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Old 01-05-2016, 08:42 AM   #21
Desert185
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For 220# GVW vs $10,000CDN, when everything else is under, I would drive it and enjoy it. You or the truck will never know the difference...but that's just me.
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Old 01-05-2016, 11:28 AM   #22
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Hi cw3jason - So the way I calculated it was, "loaded truck weight" which is without the tongue weight of the trailer, but includes a full tank of fuel, 4 members of our family (with kids car seats in) + gear in the bed. In other words, all I need to do then is add WD hitch weight + trailer tongue weight (which is 670lbs combined).
got it. hard to believe you are over, but The numbers dont lie. If you can move 300lbs of cargo from your bed into the trailer, you may increase your tounge weight some, but could help keep you under on all your numbers. 300lbs of weight added to the trailer if placed in the right spot would only add about 30lbs of toung weight and put you under your GVWR. Just a thought.
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Old 01-05-2016, 11:45 AM   #23
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Personally, I would take it to a scale and get accurate numbers not calculated ones. Is it actually 220 lbs or is 150 or 400? Get accurate numbers, with everything set up as it will be when towing. The WDH may transfer enough weight to make a difference. If it is actually 220, as others have suggested, a repack with transferring some items to different locations may be able to solve your problem.

Personally, with a 200 lb GVWR difference when GCWR is still well below the max, I don't believe you have a safety issue as the brakes are rated to stop the GCWR. I would be looking closely at axle rating and tire weight ratings and see where you are at with actual numbers there. 1500s have a P rated tire which typically don't have much for weight ratings. A step up to a LT tire may be in order. If you don't have any concerns about dropping $10k, then get the 2500. My guess is you are definitely looking used for that kind of money. A new 2500 is several thousand more than a 1500 and you are probably going to take a $6-8k bath on your 1500.
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Old 01-05-2016, 02:19 PM   #24
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Personally, I would take it to a scale and get accurate numbers not calculated ones. Is it actually 220 lbs or is 150 or 400? Get accurate numbers, with everything set up as it will be when towing. The WDH may transfer enough weight to make a difference. If it is actually 220, as others have suggested, a repack with transferring some items to different locations may be able to solve your problem.

Personally, with a 200 lb GVWR difference when GCWR is still well below the max, I don't believe you have a safety issue as the brakes are rated to stop the GCWR. I would be looking closely at axle rating and tire weight ratings and see where you are at with actual numbers there. 1500s have a P rated tire which typically don't have much for weight ratings. A step up to a LT tire may be in order. If you don't have any concerns about dropping $10k, then get the 2500. My guess is you are definitely looking used for that kind of money. A new 2500 is several thousand more than a 1500 and you are probably going to take a $6-8k bath on your 1500.
I agree. I think you can make it work. You said the trailer only weighs 6000 loaded. Unless you just want a new truck.............

In which case I agree it's a safety issue, and I'll back you up with your significant other...........





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Old 01-05-2016, 03:50 PM   #25
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This is an industry standard;

GVWR is the maximum allowable weight for a fully loaded pickup, including passengers, cargo and trailer tongue weight. A truck’s gross vehicle weight (measured by driving a loaded truck onto a scale) must never exceed the GVWR.

This is a brief description about industry standards;

Industry standards generally form the basis for demonstrating product safety and quality before courts, regulators, retailers, consumers and others.
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Old 01-05-2016, 05:42 PM   #26
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Just to play devils advocate, we're talking about 200 lbs. The government also posts speed limits and we know how that works too. Safe driving can trump marginal equipment as easily as marginal driving can trump safe equipment. If we are talking about 2000lbs over, different story. I know, where do we draw the line......

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Old 01-05-2016, 07:22 PM   #27
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I completely get your point, Larry337, and I agree with your view of the question. The simplest answer is another question: Where does the lawyer for the other side define "too much" and "overload" and "GVW/GCWR" should anything happen??? For many, it's never a concern, but for the one person caught up in an accident, whether they are at fault or not, and the "ambulance chasers" are nipping at their heels, where to "draw the line" becomes a critical factor on their future security.

For some people, it's "pas de souci" for other's it's "protection de soi"
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Old 01-05-2016, 08:05 PM   #28
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I think I would get a good weight on all axles at a CAT scale. Then rearrange your cargo in the trailer. If your fresh water tank is at the rear, fill it. Then weigh again.
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Old 01-06-2016, 03:26 AM   #29
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What ^^^^Gearhead said. This whole argument has to start at the CAT scale and then go from there.
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Old 01-06-2016, 08:10 AM   #30
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What ^^^^Gearhead said. This whole argument has to start at the CAT scale and then go from there.
I think "argument" is a little harsh. ... I think maybe discussion. One that never ends, on and on......

It's all good.

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Old 01-06-2016, 09:46 AM   #31
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Hi again folks,

Thanks again for all of the responses. Some really good advice and opinions here which I very much appreciate.

