Future Toy hauler owner

[wiredgeorge]

Don't believe the payload issue would be settled till you state the actual payload of your tow vehicle or better, take a picture of it. If you are happy you are safe, then go forth and be happy but please don't claim to have "taken a pencil to it" and expect folks to take this as fact.

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by Morotcycle Todd

I mentioned a little movement felt from the trailer, I didn't asay I was okay with it swaying wildly behind me. LOL!

I have pushed the pencil and my rig when loaded with all my gear, fuel and fresh water, will be within the limits of my TV (both towing capacity and paylaod capacity).

If I were making excuses for why it was okay to go over the capacity limits your point would be valid. But just as the "safety police" here can claim that going just a couple hundred lbs over any capacity limits is wrong, claiming somone's rig is unsafe because it's only a couple hundred pounds under the ratings is equally wrong.

Trust me, if my trailer is swaying wildly behind me, I will make the neccessary adjustments to correct it, even if that means a bigger truck or a smaller trailer. The reason I began looking at a toy hauler in the first place
was becauase with my second son's bike in the back of the truck I was slightly exceeding the payload capacity of the truck. The toyhauler is part of the solution to the incorrect scenario I found myself in this year.

Are we done yet, or am I still on trial? LOL!

The comment on not being afraid of "feeling some movement", you added the "slight movement in the above". Someone reading the original could interpret that differently. My concern is with someone reading a post and getting validation that it's OK to tow over capacity. I understand that you claim you won't, even though you admitted that you did so that's one of the reason's you're getting another trailer.

Here's the bottom line for me with the weight debate as it seems to permeate on so many sites. What's acceptable? There has to be a limit do we not all agree? That limit has been defined and displayed in accordance the Federal Government.

Anyone can argue until the cows come home that "there's a cushion", or "it can handle more" but what's that number? Is it 100 lbs. more? 1,000 lbs. more? 1,500lbs. more? The definitive number was established. Unfortunately an unknowing reader could interpret that you carry "a 150 lbs.over" that they can tow 1,500 lbs. more and with so and so's post about changing shocks and back tires I'll be good to go another 1,000 lbs. higher!

I will point this out everytime as I see it as a potential safety issue. To me, it's just like the folks I've encountered at the gun range shooting 5.56 Nato rounds in a gun with "chambered for .223 ammo only" stamped on the barrel. The rounds are interchangeable but the one designated as .223 only was not tested for the higher pressures of the Nato round. If I see this I'll inform the shooter, explain the difference, then ask them to move further away so I won't get hit with the shrapnel when their barrel explodes from overpressure.

[Morotcycle Todd]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

Don't believe the payload issue would be settled till you state the actual payload of your tow vehicle or better, take a picture of it. If you are happy you are safe, then go forth and be happy but please don't claim to have "taken a pencil to it" and expect folks to take this as fact.

I didn't come here seeking validation of my setup. I am comfortable with it and if the rig turns out to be unsafe, I will make the necessary adjustments. Thanks for your (and everyone else's) un-asked for opinions!

Unfortuantley this debate cannot be settled until next march when I actually take delivery and weigh everything on an actual scale. So time to move on for now.

Anyone have any other suggestions, ideas or tips for living with a toyhauler other than speculating my TV is not up to the task?

[Badbart56]

Now that you've been properly introduced to the weight police, welcome to the site!

It's good to meet another bike racer! I say that only because I never forgot the thrill of dragging a knee in the Pro-Am race in Daytona back in 1983. Myself and my best friend did that for a few years, he on a Honda CB1100F and me on a Suzuki GS1100ES. We had a lot of fun those years but I had a bad experience with fork shake at 145 mph when I was side by side through a curve with another friend and I almost came off of it. My buddy almost crashed his Kawasaki 1100 trying to avoid me.

So I went back to drag racing running a Pro Stock Suzuki 1258 on the eighth mile track in Jacksonville. I held a track record of 5.25 @ 142 mph for a while there in the mid 80's. Finally hung up my helmet for good when my best friend got killed on his street bike by a drunk driver.

