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Old 09-14-2020, 03:45 PM   #61
mikec557
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Quote:
Originally Posted by byerskm View Post
I know what you mean. I have a long bit like that. What length were your battery/inverter cables? I have examined it from the bottom, prodding with a long bit in the area where all the other cables go in. Problem is that "I" beam. The cables go under it, then in behind it, and then go thru a hole in it to get back in front so they can go up the sloped wall. I'm sure you know this. There's just no way to fish a thick cable through these twist and turns. I'm glad you told me that deck/floor is 2" thick. I never would have known until I ran into problems. I was planning to use a hole saw I have for my drill also. If I didn't know about the 2", I surely would have made a mistake or two in location and really buggered up my pass-thru floor.
I bought an $80 hydraulic cable crimper from Amazon and made my own 2ga cables. There was just no way I could figure out how to utilize pre-made cables. So lengthwise I don't know. I bought something like 20ft of cable, held it up from battery to inside destination, added an extra foot or two and cut the cable. Then fine tuned the length as I installed it...

Edit: dinner interrupted my train of thought...

I needed to remake some 6ga cable ends because of bad crimps at the factory. I needed to make all my own 8ga wires because they didn't leave a loop inside the pass through. I had to reroute the battery to frame connection and replaced their 6ga with 2ga, and part of that was putting the shunt for the battery monitor inside the pass through. It needed 2ga, so it was easier to go 2ga to the frame. I bought cables, ends, shrink wrap, and the crimper from Amazon. It was nice to have the right length cable for each task. It's the first time I did that. Now I'm spoiled, it's the only way I'd do that.
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Old 09-19-2020, 09:11 AM   #62
WJQ
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Lower Cost Crimper

Both of you are doing a great job documenting your solar install. Here is one item others might consider. I bought a manual cable crimper from Amazon. As one of you pointed out, trying to figure out the battery cable length in advance is a challenge. So, I decided on making my own cables as Mike did. Here is the link for the crimper.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I bought mine a month ago for crimping 1 AWG cables. It works great. It came with a cable cutter which also works great. I can't imaging cutting 1 AWG wire with anything else. I will be revising some of the Keystone 6 AWG wiring and the crimper covers it just fine.

I bought my wire from http://acdcwire.com/ . It is welding cable and great quality at much lower cost than I foound elsewhere. I calculated my wire length at 5 feet and then ordered 6 feet. I had 3 inches of red left over and no black. So much for my calculations. There are easy wire lengths to miss on your first install such as the lenght needed for coupling a cutoff switch and a fuse. I also ordered the necessary lugs from them as they have all different wire sizes and come in different post sizes..

I also forgot to order some additional wire to connect my two 6 volt batteries. It needs to be upgraded from the No. 6 AWG to 1 AWG.

Keep up the good documentation. I am done but have not updateded my thread. I just finished a 5 day trip and all works well.
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Old 09-19-2020, 01:11 PM   #63
mikec557
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WJQ View Post
Both of you are doing a great job documenting your solar install. Here is one item others might consider. A manual cable crimper from Amazon. As one of you pointed out, trying to figure out the battery cable length in advance is a challenge. So, I decided on making my own cables as Mike did. Here is the link for the crimper.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I bought mine a month ago for crimping 1 AWG cables. It works great. I cam with a cable cutter which also works great. I will be revising some of the Keystone 6 AWG wiring and it covers it just fine.

I bought my wire from http://acdcwire.com/ . It is welding cable and great quality at much lower cost than I foound elsewhere. I calculate my wire length at 5 feet and then ordered 6 feet. I had 3 inches of red left over and no black. So much for my calculations. I also ordered the lugs from them.

I also forgot to order some additional wire to connect my two 6 volt batteries. It needs to be upgraded from the No. 6 AWG to 1 AWG.

Keep up the good documentation. I am done but have not updateded my thread. I just finished a 5 day trip and all works well.

Thanks. It's my way of paying back. I've learned a lot from reading other people's threads. I'm glad my installation experience will help others with the same or similar project.

I went with the hydraulic because I thought it might fit into tighter locations and because I thought I could get tighter crimps rather than using my muscle power on the "manual" crimpers. Too often I got bad crimps using the hand squeezer method.

Speaking of which, I have to go back and finish up my other thread where I got a false Hot/Gnd electrical cross error light. Turned out to be a loose (read: disconnected) Neutral. What a pain that repair was. But the repair brought 4 outlets back to life and provided electricity so I can add an outlet in the slideout where there is presently no outlet.
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Old 09-19-2020, 07:14 PM   #64
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Mike and WJQ,

No doubt, great help from you guys sharing on the forum. I bought a hydraulic crimper also, received it Wednesday. Today, I got all my electrical done. That crimper was invaluable. I'll post some pictures and a few things I've done differently (based on advice from my 84 yr old BSEE dad). Speaking of which, he shared an article with me about how common lightning damage is to RVs. Direct strikes are rare, but indirect are common and do a lot of damage ($$$'s). The problem is even moreso for RVs with solar. I will share the link tomorrow. We should probably start a new thread on this subject, if it doesn't already exist. Surge protection devices, SPD, work very well to protect all the appliances and solar related equipment.
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Old 09-20-2020, 07:11 AM   #65
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Surge Protection Devices for RV's With Solar

I am definitely interested in the article you referenced. I currently have no SPD protection but I do have a lot invested in RV electrical components.

