Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Keystone RV Forums > Keystone RV Customer Comments > Keystone RV Service & Warranty Issues
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 11-19-2021, 08:36 AM   #1
TomTerrific
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Livingston
Posts: 24
Angry Rubber Roof Discoloration

I have a 2021 Avalanche 5th wheel AV295RK.

Looking at the roof, I see one section over the kitchen discoloring in a distinct 4 x 8 ft section.
I originally thought it was from the vent exhaust but I haven't used the vent much and only one roof section is discoloring.

Any ideas what is going on?
This rig is 6 months the old.

Thanks in advance for advice.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	20211119_100646.jpg
Views:	158
Size:	330.5 KB
ID:	37150   Click image for larger version

Name:	20211119_100613.jpg
Views:	142
Size:	272.5 KB
ID:	37151  
TomTerrific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2021, 03:27 PM   #2
sourdough
Site Team
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 17,601
I have moved this post from an old thread to one of its own.
__________________
Danny and Susan, wife of 56 years
2019 Ram 3500 Laramie CC SWB SB 6.4 4x4 4.10
2020 Montana High Country 331RL
sourdough is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2021, 04:59 PM   #3
Canonman
Senior Member
 
Canonman's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: South Jordan, Utah
Posts: 2,221
I'd bet the plywood was/is moldy or some other form of fungus. Hope you're warranty is good
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	_MGL5786.jpg
Views:	106
Size:	409.2 KB
ID:	37176  
__________________
2017 Cougar 279RKSWE
2007.5 Dodge Ram 2500 6.7 Cummins
Retirement Training Completed
I think the little voices in my head have started a chat group.
Canonman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2021, 07:00 PM   #4
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,849
Looking at the stains on the entire roof, I'd suspect that it's spent those 6 months parked under trees or with wet leaves laying on the TPO membrane. There is a lot more "staining and gray swirls" than I've seen on most "6 month old trailer roofs"...

That said, the roof decking is usually OSB or luan plywood. Luan, if that was used on your trailer, has an A side and a B side. Usually one side is darker than the other. I think that comes from where in the log the layers are cut. The further out on the log, the more porous the layer, so the more adhesive it will absorb when the adhesive is mopped onto the decking, just before the TPO is pulled over the trailer and then rolled onto the surface to press it in... If all of the luan was laid "A side down" except for that one sheet, that could explain why there's a difference in coloration on the TPO surface. The different color wood layer would cause the underlaying wood to be different temperatures when baked by the sun, probably causing a different reaction to either the adhesive or the TPO membrane, causing it to "bake differently" in the sun and turn gray at a different rate than the cooler parts over the "other color luan plywood. Or, if the decking is OSB, it could be that sheet was the top sheet on the pallet that sat out in the sun for a week before being moved into the assembly plant and the sheet was "weather stained" causing a similar "heat soak difference now that it's installed under the TPO.

My first thought would be to do a good, thorough cleaning of the entire roof surface, see what it looks like after that, and if there's any question, you can always pull the vent and/or the air conditioner, gently peel back a couple inches of the TPO around those holes and inspect the decking to see what it looks like...

To me, there's not an issue that I'd be overly concerned about as far as appearance. It's obvious that the staining is over a specific sheet of roof decking. So, it's not a "membrane problem" but a "decking caused issue".

Again, looking at the entire TPO membrane, the entire surface is in need of a good cleaning, followed by a thorough inspection of all the sealant and structures....

ADDED: Only your dealer and Keystone can give you a "final decision" on whether any warranty applies to this staining.... But, don't be surprised, (barring any specific physical findings such as soft spots in the decking or damaged decking), that Keystone declares this a "cosmetic defect not covered by warranty"... To them, it would probably be similar to sun faded curtains or a "misprint" in the vinyl flooring. They probably will consider it appearance related, not a manufacturer's defect.... I'm not saying that it is or isn't going to be the outcome or that such a decision is a good thing or a bad thing, but don't be surprised if that's what you are told.
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2021, 03:26 PM   #5
ChuckS
Senior Member
 
ChuckS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Mountain Home, Idaho
Posts: 2,978
2021 TPO roof membrane and slide out TPO should not look like this after six months..either all of the TPO has been exposed to something in the air where that RV is at causing the issue or you’ve got some issues with the roof and slide structure under the TPO

Image is from my eight year old Keystone Alpine . My TPO looks almost as good as the day I bought it
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	4A53A716-C1F0-4872-ADDA-6ACE88CE224E.jpeg
Views:	152
Size:	159.1 KB
ID:	37177  
__________________


2007 GMC Classic club cab 4x4 Duramax LBZ
2014 Alpine 3010 RE. 34 foot fifth wheel
ChuckS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2021, 05:45 AM   #6
TomTerrific
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Livingston
Posts: 24
Rubber Roof Discoloration.

