Raptor 356 weights

[chunker]

I picked up the 356 last week and after resolving my boo boo, have it back home. On the way home the first time I went by the CAT scales for a weighing and I'll share what I have. First how the trailer is equipped in the special order vs what you typically see on a dealer's lot. I added dual pane windows, full body paint, queen bed (not RV king), 3 season doors, HappiJac, NO patio system. It came with the solid steps not the folding I requested.

UVW according to the sticker on the side is/was 13,760#. Published "shipping weight" is 13,884#. That according to Keystone rep is "typically ordered equipment weights. At the dealership according to the original sales deal, they added slide toppers for all three slides, removed solid steps and put in the aluminum 3 step folding, full propane, 2 gp 24 batteries. There also was some water in fresh tank and water heater was full. Some water in the 4 waste tanks, unknown amount. Maybe a gallon of gasoline in the generator fuel tank.

Scaled weight 14,360, 10700 axle and 3660 pin weights.

Truck in previous weighing with full main fuel tank, B&W Companion puck hitch, and 47 gallons diesel in my aux "in-bed" fuel tank. Just me and no tools etc.
Truck weights no trailer
Steer 5080
drive 3660
steer. 5060. with trailer
drive 7320

Results I am over rear axle weight by 320# with trailer empty with unknown fluids (should have drained everything but wasn't feeling good and whipped). Front axle lightened up by 20#. Not concerned by axle weight because when I load for a trip there will be the motorcycle, tools, and gear in the garage which will transfer several hundred pounds off the pin.

I tried a single side weight and was half successful. Trailer positioned half on scales but because of barriers wasn't able to get the truck correctly half on so I pulled angled off with the truck steers off but that put my rear/drive axle on the edge of the scale platform which I think skewed the results. Half weights were drive axle 3520 and trailer 5660. That makes the trailer axles weight pretty much even, 7# difference (negligible) and showed the truck drives with a 280# difference. I think tire on scale position skewed that number.

What I learned is I weigh 600# more driving off the dealer's lot that it left the factory. Unknown how much of that weight was water in various tanks but I could guess. Batteries probably 2x40#, propane 60#, slide toppers maybe 300#??? for all 3, negligible difference between steps, so the rest was the fluids.

EDIT; First real trip out I'll visit the scales again loaded up. If necessary I may have to adjust my aux fuel but I'd hate to have to do that. I'll travel with 1/4 tank fresh water and empty waste tanks.

[Dennis852]

Please share when you make your loaded trip. I just picked up a raptor myself and have yet to hit the scales. Which truck do you have?

[chunker]

Originally Posted by Dennis852

Please share when you make your loaded trip. I just picked up a raptor myself and have yet to hit the scales. Which truck do you have?

Truck is 17 Ram 3500 4WD Laramie SRW, LB, CC diesel. Sticker has a 4207 cargo capacity. I will share those weights but the way things are going, it may be months before travel is feasible or campgrounds are open.

[Big 417]

Weights sound so simple, yet are always so complicated. Is the total gvw of the tow rig not also an important number when calculating 5th wheel towing capacity? Heard a good rough and dirty rule of thumb is to weigh your outfitted truck, subtract that from your vehicle gvw. What's left is the cargo capacity. Take that number and multiply by 5. That's roughly what your max towed weight should be.

So a truck with 11000# gvw weights in at 7500# leaves 3500 # cargo. Rule of thumb with 5er is 1/5 of the total trailer weight can be applied to the truck as cargo weight. So 3500 * 5 = 17500#. That's basically your max trailer weight.

Did I get that right, or just make it even more conveluted ��

[roadglide]

Originally Posted by chunker

Truck is 17 Ram 3500 4WD Laramie SRW, LB, CC diesel. Sticker has a 4207 cargo capacity. I will share those weights but the way things are going, it may be months before travel is feasible or campgrounds are open.

I don’t understand the big 3 GAWR mine 7100 lbs guesswork would be 200 lbs less then the 3500 ram. My payload is 3552 lbs less then the other 2 HD trucks . The real number when weighing would be the 7100 lbs GAWR drive axel printed on the yellow cat sheet.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by roadglide

I don’t understand the big 3 GAWR mine 7100 lbs guesswork would be 200 lbs less then the 3500 ram. My payload is 3552 lbs less then the other 2 HD trucks . The real number when weighing would be the 7100 lbs GAWR drive axel printed on the yellow cat sheet.

It's all "engineering preference" in the automotive design section of each of the Big 3. For example, wheelwell style: Round, oval or "squarish". On the GM trucks, that extra "couple of inches" that makes up the "squarish" wheelwell also removes about 2 pounds of steel that can be "used somewhere else". At Ford, the change to aluminum body panels removed "pounds" that were used other places and at RAM, the decision to use "longer extension mirrors" also has an "engineering preference". Maybe it's a "signature look" or maybe they are more functional with wider trailers.... At Ford, they elected to use extension mirrors to achieve a similar function... It's also "engineering preference"....

With axle ratings/GVW ratings, it's "engineering preference" whether the rating for the front axle and rear axle are 600 pounds or 1200 pounds greater than GVW. That "load variability" the excess axle rating provides is "versatility in loading capacity" for the user. How much is "important to engineering"??? Depends on a lot of factors, from perception to future plans (that we don't know about) such as "preparing the truck line for increased capacity the following model year" Think about how GM and Ford increased GVW on the 2500/3500 models this year. Same axles as last year. Was it "a test project to see how an axle/frame adjustment really worked before announcing the upgraded GVW? or were there some other factors that we don't know about?

Manufacturers use "same parts" in multiple vehicles with different ratings based on how those parts function with "other parts"....

It may be as simple as the ability to "run two models using the same robots" so they are the same parts, but on 2500, grade 5 bolts are used, on 3500 grade 8 bolts are used ??? If the line used different parts, the robots would have to be reprogrammed so they put the parts in the right place. Same parts always fit the same... So ????

It's the same in the RV manufacturing lines. The same Lippert frame is used in 22' 24' and 26' trailer models, the rear end is just "cut off" for the shorter models and bigger axles installed for the longer models.

Trying to find the "reason for engineering differences" between manufacturers or even on the same line, are often a "best guess for the outsider looking in"... Only those sitting at the table when the decision was made would know all the factors in making the decision to go any specific way.

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by Big 417

Weights sound so simple, yet are always so complicated. Is the total gvw of the tow rig not also an important number when calculating 5th wheel towing capacity? Heard a good rough and dirty rule of thumb is to weigh your outfitted truck, subtract that from your vehicle gvw. What's left is the cargo capacity. Take that number and multiply by 5. That's roughly what your max towed weight should be.

So a truck with 11000# gvw weights in at 7500# leaves 3500 # cargo. Rule of thumb with 5er is 1/5 of the total trailer weight can be applied to the truck as cargo weight. So 3500 * 5 = 17500#. That's basically your max trailer weight.

Did I get that right, or just make it even more conveluted ��

Rarely is the GCVW exceeded before another weight limiting factor such as rear axle max weight or max cargo capacity. Watch the truck commercials, typically when they are showing a trailer full of logs, or a bulldozer, or pipe are being towed it's by a pintle hook and very little weight is being born by the truck.

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by flybouy

Rarely is the GCVW exceeded before another weight limiting factor such as rear axle max weight or max cargo capacity. Watch the truck commercials, typically when they are showing a trailer full of logs, or a bulldozer, or pipe are being towed it's by a pintle hook and very little weight is being born by the truck.

Actually most are goosenecks and the load is balanced such that the TV is within GVWR.
TFL Truck tested an F250 7.3 gasser pulling a 40’ horse trailer at 16k with most of the load slightly back of the trailer axle.