On the possible 2500 upgrade - I heard from 1 dealer today, $8,500 will upgrade me to a nicely equipped brand new 2016 2500 SLT with all the options I need. Less than my expected $10k, hence i'm seriously considering it right now as it's a great deal on much more truck which will “future proof” us in case we go 5th wheel shopping.

That said, before I throw another $8,500 down, I'm going to go and hitch up and take the entire combo to the scales, as suggested as I too feel that it could work. I have actually towed a similar sized and weighted trailer with a 2011 Ram 1500 Sport, and I found it was pretty strong. You’re all correct that I’m “calculating” my weights here, but I have weighed my truck and trailer weights (separately), I have just not towed with it yeor weighed the two combined as a hitched unit.

Heading to the scales tonight....
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Old 01-06-2016, 05:35 PM   #32
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Less than my expected $10k, hence i'm seriously considering it right now as it's a great deal on much more truck which will “future proof” us in case we go 5th wheel shopping.
I seem to remember thinking the same thing when I had my 2500 duramax, then I bought a 40' 15,500 lb 5er and soon after a 3500 DRW.
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Old 01-06-2016, 05:37 PM   #33
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Agreed...don't think you are future proofed with a 2500...especially if I ever consider a toy hauler. I skipped the 2500 and went to 3500 srw...then bought a heavier Toy hauler than expected. I'm at max limits of the truck...dually would be better


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Old 01-07-2016, 12:25 AM   #34
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Agreed...don't think you are future proofed with a 2500...especially if I ever consider a toy hauler. I skipped the 2500 and went to 3500 srw...then bought a heavier Toy hauler than expected. I'm at max limits of the truck...dually would be better


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X2. If you are even remotely considering a 5th in the future, don't mess around with a 2500 series truck. Get a 3500. The price difference is remarkably little and they typically have about 1000 lb. higher GVWR. If Dodge is anything like Ford, the price difference is well under $1000 and 350/3500's resell better.
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Old 01-07-2016, 09:30 AM   #35
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So, a quick update - unfortunately I couldn't get our trailer out of storage last night (it was snowed in at the storage yard), but I did load up some gear (not much, just the essentials of what we'd carry in the bed) + full gas + the family + odds and ends in the truck. We hit the scales at 6,380lbs. If I add my 650lbs hitch (note: I HAVE weighed hitch weight of the trailer separately), i'm now calculating at 7,030 GVWR, which is just 130lbs over.... 90lbs less than I first thought. Note: i'm still 2,800lbs UNDER GCWR.

I'm still considering the 2500 as the price is very attractive, but i'm now closer to keeping the 1500 and seeing how it goes after a few trips this spring, AND waiting until I weigh everything fully hooked up and ready to camp.

Appreciate the thoughts on the 3500's though.... I didn't realize they were so close in price. I am thinking 2500 mainly due to the better ride comfort though (rear coil springs), as this is still my daily driver, so I am looking at a 6.4L Hemi 2500 SLT, loaded, which has a GVWR of 10,000lbs.
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Old 01-07-2016, 11:04 AM   #36
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Just a note to my "calculated trailer hitch weight". This is not a calculation, 650lbs was my hitch weight which I weighed last summer - that was with 2 20lbs propane tanks (full) and 2 x group 24 batteries on the hitch.

So, I now have an accurate 6380lbs of truck + 650lbs, calculating the 2 = 7,030GVWR on the truck. I know this still isn't fully accurate, as I need to weigh everything hitched, but wanted to clarify.
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Old 01-08-2016, 05:05 AM   #37
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Yep, get it weighed loaded up, a WDH will transfer some of the tongue weight to the front of the truck (which won't affect the weight against your GVWR numbers) and some to the trailer, which will lower the weight against your GVWR numbers.

As for the 2500 vs 3500 debate, drive them before you buy you may be surprised. I can't speak for Dodge, but the new GM 3500s ride very soft and smooth with the new suspension design. They use multiple overload springs with fewer springs in use for unloaded conditions. The overload springs kick in as weight is added, so you only have stiffer springs when needed. Makes them ride like a 1500 when empty. If you're set on a Ram, I'm sure they are doing something to soften the ride as well. Of course, I do know a lot of transporters that add air bags to their Dodge trucks because they say it softens the stiff ride
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Old 01-08-2016, 05:32 AM   #38
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My ram 3500 srw rides stiffer than the ram 2500 for sure. The 2500 uses coil springs in the rear. Not sure about the new air ride equipped ram 3500's as they didn't have it available when I ordered my truck.


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Old 01-08-2016, 03:58 PM   #39
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That's a really nice looking 2500! I'm actually looking at the same truck, but a short bed, with the black appearance package also.
Thanks, its a 3500. I did have a boss on one jobsite who had a 2500 longbox, rode just as rough as my 3500.

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Old 01-08-2016, 05:18 PM   #40
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I can't help myself....

I've been driving pickups for nearly fifty years and I've never bought a single one because of how it rides. A pickup truck is a tool, you buy them to haul or pull. If you want a Cadillac ride, buy one.
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