I rarely/never connect to shore power. All of my camping is in locations where there is none. Thus, the need for my solar charging system and my Honda 2000 for backup if the weather limits the solar gain.
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Old 09-20-2020, 12:00 PM   #66
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The greatest risk for indirect lightening damage, and other power anomalies, does come thru the shore power. So, the fact you don't connect to shore power greatly reduced your risks. Here's the link to the article on this subject.

https://www.ervsolar.com/rv-blog/RV-...-happen-to-you
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Old 09-20-2020, 03:30 PM   #67
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Solar Ready in Pass-Thru 2021 Cougar 26RBS - UPDATE

Yesterday was the day to get all the electronics finished and installed in the pass-thru. The first thing I'll report is that with a good hydraulic crimper on hand and being able to make high quality splices, I chose to extend the Keystone pre-installed wires such that I could do all the wiring and electronics install on the board sitting on a table just outside the pass-thru opening. Having climbed inside the pass-thru a couple times, it was clear that making some of those connections was going to be really tough. One difference in my 26RBS and Mike's is the fact my board had to be positioned further into the compartment due to the position of the auto-level controls. The first picture shows my board sitting on the table where I completed all of the connections, except for the battery cable to the inverter. Well, there were two ground wires I didn't put on until the board was installed. This was just a logistics issue as I didn't have the bare copper wire needed yesterday and so I went ahead and installed the board. Putting those ground wires in today validated that it was worth extending those wires so I could do most of the work outside the pass-thru.

The second pictures shows a shot of the main wiring involved. I also installed breakers on the hot wires going into and out of the Solar Charge Controller (SCC). Doing this is really beneficial as you can isolate components and energize components carefully and in the correct sequence after all the connections have been made.

The third photo shows the board installed in the pass-thru with the battery cables attached. The ground wires are still not installed.

Then, the fourth photo is after I attached the ground wires. Note, I ran the main ground from the breaker box to the black Battery cable coming out of the SCC. That black cable was installed by Keystone and it attaches to the trailer frame before continuing on to the negative battery post. The attachment to the trailer frame provides a solid ground for the equipment. The other ground wire you will see in the fourth photo is the case ground wire from the inverter running to the ground lug in the breaker box.

The fifth photo is another shot of the installed panel, but taken a bit further back so you can see the battery cables coming up through the floor. I copied Mike's work here as I couldn't find any better route for those very heavy cables. I chose to use 1" wire loom, unslit.

Now, stepping back to look at a couple pictures of the battery cables install. Just a couple pictures here, photos 6 - 9. I'm going to try to post now, to see if all those photos will load.
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Old 09-20-2020, 03:33 PM   #68
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So, MIKEC557, I imagine you can see a few similarities. Your posts have been very helpful.

At this point, I am almost finished except for installing the panels on the roof. I can't proceed with that until the mounting brackets from AMSolar deliver late this week. Shipments have been slow to get out of there, due to the fires and how busy they are.

I said almost because there are two items that can be done later. You may see the coiled up romex on the right side of the board. That is for an outlet I will install on the opposite side of the pass-thru, so it is accessible to the area under the awning where we spend a lot of time. Then, there is the remote for the inverter. I already connected it. It is connected with a phone line that is several feet long. For now, I am leaving it in the pass-thru. Later, I will run that wire up to the bedroom and install it on the wall in a convenient location.

I can report that I powered up the inverter and verified it was working properly. It was nice to see a tangible result. Hopefully by this time next week, I'll have my panels installed and everything will be working.
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Old 09-20-2020, 04:14 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by byerskm View Post
So, MIKEC557, I imagine you can see a few similarities. Your posts have been very helpful.

At this point, I am almost finished except for installing the panels on the roof. I can't proceed with that until the mounting brackets from AMSolar deliver late this week. Shipments have been slow to get out of there, due to the fires and how busy they are.

I said almost because there are two items that can be done later. You may see the coiled up romex on the right side of the board. That is for an outlet I will install on the opposite side of the pass-thru, so it is accessible to the area under the awning where we spend a lot of time. Then, there is the remote for the inverter. I already connected it. It is connected with a phone line that is several feet long. For now, I am leaving it in the pass-thru. Later, I will run that wire up to the bedroom and install it on the wall in a convenient location.

