Wheel well tire clearance

riorescue · 07-20-2020, 05:46 PM

A few months ago I noticed that my Bullet 273BHSWE tires are rubbing on the wheel well (the Darco material). As a quick fix I applied gorilla tape to cover the thin wood of the subfloor. After a trip last week I noticed the tires hit and wore through the gorilla tape as well. This trailer is 100% stock with stock wheels and tires. A quick rough measurement shows there is only about 1-1.5" of clearance between the top of the tire and the bottom of the trailer floor (at rest). I have tire wear marks on the floor and Darco damage for all four tires. I don't have a trailer dealer close by to check myself but is this clearance normal? Seems like normal travel in the leaf springs would be greater than 1".

QCMan · 07-20-2020, 06:32 PM

Hi. This may sound silly but have you weighed the unit lately? Weight makes that clearance decrease and most of us tend to pack too much. The other answer might be soft springs. Check your max weight and then go to a scale for the answer.

riorescue · 07-20-2020, 06:50 PM

Great point and I had considered loaded weight but the clearance measurement is basically empty. We unpacked the trailer except for bedding, glassware, and standard kitchen utensils. The measurement is with 3/4 tank of water onboard which is pretty normal for what we camp with. I am also wondering if the suspension is too soft for the trailer. I looked into lifting blocks/shackles but didn't find much available. Sounds like maybe we need to fully unload everything to see where it sits.

**JRTJH** · 07-20-2020, 07:06 PM

I'm not suggesting this is "reality with your trailer" but taking it to a CAT scale and actually putting it on the pads to get a "true weight" is the first step. Even if you had a dealership next door, the first thing Keystone would ask them to verify is the trailer weight...

Imagine the worst for a moment: If there was a large water leak on the roof, it filled your walls with water, saturated the fiberglass insulation, soaked the wood until it's at max capacity, like a sponge, and the flooring is also filled with water from that leak that you are not aware even exists....

That trailer would, because of the problem, weigh many hundreds, possibly thousands of pounds more than the "fresh water we always travel with"...

I'd suggest weighing it and then finding a Keystone dealership that will look at it and document their findings.

mikec557 · 07-21-2020, 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riorescue

Great point and I had considered loaded weight but the clearance measurement is basically empty. We unpacked the trailer except for bedding, glassware, and standard kitchen utensils. The measurement is with 3/4 tank of water onboard which is pretty normal for what we camp with. I am also wondering if the suspension is too soft for the trailer. I looked into lifting blocks/shackles but didn't find much available. Sounds like maybe we need to fully unload everything to see where it sits.

Josh

Do the CAT scale weighing. But here's another step to add for your own edification. By the way, CAT scales are cheap. The price seems to vary a little across the country but the first weigh usually costs $10-11, the second weigh-in WITHIN 24 HOURS, usually costs $3 *IF*you keep your receipt from the first weigh-in.

Go weigh it with your 3/4 filled fresh water tank and your bedding and kitchen stuff. Then go home and truly empty everything. Then go back and weigh it again. This will tell you how much of your cargo carrying capacity is used up by "just the water, bedding, and kitchen stuff." I think the weight of this stuff alone may surprise you.

Mike

riorescue · 07-21-2020, 07:13 AM

Based upon the replies I will take the trailer to a CAT scale; maybe twice. However, I am slightly concerned that the replies are indicating weight associated with the most basic supplies. Honestly, with two kids we couldn't travel with the minimal amount of items we have in the trailer now. Does the clearance issue seem "not normal"? Because both sides of the trailer exhibit the same issue I doubt it's a material flaw (i.e. leaf spring failure, etc.). I think my only option at this point would be to lift the trailer 1-2". Any recommendations on options to achieve the lift? Not saying I will not address the weight concerns--just looking for alternatives since removing the little items in the trailer wouldn't be realistic.

