2014 RAM 2500 6.7l HITCH WEIGHT 5TH WHEEL TOY HAULER - Page 3

C130 · 02-02-2015, 12:22 PM

As others pointed out the toy haulers need weight in the cargo compartment to take the pin weight off the truck and from my personal experience this is definitely true. I have a 2011 Fuzion 322 and if I remember correctly empty weight is around 11,800 pounds with max of around 16,000 pounds.

I had my 2011 F250 weighed one time and was over the rear axle weight by quite a bit. I was surprised but had two small kids, two dogs, quite a bit of stuff in the bed also. I did not have any water in the fresh water tank or any gas in either of fuel tanks and all of those are located at the rear of the toy hauler. Also, not much weight wise in the garage of the toy hauler. Pin weight is listed as 2445 on the brochure that came with the Fuzion 322. The Rear GAWR on the F250 is 6100 pounds. I said I was going to fill at least one gas tank and the fresh water tank and have it weighed again but I never did. I was well within the listed F250 allowable towing capacity but not other weight limits which I think is very common. Tow capacity of the 20111 F-250 is 14,400 so figured I was under the max weight as I didn't have that much in the toy hauler, well less than the 2,600 pound difference between my empty weight and my truck capacity.

My point is the toy haulers really need weight in the rear of them to get the pin weigh down and it's surprisingly very easy to overload your truck, especially the F250's and I assume the 2500 is similar. What's really amazing to me is the number of F250's/2500's pulling the 40 foot plus toy haulers. I will say my F-250 pulled my trailer very nice and I had no big issues but always said I'd never even consider a bigger toy hauler without a bigger truck from my personal experience. I have several friends that pull 40 foot plus toy haulers with their F-250's and I think they are crazy. Just upgraded trucks so I've taken care of my current towing issues for sure. Now, if I can just not upgrade the toy hauler.

Bman916 · 02-03-2015, 12:49 PM

Okay, I just spent an hour at the dealer with the parts manager, service manager and shop forman. The 2014 ram 2500 6.7L 4x4 has the same rear end at the 3500 that year (2014) the ONLY difference between the 2 trucks is the 3500 has an extra spring and does not have the coil spring like the 2500. The 2300lbs payload of the 2500 and the payload of 4000lbs in the 2014 3500 the ONLY difference is the springs. the rear ends are identical in every way!

The carbon has a gross weight of 16500lbs and the truck is rated by Ram for 17100lbs towing (pulling) the gross combined weight is 25000lbs and at the scales with the TH loaded and tanks empty I weighted 21000lbs with plenty of room to spare

The 2500 CAN handle the hitch weight same as the 3500 with air bags or new springs. I've spent 2 weeks collecting and double checking information from Ram, peoples opinions were not considered in this conclusion. The information above is FACT

**chuckster57** · 02-03-2015, 01:07 PM

As long as you understand, CHP or any lawyer or judge is going to use that sticker on the drivers door.

Earlier you said you scaled with 20 lbs left over on the rear axle. If you put an ice chest in the bed with ice and beverages, your OVER. I would be putting any cargo loaded in the garage.

**JRTJH** · 02-03-2015, 01:33 PM

Here is an illustration of the 3500 and the 2500 rear suspension in the 2014 RAM trucks. To me (unlearned eye) they don't look to be anything near the same. That "extra leaf spring" changes the entire dynamics of the suspension system. Using your logic, if I put my fifth wheel hitch in an F150, I should be able to carry as much as I can in an F350? The hitch is "exactly the same" well, except for the truck it's mounted in is a "little bit different".

What I'm saying is there's more to towing then having the same "rear end"...

As Chuckster said, any lawyer, judge or jury is going to go by what the "manufacturer indicates as maximum" and that's posted on the door pillar under "maximum payload"... Having some components that are "exactly the same" doesn't make it "exactly the same"

By your statements, your maximum payload is 2300 pounds. You've got a pin weight of 3000 pounds, a fifth wheel hitch of 150 pounds and you're going to add your family (very precious cargo) on top of that? And you're justifying it by saying the rear suspension is "almost the same as a 3500" ??? By your statements, your RAW is within 20 pounds of your RAWR. That pretty much means if you stop for lunch, your entire family must go to the bathroom to "unload" before you can continue. If they don't, you'd be overweight??? That's a pretty "tight" way to stay under your RAWR. It's your choice, your decision and your family. I don't think you'll find very many people here (if any at all) who will volunteer to "hold your beer while you show us how good it tows".

Best of luck in your travels and here's hoping you always arrive safely.

gtsum2 · 02-03-2015, 03:40 PM

I agree...the rear ends and rear suspension is completely different. The Ram coil springs with the 5 link thing is way different than my 2014 3500 leaf springs. Your call, but nothing you do will make you under the limit on payload with that rig unless you get a 3500 truck. It is what it is unfortunately

x96mnn · 02-03-2015, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bman916

Okay, I just spent an hour at the dealer with the parts manager, service manager and shop forman. The 2014 ram 2500 6.7L 4x4 has the same rear end at the 3500 that year (2014) the ONLY difference between the 2 trucks is the 3500 has an extra spring and does not have the coil spring like the 2500. The 2300lbs payload of the 2500 and the payload of 4000lbs in the 2014 3500 the ONLY difference is the springs. the rear ends are identical in every way!

The carbon has a gross weight of 16500lbs and the truck is rated by Ram for 17100lbs towing (pulling) the gross combined weight is 25000lbs and at the scales with the TH loaded and tanks empty I weighted 21000lbs with plenty of room to spare

The 2500 CAN handle the hitch weight same as the 3500 with air bags or new springs. I've spent 2 weeks collecting and double checking information from Ram, peoples opinions were not considered in this conclusion. The information above is FACT

Ask them to put it down in writing that your ok, make sure you let them know in case something bad were to happen you want proof they said it was ok. I don't think you would need to say you wanted it for proof before they told you they can't do that and back peddle.

