So are Springdale's an, "entry level," (low-end), TT? Now that we bought one....

DennisT · 08-14-2012, 07:12 PM

Really new to RV'ing and TT's. First one ever now that we are retired. Just bought a 2009 Springdale 266RL. Being uninformed, we bought it from RnR RV in Liberty Lake, E. WA state, so we knew up front we'd pay too much but did get some pretty thorough going over and care for proper function, etc.

So now in reading more, is the Springdale line a cheap Keystone line, or entry level? (Still not cheap in dollars)

We're going to try it for a year and decide if we want to stay in RV'ing or, if we like the life, we might trade up for a different one now that we are learning features that work and don't work so for our particular needs. Yeah, everyone says by the third or so TT, folks figure out what they like. Required learning curve I guess.

So far we like the Springdale. Works good for us at this point. I'd like, someday, a light weight 26 foot though.

Springdale general comments?

Cheers,
Dennis in E WA state

**JRTJH** · 08-14-2012, 09:10 PM

Our Springdale fifth wheel is an "Entry Level" Keystone product. Like yours, it has fewer options available and fewer of the "niceties" associated with the "Mid Level" and "Luxury" RV's produced by Keystone. You can't even special order a remote control to level your RV or extend the slides. Those kinds of options simply aren't available in Springdale's line.

That being said, essentially, the frame is a Lippert, probably the same as most other Keystone products, tires and axles are the same, appliances are the same, plumbing and water tanks are the same. Windows and interior paneling and furniture is essentially the same (although there may be some "enhanced" fabric used on high end models) and from what I can tell, even the light fixtures are the same.

The big difference I can see is in sidewall construction on the travel trailers. Yours is made of 2x2 spruce studs rather than aluminum. Additionally, there is less insulation in the Springdale line (R 7 walls, ceiling and floor) as opposed to some higher end models (R 9+ walls ceiling and floor). Keep in mind that wood wall trailers have been around since the 50's and are still being manufactured today, so they can't be all bad.

It's true, you do get what you pay for, but as an entry level RV for spring, summer and early fall use, the Springdale is a good investment.

There are some people who are more concerned that their purchases meet "other's expectations" (like someone who won't drive a Ford, but endorses Mercury) or the guy that swears GMC trucks are better then Chevrolet's similar models) If you're that kind of RV'er, then I can't tell you what you'd want to hear, but if you're looking for an RV value that's functional in most environments, then you didn't make a "bad investment"

In other words, we like ours and a vast majority of the Springdale owners I've talked to are satisfied.

A note about your future goal of a 26' lightweight trailer. You may be interested to know that your Springdale weighs only 350 lbs more and has 5 lbs less tongue weight than the Cougar XL 24RLS which is about the same floorplan (with a smaller slide than yours) So really, although Keystone doesn't call it a "light weight" trailer, the Springdale is one of their lighter trailers when compared to others of the same length.

pinn · 08-15-2012, 02:19 AM

The springdale is entry level,but is a great unit.We went with one for the floor plan and price.The couger and larado trim is not that much different and construction is basically the same.Some of the options arn't there,but in my opinion simple has less maintenance.We just love ours.

DennisT · 08-15-2012, 03:54 AM

Thank you both for your comments. They please me. JR, your descriptions of the Springdale components being the same as the more expensive Keystone products is most helpful. Here, we both like simple and we see a lot of the fancy features in many modern products as just more to deal with for maintenance, etc. I'm quite happy with what you've told me is, "in," our Springdale. No downside I can see except the 2x2 studs. We also do not need to keep up with the, "Jones's," for things we buy.

Regarding lightweights: that struck home when we made our first trip and along side of us was my wife's brother-in-law with his Alumalite, (I think it was), whose weight sticker was something like 3,400 pounds for his c.28'+ trailer. I seem to remember the Keystone site lists ours as 6,330 pounds dry, and I couldn't help thinking a lightweight aluminum trailer would sure feel a lot better when I'm dragging something along behind me.