Thanks for all the good advice.

As full time RVer I dont have a lot of Warranty options.

I have indeed been camping in forested state parks and Army Corp parks by lakes rivers and now down on the Gulf.

I started cleaning and got a lot of it off with Camco product but still blotchy.

Should I consider a repaint/resurface project?
TomTerrific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2021, 09:08 AM   #7
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,849
According to the TPO roofing membrane manufacturers, Alpha Systems and DICOR, the answer is, "Staining will not affect membrane performance."

Alpha Systems has some good information in the FAQ section of their website concerning "chemicals sprayed on the wood under the membrane" and how they can affect the top surface: https://alphallc.us/products/roofing/

DICOR also has some good information concerning their TPO membrane: https://dicorproducts.com/faq/

To me, the bottom line is that mold/mildew are "supposed to not grow" on TPO roofing material. I've seen lots and LOTS of mold/mildew on RV roofs. There has to be a reason. What I've found, at least what I "think" I've found is that the actual membrane will not support mold, but anything that's sitting on the surface will definitely become "food for mold"... So, the answer to staining and discoloration on any RV roof is, IMO, to keep it clean, keep it dry and keep it sealed.
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2021, 10:09 AM   #8
travelin texans
Senior Member
 
travelin texans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Picacho, Az
Posts: 6,809
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomTerrific View Post
Thanks for all the good advice.

As full time RVer I dont have a lot of Warranty options.

I have indeed been camping in forested state parks and Army Corp parks by lakes rivers and now down on the Gulf.

I started cleaning and got a lot of it off with Camco product but still blotchy.

Should I consider a repaint/resurface project?
If you feel you must do some sort repair or cover up be sure to research what's chemically compatible with whichever roofing material you have or risk something more serious than discoloration.
__________________
Full-timed 10+ years
Sold '13 Redwood FB
Traded '13 GMC Denali DRW D/A
Replacement undetermined
travelin texans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2021, 05:07 PM   #9
K_N_L
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Lanexa
Posts: 260
The stains seem extreme for a such a new camper. However I have been curious why my roof gets dark stains right at every 4 foot plywood sheet joint. Looking down the camper every 4 foot is basically a black line (note my buddys Grand Design did the same) across the width. Using Dicor cleaner and a bit of Simple green removes most of it but have to suspect something from underneath is at play.
__________________

Kevin -n- Lisa
17 Fuzion 325 / 15 Chevy 3500 HC DRW
06 HD Ultra Classic
K_N_L is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2021, 05:59 PM   #10
jasin1
Senior Member
 
jasin1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Upper Chesapeake Bay
Posts: 4,804
Long shot but could it have something to do with the airflow over and around the ac unit and vent cover? Because they are so close together? Causing a low pressure area around the vent that prevents the airflow scouring action that normally keeps the dust from accumulating on that panel…I’m thinking some of you pilots would know
__________________
2020 Cougar 315 RLS
2020 Ram 3500 6.7HO 4.10 Dually Aisin
jasin1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2021, 06:25 PM   #11
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,849
Quote:
Originally Posted by K_N_L View Post
The stains seem extreme for a such a new camper. However I have been curious why my roof gets dark stains right at every 4 foot plywood sheet joint. Looking down the camper every 4 foot is basically a black line (note my buddys Grand Design did the same) across the width. Using Dicor cleaner and a bit of Simple green removes most of it but have to suspect something from underneath is at play.
Here's a photo of the Cougar assembly line from around 2016. There is a 2" wide strip of paper "kraft tape" applied over the roof decking sheet butt joints. I'd suspect that the dark lines you're seeing "at every 4 foot plywood sheet joint" is the adhesive on that seam tape or the chemicals in the paper tape. It's not "normal" but certainly not isolated. I've seen lots of trailers with the same "roof seam discoloration". Keystone considers it cosmetic and not an issue covered by the warranty.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCF0320.jpg
Views:	116
Size:	212.4 KB
ID:	37210  
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2021, 05:32 AM   #12
TomTerrific
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Livingston
Posts: 24
ROOF Discoloration

Quote:
Originally Posted by travelin texans View Post
If you feel you must do some sort repair or cover up be sure to research what's chemically compatible with whichever roofing material you have or risk something more serious than discoloration.
How do I know what kind of roof I have?
Alpha System?