**flybouy** · 07-21-2020, 07:32 AM

I would visit the scales for the following reasons.
1. You will have a "baseline" ifn you will of what you have and if you do the recommended "two step" method exactly where you are in relation to the carrying capacity.

2. With that scale slip demonstrating that you are within the trailer's limits you take that argument away from the dealer, Keystone or Lippert (or whomever manfg the frame/axles).

I think getting the scale slip would be time and money well spent.

**JRTJH** · 07-21-2020, 07:33 AM

Initially, I wouldn't move anything out of the trailer. The "sagging springs" are occurring "as it sits" so you'll want to know the weight "as it sits"...

It does nothing to check a light bulb to see if it works, if the first thing you do is unplug the lamp.

Same with your "possible weight problem"... If you "dramatically reduce the weight by removing all the contents, what you're really doing is "hiding the protential cause of the problem" before even knowing if weight is involved in the issue...

Do the weight, "as it sits now". That will tell you if you're close to your GVW, over your GVW or well within your GVW.

If you're close, spring/axle issues may be a cause, if you're over, spring/axle will be a greater potential to be the cause and if you're substantially under, then spring/axle issues are very likely to be the cause or at least a contributing factor.

Armed with a "proven under GVW" weight slip, you can comfortably go to the dealer and state, "My trailer springs are allowing the tires to contact the DARCO in my wheelwells and I "KNOW and can PROVE" that it's not weight related. Here is the weight slip from my CAT scale weight 30 minutes ago proving it's the trailer equipment NOT an overweight condition.... Now, contact Keystone on my behalf and see what they want you to do to fix the trailer properly.

riorescue · 07-21-2020, 02:26 PM

I am going to do exactly as suggested and get the trailer on the scales. I am slightly concerned about Keystone doing anything even if I can prove the trailer is not overweight (assuming that is the case). I say this because the trailer is slightly past it's 1 year warranty and I don't believe the 3 year structural warranty covered anything related to axels and suspension components. Perhaps the axels and suspension are warranted by their manufacturer--will look this up as well. Thanks again for the insight and recommendations.

**JRTJH** · 07-21-2020, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riorescue

I am going to do exactly as suggested and get the trailer on the scales. I am slightly concerned about Keystone doing anything even if I can prove the trailer is not overweight (assuming that is the case). I say this because the trailer is slightly past it's 1 year warranty and I don't believe the 3 year structural warranty covered anything related to axels and suspension components. Perhaps the axels and suspension are warranted by their manufacturer--will look this up as well. Thanks again for the insight and recommendations.

The axles, if Dexter, are warrantied for either 5 or 6 years, if Lippert, for 3 years (and I believe they just extended that time period)... At any rate, the axles/springs are still in warranty on your trailer, so it's probably going to be a "dealer/Lippert" issue, not a dealer/Keystone issue... That will likely go in your favor. Keystone is "hard headed at times" where Lippert, so far, seems to be more "considerate of warranty repairs".... Keep us posted on what you find and what the dealer does... It'll surely help someone else "down the line".....

Customer1 · 07-21-2020, 04:13 PM

I would get a weight slip with it loaded and hit the dealership on the way home from the scale. It could have been built with the wrong suspension.

Eric363 · 07-28-2020, 10:40 AM

riorescue, Have you found a resolve yet? I'm have a similar issue. I have a 29BHS its 3 years old. Last spring I installed a Dexter EZ-flex system. At some point I too noticed that the darco had rub makes on it on all 4 wheels. I do not remembering noticing before or after i installed the EZ Flex. Last August I had a blow-out which did some moderate damage which I repaired. Long story, longer. After my first trip the past week, i noticed the darco with rub makes only on the right front. It finally dawned on me to measure the clearance, and I have only about 2.5". I called Dexter and the warranty person said that the EZ-Flex can lower the ride height. He emailed me some info but I can't find where it says that. Anyway, there is not much info out the on clearances but on etrailers website i found one answer of about 4". I am considering doing a 1.5" axle block. Anybody has any thoughts about axle blocks?

Eric

**JRTJH** · 07-28-2020, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric363

riorescue, Have you found a resolve yet? I'm have a similar issue. I have a 29BHS its 3 years old. Last spring I installed a Dexter EZ-flex system. At some point I too noticed that the darco had rub makes on it on all 4 wheels. I do not remembering noticing before or after i installed the EZ Flex. Last August I had a blow-out which did some moderate damage which I repaired. Long story, longer. After my first trip the past week, i noticed the darco with rub makes only on the right front. It finally dawned on me to measure the clearance, and I have only about 2.5". I called Dexter and the warranty person said that the EZ-Flex can lower the ride height. He emailed me some info but I can't find where it says that. Anyway, there is not much info out the on clearances but on etrailers website i found one answer of about 4". I am considering doing a 1.5" axle block. Anybody has any thoughts about axle blocks?

Eric

What kind of tires do you have on your RV? If they are the OEM tires, you "may" have a tread/carcass separation on that tire that's "closer to the wheelwell than the others"...

CWtheMan · 07-28-2020, 12:03 PM

Different axle manufacturers and installers may have different SOPs. This is a quote from Dexter; "The general rule is you want to keep 3 inches of vertical clearance above the top of the tire to the wheel well to allow for normal travel of the trailer's suspension."

Eric363 · 07-28-2020, 12:14 PM

My original tires were Westlake ST225/75-15, replaced with Goodyear endurance ST225/75-15. I called a spring shop and over the phone thought maybe I needed a stronger spring. The current springs are 4 leaf 25.5" eye to eye (possibly 25 1/4" as new) measured off the ground with about 3" of arch. On the ground without much stuff in the unit, I measured maybe 2" of arch. Any way of telling spring capacity? I can't find any numbers on the spring. I plan on going to a scale Thursday.

Eric363 · 07-28-2020, 12:15 PM

I did see that also, but somehow I wasn't sure.

skids · 07-28-2020, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric363

(Snip) I am considering doing a 1.5" axle block. Anybody has any thoughts about axle blocks? Eric

I noticed that there are OEM axle blocks at the U-Bolts. It is milled to fit the axle. Personally, I wouldn’t just stack a block above the OEM block without considering welding them together. Also, you would be increasing the vertical dimension, There will be more stress on the suspension hanger.

Eric363 · 07-28-2020, 12:36 PM

On mine there are no blocks. Just the spring pad/base.

rjsurfer · 07-29-2020, 02:08 AM

My camper also had a minimal distance between tire and wheel well, maybe 1 1/2". Tires rubbed multiple times against Darco.

Armed with Cat Scale data sheet went to dealer, they ordered new axles. After the new axles were installed distance increased to almost 3". The interesting thing is that both sets of axles were 4400lb Dexter's, and if I'm not mistaken the new set has one more leaf spring.

They also came with forward adjusting brakes.

Ron W.

LewisB · 07-29-2020, 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riorescue

Great point and I had considered loaded weight but the clearance measurement is basically empty. We unpacked the trailer except for bedding, glassware, and standard kitchen utensils. The measurement is with 3/4 tank of water onboard which is pretty normal for what we camp with. I am also wondering if the suspension is too soft for the trailer. I looked into lifting blocks/shackles but didn't find much available. Sounds like maybe we need to fully unload everything to see where it sits.

I concur with all the comments advising getting your rig weighed. In the quote, it appears like you don't think you have much "cargo" - that you have unloaded everything. However, don't forget that cargo is EVERYTHING added to the trailer over and above the initial factory "dry" weight. So, propane, batteries, everything in the storage areas, everything that was not installed by the factory (kitchen, bedroom, bathroom) constitutes "cargo". There will be a sticker on your trailer that lists "available cargo weight". You might be surprised. After you weigh the trailer, you can compare the weight with the factory "dry" weight and get a true picture of your "cargo". Even if that is not your problem, that's a good number to know for the future.

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