So it's just been fun cars and trucks since then. I don't race anymore but I still love the horse power! My toy is a Cadillac CTS V and my F350 makes 510 hp and 1065 ft/lbs thanks to Gale Banks. Nothing radical like what I used to have but, still fun!

Anyway, welcome! Obviously safety is paramount to everyone here including myself. I now drive a semi OTR with my wife and being on the interstates year round we see the good, the bad, and the ugly with RV's and everything else. Just don't be a part of the ugly! Keep your safety wire tight and your catch can dry!

[Morotcycle Todd]

Originally Posted by Badbart56

Now that you've been properly introduced to the weight police, welcome to the site!

It's good to meet another bike racer! I say that only because I never forgot the thrill of dragging a knee in the Pro-Am race in Daytona back in 1983. Myself and my best friend did that for a few years, he on a Honda CB1100F and me on a Suzuki GS1100ES. We had a lot of fun those years but I had a bad experience with fork shake at 145 mph when I was side by side through a curve with another friend and I almost came off of it. My buddy almost crashed his Kawasaki 1100 trying to avoid me.

So I went back to drag racing running a Pro Stock Suzuki 1258 on the eighth mile track in Jacksonville. I held a track record of 5.25 @ 142 mph for a while there in the mid 80's. Finally hung up my helmet for good when my best friend got killed on his street bike by a drunk driver.

So it's just been fun cars and trucks since then. I don't race anymore but I still love the horse power! My toy is a Cadillac CTS V and my F350 makes 510 hp and 1065 ft/lbs thanks to Gale Banks. Nothing radical like what I used to have but, still fun!

Anyway, welcome! Obviously safety is paramount to everyone here including myself. I now drive a semi OTR with my wife and being on the interstates year round we see the good, the bad, and the ugly with RV's and everything else. Just don't be a part of the ugly! Keep your safety wire tight and your catch can dry!

Thanks for the welcome. I've been road racing on and off since 1994. Mostly Light weight class bikes, but I dabbled with a 1993 ZX-7R and 2005 ZX6-R also for a little while.

I currently have a 2000 SV650 setup for endurance racing with a 6 gallon fuel tank and dry brake filler. We can get 5 gallons of fuel in the bike in about 15 seconds. 65hp and 365 lbs, though the plan is to build the motor a little this winter and get into 70-75 hp range

I also have a custom tube frame with a superbike spec SV650 motor and CBR1000RR front end. 298 lbs and 90HP.

Those old superbikes must have been a handful. Kinda like towing a 5th wheel with a 1/2 ton truck, no? LOL!

Never tried drag racing. That seems just as crazy if not more crazy then road racing to me.

[thatoneguy]

Originally Posted by Morotcycle Todd

Thanks for the welcome. I've been road racing on and off since 1994. Mostly Light weight class bikes, but I dabbled with a 1993 ZX-7R and 2005 ZX6-R also for a little while.



I currently have a 2000 SV650 setup for endurance racing with a 6 gallon fuel tank and dry brake filler. We can get 5 gallons of fuel in the bike in about 15 seconds. 65hp and 365 lbs, though the plan is to build the motor a little this winter and get into 70-75 hp range



I also have a custom tube frame with a superbike spec SV650 motor and CBR1000RR front end. 298 lbs and 90HP.



Those old superbikes must have been a handful. Kinda like towing a 5th wheel with a 1/2 ton truck, no? LOL!



Never tried drag racing. That seems just as crazy if not more crazy then road racing to me.

my little scout is a tad heavier @540 lbs, but after intake tune and exhaust, its like 100 rwhp i never did nuch riding on the sport bikes, but i wonder if i could load my scout into the bed and still pull my 36' tt

[Morotcycle Todd]

Originally Posted by thatoneguy

my little scout is a tad heavier @540 lbs, but after intake tune and exhaust, its like 100 rwhp i never did nuch riding on the sport bikes, but i wonder if i could load my scout into the bed and still pull my 36' tt

Only if the little yellow door sticker lets you! LOL!