I can report that I powered up the inverter and verified it was working properly. It was nice to see a tangible result. Hopefully by this time next week, I'll have my panels installed and everything will be working.

Your install looks great!

Just a thought on the remote button. When I installed an AIMS on our 5th wheel the remote button had a "back end" that was about 1.5 x 1.5 inch that was supposed recessed into the wall. I didn't want to make another custom hole in the wall to flush mount it. Instead, I mounted it into a gray box just like you used for the solar project. I used a multi-tool to cut a square hole in the face of a plastic single gang solid cover. Then I surface mounted the box with a couple screws.

Later, when I sold that RV I was able to keep the AIMS and the remote without leaving a square hole in the paneling.

Hope that makes sense.

Again, great job on your install. It looks great.
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Old 09-24-2020, 05:11 AM   #70
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MIKEC557 & WJQ, I've been meaning to ask you a couple questions.

1. Ventilation, to prevent overheating. Have either of you installed any type of ventilation to prevent the compartment, and hence equipment, from overheating? If yes, please share what your approach. If not, please share your experience without it.

2. Battery vs Solar Charge Controller (SCC) temperature. The Victron documentation states that more than 5 degree C difference will affect performance and battery life, unless a battery temperature sensor is used to provide the SCC with battery temperature so that the charging parameters can be adjusted to compensate. I spoke with Battle Born after reading this and they told me not to worry, it would be insignificant. I described my install where I would expect temperature difference to frequently exceed 5 degrees C. Have either of you addressed this issue? Please share.
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Old 09-24-2020, 07:54 AM   #71
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Not Fully Tested Yet

The Aims 2000 W inverter I have installed recommends a 250 amp fuse. My 250 amp fuse box came with 60 amp fuses inside! Thus, on my next trip a few days later I limited my power use to much less than my design goal of about 1500 Watts.

The power use I tested was limited to about 150 to 200 Watts. At that power use, there was no surface temp rise based on the "touch" monitor. More later when I get the larger fuses!

On the battery temperature issue, I just bought and installed the Victron battery temp monitor. Pretty low cost and transmits data to my Victron App.
So, temperature compensation is automatic. Is it necessary? I can not offer how nevessary but at this price I am not concerned about how necessary. My two 6 volt batteries cost north of $300 so life extension is a good goal.
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Old 09-24-2020, 10:26 AM   #72
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Originally Posted by byerskm View Post
MIKEC557 & WJQ, I've been meaning to ask you a couple questions.

1. Ventilation, to prevent overheating. Have either of you installed any type of ventilation to prevent the compartment, and hence equipment, from overheating? If yes, please share what your approach. If not, please share your experience without it.

2. Battery vs Solar Charge Controller (SCC) temperature. The Victron documentation states that more than 5 degree C difference will affect performance and battery life, unless a battery temperature sensor is used to provide the SCC with battery temperature so that the charging parameters can be adjusted to compensate. I spoke with Battle Born after reading this and they told me not to worry, it would be insignificant. I described my install where I would expect temperature difference to frequently exceed 5 degrees C. Have either of you addressed this issue? Please share.
Regarding ventilation, I have not provided any. We've camped from cold to 105F degrees and the passthrough was whatever temp it is/was. In my pass through I don't see how I could provide any ventilation that didn't also allow some amount of water infiltration.

Regarding battery temperature, I have the Victron doo-dad that you bolt to a battery positive terminal and run the wire to the SCC, but I haven't installed it. On my 5thW I didn't need to because the batteries and the SCC were in the same front compartment. On my 26RBSWE the batteries are out on the tongue and the SCC is inside the pass through, so there very likely is a temperature difference. But between the Progress Dynamics converter/charger always being on when we have hookups, and the solar constantly on whether we are on solar or boondocking, I'm relying on the Battleborn BMS to take care of the batteries. With the 200Ah of usable power being so much more than I need, I don't care if the batteries are less than perfectly fully charged because of a temperature difference.

I like BattleBorn's answer: fugetaboutit!

Mike
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Old 09-24-2020, 04:41 PM   #73
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I also have the Aims 2000W inverter (with pass thru/auto transfer switch). Have only put 100-200 Watt load on it for brief period. Likewise, no heat per hand check and cooling fan did not even come on. So, jury still out here also.

I spoke to Battle Born again on the battery vs SCC temp. I have two of their Lithium Ion 100AH 12V batteries. The guy I spoke to today gave more explanation. He said with their batteries, not to worry. The onboard battery management system (BMS microprocessor on each battery) monitors all the variables and protects the battery. So, basically, he said it will prevent the Victron from applying to much charge voltage if conditions warrant. He stated that the Victron works very well with their batteries without need for the additional temperature sensor hardware. He did say for lead acid batteries, it is probably important.
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Old 09-24-2020, 04:46 PM   #74
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Just got your reply after making my post. All in agreement in regard to Battle Born BMS. Good deal.
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Old 09-25-2020, 12:05 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by mikec557 View Post
Your install looks great!