My TV is a '97 Dodge 2500 club cab Cummins 4x4. Lots of pulling power there but in that year the Cummins is, "de-tuned," a lot. I'm going to do a few very mild upgrades to the truck and if we stay in the RV world I may consider an exhaust brake next year. I figure our truck weighs about the same as the TT loaded.

So far the only feature we don't like about our TT is if we need to pull over to use the rest room we have to run the slide out a bit. We totally missed that when we were buying the TT. But that's not the end of the world either.

Thanks again; this is all very helpful and encouraging to a new RV'er.

Dennis

**JRTJH** · 08-15-2012, 07:58 AM

Dennis,

Your floorplan is the "travel trailer version" of our 242RL fifth wheel. We also have to run the slide out a bit to use the bathroom, so usually we stop at rest areas and just keep the holding tank empty. Easier that way.

As for wood framing, as long as you watch your roof, avoid leaks, you'll be just fine. Like I said, travel trailers have had wood frames for over 50 years and many of them are still going strong. If you read through these forums, you'll see that an aluminum frame is no guarantee of "leak protection." A number of upper level RV's have had water damage and we all have the same wood particle flooring, luan panelling on the walls and ceiling and sealant (dicor) that's used to protect the joining surfaces.

The older alumalite trailers were lighter than conventional fiberglass sided RV's, our 34' CBFK weighed in at 7600 lbs empty with a GVW of 10000 lbs. They called it a "light weight trailer" but in actuality, when you're moving 8000 lbs of "box" down the road, it's not lightweight no matter how you cut the deal. The specs on a 2001 Alumalite 28' has empty weight of 7200 lbs. Are you sure you read his weight label correctly? you may have been reading his max cargo weight, not the actual RV weight..... However, the "older" HR trailers, in the 70's and 80's were MUCH lighter, simply because they didn't have the livability features of today's units.... pretty much all they had was a referigerator, hot water heater, open air furnace, non-ducted A/C was an option, and very minimal foam mattresses, insulation, carpeting, etc. That started to change in the 90's.

What I've found in many of the "lightweight" RV's is a return to the thinnner walls, less insulation, smaller appliances, thinner carpet, fewer "luxuries" to keep the weight down. In other words, an RV equipped more like the Springdale with a "high end name" (and price).

Think optimistically about your RV, enjoy what you have, realize its limitations (less insulation, potential frame damage from water leaks, etc) and enjoy the simplistic, reliability of not having all the "options"

Sometimes "simpler" works even better than "luxury" <wink>

John

DennisT · 08-15-2012, 09:33 AM

John, your comments continue to be helpful. Yes, we plan to use highway rest stops too. The situation with our getting a TT pivots somewhat on my wife's Fibromyalgia medical condition. And sometimes we will have to do things differently or quickly, and traveling with a TT can actually be a benefit, including, "towing our own bathroom." And if she has a couple bad days we can tie up somewhere and relax without sitting in an over-priced motel with intrusions from the motel maid. !!

The roof is something that kept me away from ever buying a TT in my younger days. I was born and raised on Washington state's very wet West Side where, for decades, any conversation that mentioned TT's included, "oh, yeah they all leak and have dry rot." So I avoided them. Now for the last several years we live here in the arid wheat country of Eastern Washington where rain fall is about, realistically, 10 inches a year. This TT we bought was sold new in Spokane, so is not, historically, a wet-side unit. That said, I still have no idea how to insure how to protect, inspect, and guarantee to myself that it is sealed perfectly all the time. Selling RV dealer offers, "free roof inspection," so I guess I'll make the 200 mile round trip next Spring to have them do that. Even then I don't understand how they can be certain about the roof except for observing obvious cracks, shrinking, etc., of the top-side caulking. It's probably a mild worry I'll always have but need to work on myself so as to not let it bother my enjoyment of TT use.

Dandy comment you just made about Alumalite trailer weight. I did not read brother-in-law's tag, he did. So I'll observe that personally early next month when we all meet for a tandem trip together. Thanks.

