Questions on upgrading to a 3/4 Ton

[wiredgeorge]

As I already noted, folks will give you their preferences and since these vary you will have to sort through them and decide what is important to you. To address the cost of a diesel and how it effects resale down the road, look at used truck ads. An older diesel with a couple hundred thousand miles will still bring a fair sum. A Ford F350 with 5.4L gas engine will be worth almost nothing. The V10s they sold in the early 2000s a little more but not as much resale as a diesel with similar miles. The 6.2L is actually a little hard to find but they don't hold their value as nearly as well as the 6.7L diesel. Does this offset the initial up front expenditure; to me it boils down to how and how much the truck will be used for towing as opposed to a grocery getter and the size/weight of the towed trailer.

[SandyBurg]

In my opinion. Go as big as you can, one ton. Go diesel. Yes, they cost more upfront and fill-ups. But they last way longer than a gas engine. We're on our third fiver. Each one longer than the last. We're at our limit now (to fit in our barn) at 41 feet. But each one has weighed more. We have some pretty good hills in Missouri. No problem pull up them. We had previously double hooked to Texas. (Yes it's legal) and no problems pulling that load. We have multiple friends who started out with what they "needed" now they are all upgrading their tow vehicles. Just food for thought. Good luck and have fun!

[JRTJH]

When I bought my 2015 Ford diesel, the diesel option cost me $8500. Today, if I trade the truck, the diesel option will bring about $5500 over the same truck with a gas engine. I've found that, generally speaking, any diesel truck with less than about 100K miles, is going to cost between $6000 and 7000 more than a similar gas truck...

So, yes, diesel's cost more to buy when new, they also bring more trade in value when traded and used, they'll cost more than a gas truck...

You pay for it "up front" and get much/most of that investment back when you sell the truck.

So, the statement, "I can't justify $10,000 for a diesel engine" doesn't really mean it "costs 10K"... Depending on how long you keep a truck, how well you maintain it and how you sell/trade it much, most, maybe even all of that "10K comes back to you as increased trade in value"....

Right now, I can sell my diesel 2015 for almost $12,000 more than I paid for it new. Gas trucks with similar miles are selling for "what they cost new". So, in my case, my investment in the diesel option has doubled in value over what it cost me to buy when new.

[crTundra]

I'll share my experience moving from a 2011 Tundra with the 5.7 to a 2019 F150 with the 3.5 Ecoboost towing a 7000lb Keystone Passport in Colorado. My Tundra felt more stable in windy conditions but the motor would run high RPMs getting up and over the passes. The Ecoboost handles them easily at much lower RPMs. The downhill is more of a concern to me and I have to use the brakes in the F150 more than I'd like.

With that being said, I think moving to a gas heavy duty truck will give you a more stable setup but that Ecoboost turbo will shine going over passes compared to a naturally aspirated engine. I think you lose 3% of power for every 1000ft or something along those lines. With traffic on I-70 these days I don't need all that power to drive 30MPH!!!

I just read Ford is abandoning the F150 diesel due to most customers opting for the Ecoboost and new PowerBoost. If you're looking for power at elevation you need a turbo regardless of the truck model.

[travelin texans]

Originally Posted by crTundra

I'll share my experience moving from a 2011 Tundra with the 5.7 to a 2019 F150 with the 3.5 Ecoboost towing a 7000lb Keystone Passport in Colorado. My Tundra felt more stable in windy conditions but the motor would run high RPMs getting up and over the passes. The Ecoboost handles them easily at much lower RPMs. The downhill is more of a concern to me and I have to use the brakes in the F150 more than I'd like.

With that being said, I think moving to a gas heavy duty truck will give you a more stable setup but that Ecoboost turbo will shine going over passes compared to a naturally aspirated engine. I think you lose 3% of power for every 1000ft or something along those lines. With traffic on I-70 these days I don't need all that power to drive 30MPH!!!

I just read Ford is abandoning the F150 diesel due to most customers opting for the Ecoboost and new PowerBoost. If you're looking for power at elevation you need a turbo regardless of the truck model.

Turbos are standard in diesel trucks!