Just a thought on the remote button. When I installed an AIMS on our 5th wheel the remote button had a "back end" that was about 1.5 x 1.5 inch that was supposed recessed into the wall. I didn't want to make another custom hole in the wall to flush mount it. Instead, I mounted it into a gray box just like you used for the solar project. I used a multi-tool to cut a square hole in the face of a plastic single gang solid cover. Then I surface mounted the box with a couple screws.

Later, when I sold that RV I was able to keep the AIMS and the remote without leaving a square hole in the paneling.

Hope that makes sense.

Again, great job on your install. It looks great.
Thanks for the suggestion on the Aims inverter remote. It is exactly as you mentioned. I do plan to find a way to locate it inside, but without the hole in the wall.
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Old 09-26-2020, 05:45 AM   #76
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Remote Location without Hole In the Wall

I find the remote for the Aims 2000 very useful when I turn things off at night when using the inverter. The only downside is that my Wally for Dish TV has to go through its time-consuming ritual each time it is activated and takes about 10 minutes.

I located in the side of my sink cabinet, I routed the control wire at the same time I routed the 120V AC wires for my new subpanel. These are routed under the floor by cutting slots int the coroplast and later retaping the slots.

Another option I have use in a different RV is to create a wooden block with the reght dimenstions that looks like a small panel and mount it with screws to the surcace where you do not want a hole. I have used a two piece snap together plastic channel to cover the wire if needed (I can't recall the trade name). It has a double back tape on the wall side and the from cover snaps in place.

You definitely need to choose a convenient accessible location. It not only indicates the on/off status of the inverter, the "on" green color changes when you are connected to shore power (in my case, my Honda Generator).
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Old 09-29-2020, 04:25 AM   #77
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Solar Ready in Pass-Thru 2021 Cougar 26RBS - FINAL UPDATE

Since this is my final post in regard to describing the install, I want to thank MIKEC557 and WJQ one last time. Your shared experiences and ideas posted were extremely helpful and saved me a lot of time and probably prevented me from pursuing less effective solutions to some of the tasks.

I finished up the installation this past Saturday, when I installed the panels. My panels are 200W each and weigh 25lbs ea. Not so heavy, but not something you can just grab in one hand and climb the ladder with. So, it was nice to have my wife's (Mary) help on this final push to finish the job. We used a blanket to protect panels and side of trailer and rope to lift the panels carefully up to the roof, as Mary guided the panel from the ground as I lifted.

Installing the panels was somewhat anti-climatic as it was pretty simple, thanks to all the great advice received on the forum. The AMSolar rocker mounts are great and easy to install. I had installed the panel part of the mounts prior. So, all that was required was to position the panels, mark the screw locations, clean the surface with isopropyl alcohol, screw the mounts to the roof, and use dicor RV roof sealant to completely cover the mounts to assure no roof leakage.

I chose not to drill small pilot holes before driving the mounting screws. I wanted the screws to be as tight as possible in the wood. Also, I chose to use a hand-held screw driver and not my drill to drive the screws in. I just didn't want to take the slightest risk of mucking up a single screw hole. My drill has various settings to reduce the torque and prevent stripping out a hole, but I just didn't want to risk it. Being able to feel how tight each screw was, as it bottomed out, gave me much better sense of when to stop.

I also used the Eternabond tape, suggested here on the forum, to anchor the panel wires to the roof. I'll have to monitor this to be sure the wires are not flapping in the wind while driving. I wanted to leave enough slack so that the panels can be tilted if needed. So, I'm not 100% sure the wires will be secure enough. I do plan to go back on the roof and use electrical tape to wrap/seal the MC4 connectors and prevent any moisture entry into the sockets.

I've posted a couple pictures below, of the panels installed on the roof. For the last few days, I've been monitoring the system and everything is working great. I really like the Victron Connect app for monitoring the output of the panels, the output of the solar charger, and the battery condition.

Finally, we met out goal! Installation and check out prior to Oct 1st. We will be leaving for a month long RV trip come Friday Oct 2nd. Having the solar power adds a degree of freedom for our travels that we will really enjoy.
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Old 09-29-2020, 05:43 AM   #78
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Have a good solar system will give you the freedom to visit see different places. I have a simple voltmeter wired direct to the batteries and mounted inside . I notice the voltmeter is always 14+ when using solar.
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Old 11-04-2020, 06:33 PM   #79
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Drawing

Here is a drawing of how the solar should be
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Old 11-04-2020, 07:07 PM   #80
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Here is a drawing of how the solar should be
Thanks for the drawing. I don't mean to look a gift horse in the mouth but is there any way you can scan that to PDF so it's a little clearer?

Thanks
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