GMcKenzie · 08-23-2012, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DennisT

My TV is a '97 Dodge 2500 club cab Cummins 4x4. Lots of pulling power there but in that year the Cummins is, "de-tuned," a lot. I'm going to do a few very mild upgrades to the truck and if we stay in the RV world I may consider an exhaust brake next year. I figure our truck weighs about the same as the TT loaded.

One thing to do is add an exhaust gas temp gauge. Depending on what upgrades you do, it can be part of a chip upgrade. I have an Edge chip and display that includes an EGT probe and will warn if the temp gets too high. Not sure what is out there for that year of Dodge but you can get them stand-alone.

davidjsimons · 11-12-2012, 05:01 PM

You can not put a programmer on a '97 Dodge with the 12 valve Cummins engine. The engine is mechanically controlled. Programmers are used from '98.5 and up 24 valve engines. All you need to do is perhaps a pump calibration, change the torque plate in the pump and maybe a slightly larger set of injectors.

kimrb266 · 11-14-2012, 08:06 PM

I've been reading on this Forum that the Springdale is Entry Level but where we've come from, we're moving up. We started out with a small pop-up, then to a light weight expandable (Hybrid) travel trailer and now to the Springdale. The Springdale is much better quality and nicer (fancier) than our Hybrid. We have 3 children and the Springdale's floorplan and finishes seems to fit us better.

**JRTJH** · 11-15-2012, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kimrb266

I've been reading on this Forum that the Springdale is Entry Level but where we've come from, we're moving up. We started out with a small pop-up, then to a light weight expandable (Hybrid) travel trailer and now to the Springdale. The Springdale is much better quality and nicer (fancier) than our Hybrid. We have 3 children and the Springdale's floorplan and finishes seems to fit us better.

RV's come in all flavors, sizes, and price ranges. If you look at the "new and improved" Keystone website, they no longer use price or level as a descriptor, now, it's Standard, Select, Premium and Luxury.

Calling an RV "entry level" doesn't really do much to differentiate it from any other RV. Especially when you compare it to another manufacturer's models. What really muddies the water is that the same appliances, hardware, light fixtures, plumbing, electrical wiring, gas lines, etc are present throughout the RV industry without regard to manufacturer, brand or model.

I suppose what I'm trying to convey is that no matter what RV you choose, if you're satisfied with the fit, finish, quality and livability, then it's logically a "right choice" for you.

Some people get hung up on price being an indicator of quality, but I've seen big dollar RV's sit in service departments just as long as the least expensive models. It really depends on what fits your budget and what features/floorplan works best for you. Enjoy what you have, your family will always remember the fun times regardless of how much the RV cost.

kimrb266 · 11-15-2012, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRTJH

RV's come in all flavors, sizes, and price ranges. If you look at the "new and improved" Keystone website, they no longer use price or level as a descriptor, now, it's Standard, Select, Premium and Luxury.

Calling an RV "entry level" doesn't really do much to differentiate it from any other RV. Especially when you compare it to another manufacturer's models. What really muddies the water is that the same appliances, hardware, light fixtures, plumbing, electrical wiring, gas lines, etc are present throughout the RV industry without regard to manufacturer, brand or model.

I suppose what I'm trying to convey is that no matter what RV you choose, if you're satisfied with the fit, finish, quality and livability, then it's logically a "right choice" for you.

Some people get hung up on price being an indicator of quality, but I've seen big dollar RV's sit in service departments just as long as the least expensive models. It really depends on what fits your budget and what features/floorplan works best for you. Enjoy what you have, your family will always remember the fun times regardless of how much the RV cost.

I totally agree. We may have started with a pop-up but our kids have enjoyed seeing the country (9 states this Summer) since my youngest was 16 months old. With our new needs, with pre-teen kids, and dry camping in the future, our new Springdale will do it in spacious comfort. It's not what you use, it's the fun you have while traveling.

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