Thanks in advance for advice.
TomTerrific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2021, 05:41 AM   #13
TomTerrific
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Livingston
Posts: 24
How do I know which roof manufacturer is mine?
TomTerrific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2021, 06:24 AM   #14
dutchmensport
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,666
Quote:
Originally Posted by K_N_L View Post
.... However I have been curious why my roof gets dark stains right at every 4 foot plywood sheet joint.
Mine has done the exact same thing. After 3 years (purchased new), I decided it was time to wash the roof (Alpha system), as the roof still look really good, but the seams caused black lines. After washing, the roof look much cleaner, but the darkened streaks remained. I figured it had something to do with the material under the rubber, so didn't worry about it.

After washing, I did check with my RV dealership service department and asked about treating the roof. The service manager told me I should treat the roof with rubber roof conditioner after each wash, and pointed me to the correct one. Next day, (actually, the next 3 days), I applied the treatment (2 coats), and I was amazed how much the treatment absorbed back into the rubber and the rubber became silky smooth again. The streaks are still there and the service manager said they would not hurt the function of the membrane at all, and the sealer would not hurt anything on the streaks either.

So, hopefully, it will be another 3 years before I need to wash it again!
__________________
2019 Montana High Country 375FL
2014 Chevy Duramax HD 6.6 - 3500 Diesel Dully Long bed Crew Cab
dutchmensport is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2021, 07:30 AM   #15
wiredgeorge
Senior Member
 
wiredgeorge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,396
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomTerrific View Post
How do I know which roof manufacturer is mine?
I suspect that in the packet of manuals/product manuals is a manual for your rubber roof that explains your warranty and such. Have you looked through these manuals?
__________________
wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
wiredgeorge is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2021, 03:30 PM   #16
jasin1
Senior Member
 
jasin1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Upper Chesapeake Bay
Posts: 4,804
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasin1 View Post
Long shot but could it have something to do with the airflow over and around the ac unit and vent cover? Because they are so close together? Causing a low pressure area around the vent that prevents the airflow scouring action that normally keeps the dust from accumulating on that panel…I’m thinking some of you pilots would know
It looks like the university of Texas at San Antonio has a wind tunnel…might need you to swing by for a couple of days of testing to prove or disprove my theory….strictly on your dime Tom as this is a “research endeavor”… I’m sure you understand
__________________
2020 Cougar 315 RLS
2020 Ram 3500 6.7HO 4.10 Dually Aisin
jasin1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2021, 03:37 PM   #17
jasin1
Senior Member
 
jasin1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Upper Chesapeake Bay
Posts: 4,804
I believe as others have said that the seam discoloration is from underneath but the actual accumulation of dirt on the one area could be from where it’s parked with wind blowing over the trailer and getting stopped by the ac unit and vent being so close in proximity to each other…or like I said earlier airflow going around and over the fan and ac shroud acting like an air foil

From the crickets response I’m assuming you all politely think I’m just crazy lol
__________________
2020 Cougar 315 RLS
2020 Ram 3500 6.7HO 4.10 Dually Aisin
jasin1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2021, 02:03 PM   #18
TomTerrific
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Livingston
Posts: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiredgeorge View Post
I suspect that in the packet of manuals/product manuals is a manual for your rubber roof that explains your warranty and such. Have you looked through these manuals?
Didn't find any manuals. Called the dealer service and they verified my roof and the Dicor sealant.
Not much other infolation about to clean other than "Dawn"... Guess I'm on my own.
TomTerrific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2021, 02:05 PM   #19
TomTerrific
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Livingston
Posts: 24
I understand. Longshot on my dime part. ;-)
I'll stay with 409 and Other mild clensers.
TomTerrific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2021, 02:07 PM   #20
TomTerrific
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Livingston
Posts: 24
Not an airfoil. Definitely related to one sheet of roofing. I'll keep scrubbing. Maybe a little bleach ..
TomTerrific is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates in any way. Keystone RV® is a registered trademark of the Keystone RV Company.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:19 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.