[Halcyon]

No one has mentioned going DOWNHILL with each different engine. I pulled our10K fifth wheel over the Eisenhower tunnels,(7% grade, 12 miles 11,200 ft), Wolf Creek Pass, Monarch Pass in a gasser and a diesel. Going DOWN at 5,200 rpm and having to use brakes consistently versus going down at 3,000rpm using engine braking and very little use of brakes is SO much more relaxing and safer. My wife was scared spitless in the gasser and because she can, in the diesel, she asks me to go 35 mph down the passes.
My 6.0 gasser got 8mpg towing. The duramax gets 11.2, no matter where i am going. Not towing, the diesel gets 19 mpg, the gasser got 16.
Just one person’s experience…

[adeakins]

Originally Posted by Winnie2020

I have a Keystone Bullet that weighs in at 6,080 unloaded. I thought my 2013 Ecoboost could handle it but going over the Raton NM pass into CO gave me second thoughts. My trailer, gear, truck, and people weighed in at 14,000 which is 1,500 under the GCVW but it struggled in the mountains of Colorado.

I would consider the Chevy or Ford. However, only the Chevy would fit in my garage from a height standpoint and it doesn't fit from a length standpoint. So either the Ford or Chevy would spend most of its time outside and the Chevy would pull into the garage if we knew hail was coming.

I've been told I don't need a diesel for the 3 or 4 times a year we'd tow this Keystone given the upfront cost of a Diesel and the higher maintenance costs. Is that accurate?

The Chevy has fewer options in gas with respect to rear ends and transmissions as compared to the Ford. Only the Chevy Duramax Diesel gets you a 10 speed transmission. Would I be happier with the Chevy Diesel in a 10 speed and being able to pull it into the garage versus a Ford 7.6 gasser with 10 speed and the myriad of rear end ratios I get with the Ford?

I bet we get bad hail 3 times a year max....I've thought about a hail blanket. I just lean towards the Ford and dealing with hail than going a diesel Chevy. But I'm still open minded.

Thanks!

You can look at the F250 or 350 with the 7.3 gas engine and 10-speed transmission. I bought the F350 version of that engine. Roughly $8,000 less than the diesel version. Back then the difference in price for regular gas vs diesel was 40¢ to 60¢ per gallon and, of course, there was the DEF cost. When I went out west earlier this year, after the Texas fiasco, diesel was as cheap or cheaper than gas. That appears to now be swinging the other way, however; you CANNOT run lower than 87 octane in this engine and a lot of the regular gas out there is 85 octane. You are forced into paying for mid-grade which, because that is mixed (regular and hi-octane) at the pump, you could run into situations where, unbeknownst to you, it’s just regular Caveat emptor.

[hazmat456]

My 16 f250 is 79 inches tall with the airbags at 5psi.
Chevy lists their 2500 at 80 inches tall.
If one fits in your garage the other will. A standard garage door is 84 x 108 standard trim takes it down to 82 x 106, you will have to fold in your mirrors on either truck.

[Blackrock]

My rig has no problem going up or down Raton pass. Going up I pick a gear that will hold a good pull at 3200 rpm. Going down is just a matter of holding the speed down with brakes and gearing.

[Spletbr]

I sold a 2019 f150 in 2020 when we upgraded to fifth wheel. Got a 20 F350 7.3 gas. Pulls great, just been through NM, CO, WY, MT etc. No problems with the truck (just the cable slides, sucky). Pulled the mountains fine and gas is cheaper. Consider a one ton for the extra grand

[Dallasrules]

What about a dodge?

[lcarver02]

Originally Posted by Winnie2020

I have a Keystone Bullet that weighs in at 6,080 unloaded. I thought my 2013 Ecoboost could handle it but going over the Raton NM pass into CO gave me second thoughts. My trailer, gear, truck, and people weighed in at 14,000 which is 1,500 under the GCVW but it struggled in the mountains of Colorado.

I would consider the Chevy or Ford. However, only the Chevy would fit in my garage from a height standpoint and it doesn't fit from a length standpoint. So either the Ford or Chevy would spend most of its time outside and the Chevy would pull into the garage if we knew hail was coming.

I've been told I don't need a diesel for the 3 or 4 times a year we'd tow this Keystone given the upfront cost of a Diesel and the higher maintenance costs. Is that accurate?

The Chevy has fewer options in gas with respect to rear ends and transmissions as compared to the Ford. Only the Chevy Duramax Diesel gets you a 10 speed transmission. Would I be happier with the Chevy Diesel in a 10 speed and being able to pull it into the garage versus a Ford 7.6 gasser with 10 speed and the myriad of rear end ratios I get with the Ford?

I bet we get bad hail 3 times a year max....I've thought about a hail blanket. I just lean towards the Ford and dealing with hail than going a diesel Chevy. But I'm still open minded.

Thanks!

Not sure what the specs are for your existing truck - engine size, towing package, rear axle ratio. Very important. If you go with a diesel, you are going way over what you really need, and likely you can't justify it. I know several people who have eco-boosts pulling trailers your size. Yes, they have the bigger v-6 and the best towing axle available. The 3.5L with 3.73 axle is one of the best (there are a few better combinations). Raton Pass and going up I-70 pass will mean you will be going slower than other trucks for sure. Slowing down is not so bad really. It really is up to you. The diesel is double the price and has double the power. Of course at a significant reduction in fuel economy.

[lcarver02]

Originally Posted by Winnie2020

I have a Keystone Bullet that weighs in at 6,080 unloaded. I thought my 2013 Ecoboost could handle it but going over the Raton NM pass into CO gave me second thoughts. My trailer, gear, truck, and people weighed in at 14,000 which is 1,500 under the GCVW but it struggled in the mountains of Colorado.

I would consider the Chevy or Ford. However, only the Chevy would fit in my garage from a height standpoint and it doesn't fit from a length standpoint. So either the Ford or Chevy would spend most of its time outside and the Chevy would pull into the garage if we knew hail was coming.

I've been told I don't need a diesel for the 3 or 4 times a year we'd tow this Keystone given the upfront cost of a Diesel and the higher maintenance costs. Is that accurate?

The Chevy has fewer options in gas with respect to rear ends and transmissions as compared to the Ford. Only the Chevy Duramax Diesel gets you a 10 speed transmission. Would I be happier with the Chevy Diesel in a 10 speed and being able to pull it into the garage versus a Ford 7.6 gasser with 10 speed and the myriad of rear end ratios I get with the Ford?

I bet we get bad hail 3 times a year max....I've thought about a hail blanket. I just lean towards the Ford and dealing with hail than going a diesel Chevy. But I'm still open minded.

Thanks!

You should go try a newer (last 4 years) F-150 with a Gen 2 Eco Boost engine and 8 or 10 speed trans. Much different, but take some getting used too. Big improvement for sure. Do some test drives. Just can't usually do those pulling your trailer on vacation.

[Blackrock]

Originally Posted by Dallasrules

What about a dodge?

5.7 Hemi will outpull a 3.5 Ecoburst any day of the week.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by Blackrock

5.7 Hemi will outpull a 3.5 Ecoburst any day of the week.

Do you have any specific data to support that claim or is it just a "trolling statement" to attempt to get members to argue about something that isn't supported by any data?

[Northofu1]

Originally Posted by Blackrock

5.7 Hemi will outpull a 3.5 Ecoburst any day of the week.

CRAP Disturber

[notanlines]

Spoken like a true owner of a 'grocery getter.'

[Northofu1]

Originally Posted by notanlines

Spoken like a true owner of a 'grocery getter.'

Biggest CRAP disturber

[Badbart56]

Not a fan of the Ecoboost, but the 5.7 Ram is beat out in horsepower and torque in 2020-2021 comparison. As for longevity, I would go with the V-8 because I have my doubts about how long the little boosted engine would hold up under constant hauling. But that's not what your statement pertained to. Just a bit of advice. Do your research before you make statements that make you look ignorant.

[sourdough]

Although I like Rams, have owned several 5.7 hemis since the year they came out and dislike the 3.5 Ecoboost for the reasons mentioned above, I don't think the Ram is going to win a head to head battle with the tiny V6 in a towing contest. A BIG win for the Ecoboost? Not in my opinion but having driven the little Ecoboost (2.7) and its big brother (3.5) I can say that Ford coaxes a lot of power from tiny engine blocks by adding many thousands of dollars of mega expensive to repair "add ons". I'll take the V8 any/every day for the simplicity....oh, and the way it sounds vs that nasal V6 noise.