[thatoneguy]

Originally Posted by Morotcycle Todd

Only if the little yellow door sticker lets you! LOL!

rofl thats accurate haha

[Badbart56]

Originally Posted by Morotcycle Todd

Thanks for the welcome. I've been road racing on and off since 1994. Mostly Light weight class bikes, but I dabbled with a 1993 ZX-7R and 2005 ZX6-R also for a little while.

I currently have a 2000 SV650 setup for endurance racing with a 6 gallon fuel tank and dry brake filler. We can get 5 gallons of fuel in the bike in about 15 seconds. 65hp and 365 lbs, though the plan is to build the motor a little this winter and get into 70-75 hp range

I also have a custom tube frame with a superbike spec SV650 motor and CBR1000RR front end. 298 lbs and 90HP.

Those old superbikes must have been a handful. Kinda like towing a 5th wheel with a 1/2 ton truck, no? LOL!

Never tried drag racing. That seems just as crazy if not more crazy then road racing to me.

Yeah those old bikes didn't handle like the ones you got now but we didn't know it back then. One of our gang bought a Moto Guzzi LeMans 1000 and he killed us on the curves. We started learning something then but there wasn't much in the way of parts back then and the Metzler tires were just coming out.

The 1100's we were running were around 120-130 hp but that Suzuki 1258 was out there, somewhere around 220-250 hp. A Pro Stock rider that owned a Suzuki dealer there in Jacksonville (Ron Turner) built the motor and transmission for us. The motor alone was $12000 and that was in 1983 dollars! It turned about 16K rpm's! That bike used a 1978 stock frame, raked and solid struts, front and rear with a wheelie bar, a fiberglass tank and stock gauges. It had a cut out seat so it wouldn't dump me off. The first time I ran it I looked down and saw the tach wrapped around well past 10 grand when I shifted gears and I came back and asked the crew what that was all about and they just smiled. Said you're not gonna hurt it.

[CWtheMan]

You know with all RV trailer, tow vehicle set-ups, the question is not what you can tow; its can you tow it safely without exceeding any of the limits set by the vehicle manufacturer.

Only you can provide your truck's capabilities because they are most likely specific to your truck.

That's a large trailer with a GVWR (11,400#) probably not suited for a half ton truck.

[LewisB]

Originally Posted by thatoneguy

So that's 90% of this forum is people insisiting you need a Tractor to pull a 15' popup safely.. lol i think you will be fine, some of those toy haulers are pretty sweet rigs!

For the record, most forum members are simply interested in adhering to manufacturer's and DOT limits when towing - that's the safe and responsible part of towing an RV. The recommendation "you will be fine" comes from someone who is pulling a 36' bumper pull and doesn't list his tow vehicle.

[LewisB]

Originally Posted by Morotcycle Todd

I didn't come here seeking validation of my setup. I am comfortable with it and if the rig turns out to be unsafe, I will make the necessary adjustments. Thanks for your (and everyone else's) un-asked for opinions!

Unfortuantley this debate cannot be settled until next march when I actually take delivery and weigh everything on an actual scale. So time to move on for now.

Anyone have any other suggestions, ideas or tips for living with a toyhauler other than speculating my TV is not up to the task?

Todd,
Welcome to the forum. I think you have certainly been patient with us - but we have been patient with you as well.

I don't speak for the forum; but from experience I can say this is a forum about Keystone RV's - towable RV's. So, towing is going to be a major component of the forum discussion. Regardless of the “weight police” comments, it is important to many forum members that others understand and adhere to all manufacturer’s and DOT requirements. We would NEVER recommend someone drink and then drive! Nor would we recommend someone set up a tow rig that fails to meet the manufacturer’s and legal requirements. You have the power to end this part of the discussion by simply posting your payload sticker.

You say you didn't come here "seeking validation" or "un-asked for opinions". That's good because the forum (or any other social media) can not "validate" you or your choices. Nor can you say you will take opinions on anything except "........(fill in)". Even if you ask specific questions, you will still get opinions you don't like. The forum is THE place to make suggestions, share experiences, learn new ideas, sometimes get corrected, etc. And you will sometimes get opinions you didn't ask for - but if you pay attention, you might also learn something in the process. That has certainly been my experience.