Ultimately if your happy with it that's all that matters. Not sure if your trying to convince people on here your ok or yourself. Will you ever get called out on your setup in a legal situation, most likly not. Will your truck break down under the pressure, I don't think so. The only thing that would make me a bit uneasy, usually in these types of threads you will get a 50/50 mix. 50% telling you your crazy, 50% telling you not to listen to the crazies and you will be fine, it will tow great. Not seeing those people standing up here and telling you that it will be ok.

You have it, you hauled it and your happy with it. In my very humble opinion, nuff said! Enjoy!

Bman916 · 02-03-2015, 07:01 PM

at this point it is what it is... Pulled it up and back from Shasta and it did fine, the folks who work on these trucks and have access to the parts computer showed me today the Mechnical differences between the 2. I would never tell anyone to go over what the sticker says, but it seems to be ligit. All that said.... The next truck will be a DRW for me. Putting blocks on the trailer to get it level. The ram 5th wheel prep kit makes the Pullright superglide sit high. No adjustment for height.

gtsum2 · 02-03-2015, 07:07 PM

she does sit a little nose high, but not terribly bad. That was my concern with the superglide and the adapter in the ram puck system. It would be nice if they came up with a superglide to drop into the ram pucks.

raineman · 03-01-2015, 02:31 AM

I have to say I am impressed that everyone kept their cool on this post. I have seen this topic on other forums that turned nasty fast.

I have to admit after reading the whole post I am left in shock and awe. Despite advice from several decades of experienced 5th wheelers along with detailed explanations of the math behind towing and explanations of potential exposure to CHP stops and impounds, the OP still decided to tow, what most if us consider, a setup that is not safe.

As someone else posted, it's your family, your decision. I personally would never knowingly put my family in a similar unsafe situation. Nor would I knowingly expose my lifetime of savings and assets to a situation that could take that away from me and my family (lawsuit). Not to mention the safety risk to family, self and the general public.

Relying on a few conversations at the dealer to overcome all the points made here is an interesting approach. As also stated, I would get what the dealer said in writing. I would be surprised if you can. Saying, "the dealer said..." in court won't go far.

This all hits close to home for me after dealing with the same issue. I was considering trying to pull a 5th wheel with much less truck. I went so far as to try to justify not taking advice of experienced folks and going for it because I just wanted the trailer so bad.

I did end up doing it the right way. It took almost another year for me to finally get the right truck and finally the right 5th wheel. It was a long year but I have no regrets. I now can climb in my truck, hook up the trailer and drive with peace of mind knowing I have a solid setup. I feel good knowing I didn't take any shortcuts that would potentially put my family, pets, assets and others at any avoidable additional risk.

I don't mean to bash the OP. I wish the best for him and his family. And I hope they enjoy the trailer. Hoping that drw is coming sooner rather than later.

master sprinter · 03-02-2015, 07:59 AM

I also do not understand the logic of asking experienced people for their advice and then after a 5 page post of great info (and their time) ignoring their good advice. I just see way too many unsafe TV and trailers sharing the road with others that are trying to be responsible for their own families. IMHO

Bman916 · 03-02-2015, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by master sprinter

I also do not understand the logic of asking experienced people for their advice and then after a 5 page post of great info (and their time) ignoring their good advice. I just see way too many unsafe TV and trailers sharing the road with others that are trying to be responsible for their own families. IMHO

I hear you, My mom says I do that to her all the time.

It's funny, the only difference between a 3500 and 2500 in my year and truck (VIN against another VIN at dealer looking at the parts) is a set of springs, stickers and 2 coils for MY truck anyway. Now people start to imply I am a idiot and putting my family at risk or don't care about them????? I thought the point of this forum was to share ideas and lessons learned not try to imply a guy don't care about his wife and children. Why would that ever come up talking about toys and trucks!?!?

I guess if we see it on the internet it must be true

I do not see any value keeping this post going. Any one who knows how to lock it up please do so.... Thanks

Festus2 · 03-02-2015, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bman916

Now people start to imply I am a idiot and putting my family at risk or don't care about them????? I thought the point of this forum was to share ideas and lessons learned not try to imply a guy don't care about his wife and children. Why would that ever come up talking about toys and trucks!?!?

I do not see any value keeping this post going. Any one who knows how to lock it up please do so.... Thanks

Bman916:

If you recall, in your original post you did ask for "any thoughts from anyone pulling a toy hauler like mine (2015 Carbon357) with a 2014 Ram 2500.
Throughout the course of the thread (6 pages), you received recommendations and comments from members who suggested to you that:
1) you would be overloaded
2) the Carbon was too much trailer
3) you should consider a smaller trailer or bigger truck
4) you should upgrade the truck
5) a 2500 would be inadequate for the job

It was also suggested that this combination would be unsafe not only for the general public but also to your family and that there could be legal consequences if you were involved in an accident.

It seems obvious that you did not particularly like or agree with the comments and advice that you were given and that you have chosen, for the time being, to keep both the 2500 and the Carbon. Please remember that you did ask for "any thoughts" and you got them so you cannot blame our members for providing you with their opinions.

No one said that you "didn't care about your wife and children". What they were telling you IMO was that the combination that you have is potentially unsafe and that you could be unintentionally putting your family and the public at risk.

However, since you do not appear open to any further advice or comments and have requested the thread which you started to be closed, I will be closing it.

Thanks to all who contributed.

You may also like: