Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Keystone RV Forums > Keystone Community Forums > Odds 'n Ends
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 12-20-2019, 04:31 AM   #1
duh1
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Panhandle of Florida
Posts: 75
Traded my passport in have a grand design imagine 3000qb

I no longer have a Keystone do I have to leave the forum (a bit tongue in cheeak). Thorughly appreciated all the great info shared here. The grand design forum seems pretty modest by comparison. Our passpor was just showing it
s age and felt time to get a new one. Had planned on a bullet and we're set to go but steped into a :-) GD IMAGINE 3000QB AND FELL IN LOVE. passport had 9 years and about 80,000 miles and served us well. Cracked frame on way to buy the new one sealed the decision.
duh1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2019, 04:38 AM   #2
chuckster57
Site Team
 
chuckster57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Modesto
Posts: 20,238
You are welcome to stick around. GD does make some nice stuff, I worked on them for 5 years.
__________________

2012 Copper Canyon 273FWRET being towed by a 1994 Ford F350 CC,LB,Dually diesel.
Airlift 5000 bags, Prodigy brake control, 5 gauges on the pillar.Used to tow a '97 Jayco 323RKS.

Now an RVIA registered tech. Retired from Law enforcement in 2008 after 25+ yrs.
chuckster57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2019, 10:46 PM   #3
Fishsizzle
Senior Member
 
Fishsizzle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
We looked hard at GD. They make nice stuff, but were a little to proud of what they offer for us. Congrats and enjoy!
Fishsizzle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2019, 06:11 AM   #4
66joej
Senior Member
 
66joej's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: radium hot springs bc
Posts: 2,007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fishsizzle View Post
We looked hard at GD. They make nice stuff, but were a little to proud of what they offer for us. Congrats and enjoy!
We were also going to go with Grand Design but thought we wouldn't have anything to complain about so stayed with Cougar.
__________________

2018 Ram 3500 6.4 Harvest Edition
2018 Cougar 27RESWE
66joej is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2019, 06:47 AM   #5
Snoking
Senior Member
 
Snoking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Stevens
Posts: 764
Imagine's on the road

In August of 2018 we bought our Laredo commuter 225MK and left for Arizona in late Sept. We started watching for other TT on the road. Saw one Laredo in 1700 miles. The overall winner in number of units we saw was imagine this GD Imagine's. Going home in the spring and back this fall show the same results, GD Imagine's clear winter on the number of units on the road.

In certain area's other had there numbers increase. Lance in Idaho! Airstream in some areas.
__________________
2019 Laredo 225MK for travel. Bighorn 3575el summer home in Washington, Park Model with Arizona Room for winters.
2015 RAM 3500 SRW CC SB Aisin Laramie
Snoking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2019, 04:35 PM   #6
bsmith0404
Senior Member
 
bsmith0404's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Las Cruces
Posts: 4,665
GD makes some beautiful RVs. They were actually started by 3 guys who were once with Keystone and production processes are very similar. I’ve been to both plants and the similarities are amazing. Imagine is probably the best selling travel trailer made right now so not surprising people are seeing many of them on the road right now. I believe Reflection surpassed Montana as the number one selling 5th wheel this year, but Montana still tops the luxury segment with Solitude and Alpine at #2 and #3. The dealership I work at sells GD and Keystone. It’s nice having both on the lot. Congrats on the 3000QB, it’s a beautiful RV
bsmith0404 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-02-2020, 04:04 PM   #7
RET.LEO
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Quincy
Posts: 64
I had seriously considered GD also but checking their claim of a R40 roof insulation made me laugh. It would take a foot of attic room to be deep enough for R40. I have always been if you exaggerate or lie about one thing what else are you stretching the truth or bold face lying about.
We haven't bought our new trailer yet but Keystone being realistic in R value claims helps to put it in the lead. GD is low on the list right now. Keystone is in the lead followed by Winnebago especially now that they have Azdel in their TT's, Jayco HT Eagle and then GD (kinda, sorta)
RET.LEO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-02-2020, 06:42 PM   #8
bsmith0404
Senior Member
 
bsmith0404's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Las Cruces
Posts: 4,665
Quote:
Originally Posted by RET.LEO View Post
I had seriously considered GD also but checking their claim of a R40 roof insulation made me laugh. It would take a foot of attic room to be deep enough for R40. I have always been if you exaggerate or lie about one thing what else are you stretching the truth or bold face lying about.
We haven't bought our new trailer yet but Keystone being realistic in R value claims helps to put it in the lead. GD is low on the list right now. Keystone is in the lead followed by Winnebago especially now that they have Azdel in their TT's, Jayco HT Eagle and then GD (kinda, sorta)
All R values in RVs are a total of the value offered by accumulation of each layer of materials in a roof/wall/floor. What the true R value is on each RV is debatable. I will tell you we have GD and Keystone both on the lot. When it’s 100 degrees with full sun beating down on them turning each unit into a sweat box, you can tell the difference from brand to brand as you step into them. Go from a passport to an Outback to a Laredo and each one is a bit cooler as you step up in claimed R values. GD with their claimed R40 (accurate or not) are always cooler. You can believe R40 claim or not, but whatever the correct/actual value is, it does work. Not saying you should drop everything and run out to by a GD, but I definitely would not cross them off my list or lower them below other brands because you don’t believe in their calculation of the R values.
bsmith0404 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-02-2020, 08:56 PM   #9
travelin texans
Senior Member
 
travelin texans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Picacho, Az
Posts: 6,809
Quote:
Originally Posted by RET.LEO View Post
I had seriously considered GD also but checking their claim of a R40 roof insulation made me laugh. It would take a foot of attic room to be deep enough for R40. I have always been if you exaggerate or lie about one thing what else are you stretching the truth or bold face lying about.
We haven't bought our new trailer yet but Keystone being realistic in R value claims helps to put it in the lead. GD is low on the list right now. Keystone is in the lead followed by Winnebago especially now that they have Azdel in their TT's, Jayco HT Eagle and then GD (kinda, sorta)
Just FYI, Grand Design is now owned by Winnebago.
__________________
Full-timed 10+ years
Sold '13 Redwood FB
Traded '13 GMC Denali DRW D/A
Replacement undetermined
travelin texans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 01:23 AM   #10
RET.LEO
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Quincy
Posts: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelin texans View Post
Just FYI, Grand Design is now owned by Winnebago.
Has been for some time now.
RET.LEO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 08:24 AM   #11
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,849
Quote:
Originally Posted by RET.LEO View Post
I had seriously considered GD also but checking their claim of a R40 roof insulation made me laugh. It would take a foot of attic room to be deep enough for R40. I have always been if you exaggerate or lie about one thing what else are you stretching the truth or bold face lying about.
We haven't bought our new trailer yet but Keystone being realistic in R value claims helps to put it in the lead. GD is low on the list right now. Keystone is in the lead followed by Winnebago especially now that they have Azdel in their TT's, Jayco HT Eagle and then GD (kinda, sorta)
I didn't "read the GD brochure" as saying the trailers have R-40 insulation in the roof. That "*" behind the comment has a footnote that says, "Equivalent R value".

Essentially, the 3" of fiberglass coupled with the 3/8" OSB, the 1/4" foil backed bubble wrap and the remaining "dead air space" all work together to provide "an insulated space" that's the equivalent of R-40 insulation".

When you consider that the space shuttle walls were 7" thick and provided an "equivalent r value of R-100 (or more), it's not simply "fiberglass blown into the space" at work.... Technology, not spun fiberglass makes up the "boastful difference"...

Just as a 60 watt light "bare bulb" provides a specific amount of light on the table top, if you add a reflector above the bulb, you increase the illumination in the work space. That 60 watt bulb isn't "brighter" rather technology (the reflector) increased the "equivalent light" without a larger bulb.

If you read previous Keystone brochures, you'll find that they also included "boastful R-value computations" that relied on "equivalent R value" to achieve the high numbers.

Technology, ain't it great ?????
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 08:54 AM   #12
flybouy
Site Team
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,714
So John, you mean those light houses that were built hundreds of years ago din't use a multi-million watt light bulb?
__________________
Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
flybouy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 09:32 AM   #13
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,849
Quote:
Originally Posted by flybouy View Post
So John, you mean those light houses that were built hundreds of years ago din't use a multi-million watt light bulb?
Seems I remember a candle, later replaced by a whale oil lamp and a Fresnel lens (to give an equivalent bright light)….
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 10:14 AM   #14
ctbruce
Site Team | Emeritus
 
ctbruce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 3,878
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
Seems I remember a candle, later replaced by a whale oil lamp and a Fresnel lens (to give an equivalent bright light)….
Personal experience??? Or book knowledge? Sorry, couldn't resist. LOL.
__________________

Chip Bruce, RPh
Kansas City, MO
2016 Impact 312
2017 Silverado 3500HD SRW
ctbruce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 10:30 AM   #15
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,849
Quote:
Originally Posted by ctbruce View Post
Personal experience??? Or book knowledge? Sorry, couldn't resist. LOL.
Both.... No, I wasn't around to "witness the originals" but after touring the Lake Superior lighthouses a couple years ago, I saw the "antiques at work"...

I will say, at my "tender young age" there are mornings that I feel like a Whale oil lamp at work, sometimes in an LED environment"..... <sigh>
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 11:23 AM   #16
ctbruce
Site Team | Emeritus
 
ctbruce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 3,878
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
Both.... No, I wasn't around to "witness the originals" but after touring the Lake Superior lighthouses a couple years ago, I saw the "antiques at work"...

I will say, at my "tender young age" there are mornings that I feel like a Whale oil lamp at work, sometimes in an LED environment"..... <sigh>
LOL. Loved the Shipwreck Museum and the other lighthouses we went thru when up there .
__________________

Chip Bruce, RPh
Kansas City, MO
2016 Impact 312
2017 Silverado 3500HD SRW
ctbruce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 03:31 PM   #17
sourdough
Site Team
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 17,601
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
Both.... No, I wasn't around to "witness the originals" but after touring the Lake Superior lighthouses a couple years ago, I saw the "antiques at work"...

I will say, at my "tender young age" there are mornings that I feel like a Whale oil lamp at work, sometimes in an LED environment"..... <sigh>


I would have to say at my "tender young age" there are mornings I feel like "something" but it's not a Whale oil lamp...….
__________________
Danny and Susan, wife of 56 years
2019 Ram 3500 Laramie CC SWB SB 6.4 4x4 4.10
2020 Montana High Country 331RL
sourdough is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 03:47 PM   #18
RET.LEO
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Quincy
Posts: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
I didn't "read the GD brochure" as saying the trailers have R-40 insulation in the roof. That "*" behind the comment has a footnote that says, "Equivalent R value".

Essentially, the 3" of fiberglass coupled with the 3/8" OSB, the 1/4" foil backed bubble wrap and the remaining "dead air space" all work together to provide "an insulated space" that's the equivalent of R-40 insulation".

When you consider that the space shuttle walls were 7" thick and provided an "equivalent r value of R-100 (or more), it's not simply "fiberglass blown into the space" at work.... Technology, not spun fiberglass makes up the "boastful difference"...

Just as a 60 watt light "bare bulb" provides a specific amount of light on the table top, if you add a reflector above the bulb, you increase the illumination in the work space. That 60 watt bulb isn't "brighter" rather technology (the reflector) increased the "equivalent light" without a larger bulb.

If you read previous Keystone brochures, you'll find that they also included "boastful R-value computations" that relied on "equivalent R value" to achieve the high numbers.

Technology, ain't it great ?????
Watch this vid for Grand Design roof and construction
RET.LEO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 04:08 PM   #19
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,849
I haven't watched the entire video, but may, if I find time. But, my opinion, for what it's worth:

The trailer in that video is a GD Transcend. It's an entry level, wood frame, aluminum sided "minimally priced" trailer. Trying to compare it to an aluminum framed, fiberglass "vacuum formed wall" structure is like comparing a fabric skinned biplane to a modern aluminum private airplane. About the only similarity is that they both have propellers.... About the only similarity between the Transcend and, for example, a Montana High Country is that they both have 4 wheels on two axles. Otherwise, they're different trailers with different components and different construction....

Apples to oranges, definitely not a "side by side comparison of competitive models...…
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 04:34 PM   #20
bsmith0404
Senior Member
 
bsmith0404's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Las Cruces
Posts: 4,665
Transcend uses a new roof material which has a 15 year warranty bs the 12 year on TPO. This may be some growing pains they’re going through, but Transcend is the only GD line that uses it. We’ve sold many Transcends and have not seen any problems with the roof on them yet, so I would guess this isn’t a normal wide spread problem. Also, having been through both factories and the fact that the guys who started GD came from Keystone, the two are built very similar. I personally wouldn’t hesitate to buy either. I’ve also seen first hand what their customer service is like, they’re top notch. They have actually pushed Keystone to be better. They both have pushed each other to be better.
bsmith0404 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
passport

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates in any way. Keystone RV® is a registered trademark of the Keystone RV Company.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.