JMHO

[wiredgeorge]

Originally Posted by LewisB

Todd,
Welcome to the forum. I think you have certainly been patient with us - but we have been patient with you as well.

I don't speak for the forum; but from experience I can say this is a forum about Keystone RV's - towable RV's. So, towing is going to be a major component of the forum discussion. Regardless of the “weight police” comments, it is important to many forum members that others understand and adhere to all manufacturer’s and DOT requirements. We would NEVER recommend someone drink and then drive! Nor would we recommend someone set up a tow rig that fails to meet the manufacturer’s and legal requirements. You have the power to end this part of the discussion by simply posting your payload sticker.

You say you didn't come here "seeking validation" or "un-asked for opinions". That's good because the forum (or any other social media) can not "validate" you or your choices. Nor can you say you will take opinions on anything except "........(fill in)". Even if you ask specific questions, you will still get opinions you don't like. The forum is THE place to make suggestions, share experiences, learn new ideas, sometimes get corrected, etc. And you will sometimes get opinions you didn't ask for - but if you pay attention, you might also learn something in the process. That has certainly been my experience.

JMHO

TIP... OP hasn't posted to this thread in a week. Think things have been covered and you expressed the sentiment of most all the members of this forum.

[travelin texans]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

TIP... OP hasn't posted to this thread in a week. Think things have been covered and you expressed the sentiment of most all the members of this forum.

But posted to another thread to some folks that are getting a deal on a 10k 5th deal from an uncle that towing it with thier F150 "will be just fine" & the rest of us should stop suggesting not using the full capabilities of their truck.

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by Morotcycle Todd

Yeah, see even the manufacturers are pushing right to the published capacity limits. 7330 lb tailer + 2670 cargo capacity - 1225 hitch weight = 8775lbs on the axles. Pushing right up to the 9K rating of the two axles!

Yeah two race bikes only weigh 700 lbs and I don't expect to be much over 9K loaded with fuel and 2/3 tank of water. The Jayco has a 38 gallon fresh tank and we have never ran out of water on a race weekend, so I don't plan on filling the 60 gallon fresh tank of the TH all the way up. Any other time we use the trailer we are usually at campgrounds with hookups so no reason to tow excess water around.

Like I said I'm getting close to the limit for my truck, but what's the point of having a limit if you can't even approach it? Racing is all about exploring limits and getting as close as possible without going over. LOL!

Well towing at the maximum limits usually means the TV is working hard, any small hill you need to have your foot in it all the way big hills drag you down.

With our old 2001 Ram 2500 CDT, 5 speed manual, 3.55's we were 1,700 over GVWR and about 4,000# over stock tow rating. I had added a chip and we could climb hills at speed, good on tires and axles, but the truck was working hard.

Now pull the same 13,000# 5er with a 2016 Ram 3500 DRW CTD HO, Aisin and 3.73's and need to check mirrors to be sure it is still back there.
I thought I was comfortable, and relaxed towing with setup. Then I had the first tow with the new truck, so much more relaxed.

[blubuckaroo]

I'm convinced that the only way you won't exceed the tow vehicle payload before the tow rating is when flat towing a vehicle. In that case you would be towing with zero tongue weight. You need to weight the tongue. Add that to whatever passengers, fuel, and cargo you plan to carry. How does that compare to the payload rating of your tow vehicle? All the other numbers are for RV and tow vehicle sales purposes only!

[sonofcy]

Everyone notice he still hasn't posted his payload sticker

[Nagrompj]

So in theory since the Goodyear blimp floats in mid air I could tow an unlimited number of them at the same time with a 10 speed bike. No problem. It wouldn’t exceed the rated towing capacity of 0lb.
The point is sometimes the math is deceiving. It looks good on paper. Real world experience from people on this thread should well received because many of them have been there done that. Hopefully when you go there and do that nobody gets hurt.

[chuckster57]

This thread is closed, OP was advised to wait until he receives his new trailer in March of next year. At that time he can start a new thread with actual numbers.