same level of maintenance as long haul rigs; dunno. Sounds like he likely should not have been behind the wheel.
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Old 01-06-2022, 08:50 PM   #37
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From what little I've read it sounded like the driver rode the breaks down the mountain untill the brakes failed. I also read he passed truck pulloffs intended for that scenario and plowed into the cars. I guess the truth might be clearer if you were to read the court transcripts but most folks depend on the abridged version in the news. Unfortunately that isn't always accurate and "omissions are as good as lies" in that industry.

Was his sentence too harsh? Did the governor do the right thing? I can't say, I don’t have all the facts, my loved ones weren't killed and the driver is unknown to me. What I think is obvious is that driver should not have been driving that route. Either he was inexperienced, exhibited poor judgement, or both.

To the debate on under 21 yr olds driving big rigs I think it depends on the individual. Age (talking about 18+) doesn't necessarily dictate a capacity for good judgement and common sense IMO. It's the training that needs the attention. Everyday and every night we place guns and other weapons in the hands of young men and women in the military. Had them keys to trucks, tanks, and trust them to operate and repair billion dollar weapons system.

What scares me is the current societies lack of responsibility as a whole. Teachers refuse to go to school. Kids "pushed thru the system" without merit. No accountability, ever increasing apathy and a "not my problem" attitude. I still recall my flight instructor years ago. Before we began he told me that attitude and decision making was as important as the flight proficiency. He said he would not sign off unless I was ready as it was a reflection on him. When he signed off after 42 hrs (FAA requires 40 min and very few came close) he took pride in his ability to transfer that knowledge. Accountability, seems like a "quaint" concept anymore.
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Old 01-07-2022, 12:59 AM   #38
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Well maybe I was downplaying it a bit..just seems a bit surreal that it could shut everything down so easily..
Northern VA gets the collywobbles if you just say "snow."

I'll never forget the day they closed my kid's school on account of clouds.
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Old 01-09-2022, 09:23 AM   #39
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Seems crazy to me that in this day and age that a major interstate at or vey near to our nations capitol could be shutdown over fairly small snow event.

I guess with worker shortages and covid call outs that there isn’t the manpower to get things done?
Several years ago this happened in Missouri. They had pre-treated the roads, however rain came first and washed everything away. Then the temperature dropped so quickly that the rain on the roads froze an additional freezing rain accumulated on top of that. Then followed by a couple inches of snow. Road crews were fully staffed but yet there was just so much of it and things had to be prioritized. For instance the school bus full of children that slid off into the ditch when school was canceled early. Some people abandon their cars and walked. These cars were then in the way and no one else could get through. It’s easy to say why not just tell them but imagine the length of time for each hook up and tow. The tow trucks couldn’t even get through the volume of traffic. Every person who had AAA was calling, that led to more traffic on the roads. It was just the perfect storm for a complete mess. People sat on the highway all night long. It wasn’t just the one highway that was the issue every road in the county was froze over with cars in various locations in and out of ditches. Road crew couldn’t even drive their personal vehicles in to get to the locations that they needed to to pick up there wow equipment etc. so yes on the face of it it seems easy just clear the highway but getting to the highway is the problem.

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Old 01-09-2022, 09:31 AM   #40
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When there are power outages in another state the local utility would get a bunch of volunteers and fuel up the trucks and head south or north or wherever …within hours to help out another electric company…..,

I watch a lot of documentaries and the guys that built the Hoover dam, the railroads, Panama Canal…the space program…man those guys didn’t let anything get in their way

….anyhoo…back to rv’s
I can think of one thing that would stop those volunteers from heading to an electrical outage… Impassable roads

And something that would stop the building of the canal,the dams , the space program….. lack of funding, manpower, resources.
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