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Old 08-01-2020, 09:26 AM   #21
flybouy
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Originally Posted by Bill-2020 View Post
Wait just one second there! I'm supposed to have "Sewer Outlet" stickers?! I got the 50amp sticker next to my 30amp connection instead of the sewer stickers... dang I feel ripped off
Shhhhhh! Don't let them know about the "upgrade" Amp sticker they may want to ask for an "upcharge" for that option!
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Old 08-01-2020, 05:48 PM   #22
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Shhhhhh! Don't let them know about the "upgrade" Amp sticker they may want to ask for an "upcharge" for that option!
If I can get that 50amp sticker off cleanly enough, I'm gonna slap it on the side of the riding mower.
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Old 08-01-2020, 06:14 PM   #23
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If I can get that 50amp sticker off cleanly enough, I'm gonna slap it on the side of the riding mower.
I'm not sure on this, but that 50 amp sticker might be like the mattress stickers: DO NOT REMOVE UNDER PENALTY OF LAW.....

Wouldn't want you going to jail with a sticker in the wrong place on the wrong equipment !!!!!
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Old 08-01-2020, 06:31 PM   #24
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Reminds me of the kids who bought the early Mustangs of the 1960's. If it had the 200 six they'd go buy the 289 V8 badges for the front fenders.
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Old 08-01-2020, 06:39 PM   #25
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Reminds me of the kids who bought the early Mustangs of the 1960's. If it had the 200 six they'd go buy the 289 V8 badges for the front fenders.
I found a set of brand new V10 badges in a motorhome. Thinking about putting them on my Kia Soul
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Old 08-01-2020, 07:00 PM   #26
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Years ago I was in Boston and Hertz ran out of cars and I had to take a Jeep Compass. They had just hit the market. Drove it for the 3 days I was there and when I returned it I asked them if they could open the hood. When the attendant asked why I told him I had a bet with someone and wanted to see if it was powered by Tecumseh or Briggs & Stratton. I swear my riding mower had more power.
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Old 08-02-2020, 05:08 AM   #27
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I lived with my family overseas for quite a few years from the early 70s to 1983. We had our beloved Chevy Vega wagon that was still under 20K miles but had been dropped HARD when unloading from a ship and the thing rattled so badly it was scary. I had set aside funds to buy a NEW CAR but was kind of naive about price increases. Went to the Chevy dealer and asked what I could buy for $4000 and he asked me if I had been doing time; really.


Anyway, they had a Mercury Zeypher (I think it had additional names). It was a family sedan and was kind of nice looking with a vinyl roof and was a 3 speed stick if memory serves. It had a really nice interior and although used, look and smelled new. Drove it a mile or two and took it home as our new family vehicle.



First trip, filled it up, put my 3 little girls in the back and headed to Ohio to visit my wife's kin folk. Going up a hill on the PA Turnpike, had to resort to the truck lane and drive up the hiills in a lower gear. It was embarrassing. Found the car had been built for a gas shortage and was equipped with a TINY 4 cylinder engine in what was then a full size car. A short time later went back to the Chevy dealer and bought a new 1985 Caprice Classic 2 door with V8 and automatic and my wife and daughters drove that thing for over 10 years. I rode a motorcycle to work and eventually got a real old VW bug to take on rainy (and rare snow) days.
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Old 08-05-2020, 07:57 AM   #28
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So I just got an email back from Keystone and they said ANY Passport manufactured after September 2019 has a walkable roof. Regardless of wether it has a ladder or not.

My initial email is below his response.

Hey Paul
That is true in some instances. However, Passport started installing walk on roofs in September 2019. If you have a vin #, you can call Keystone customer service to verify.





John Thomas
Key Connect Program Manager
Keystone RV Company
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Desk: 574-535-1492

re: I read in the owners manual online a section that said “if a camper does not have a ladder, the roof is not walkable”. Is that just old information?
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Old 08-05-2020, 09:13 AM   #29
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So I just got an email back from Keystone and they said ANY Passport manufactured after September 2019 has a walkable roof. Regardless of wether it has a ladder or not.

My initial email is below his response.

Hey Paul
That is true in some instances. However, Passport started installing walk on roofs in September 2019. If you have a vin #, you can call Keystone customer service to verify.





John Thomas
Key Connect Program Manager
Keystone RV Company
[email protected]
Desk: 574-535-1492

re: I read in the owners manual online a section that said “if a camper does not have a ladder, the roof is not walkable”. Is that just old information?

Did you, by chance, in your conversations, establish a "weight limit" or just that, "The roofs are walkable" if built after September, 2019 ??? In other words, "What is the definition of "walkable roof" or "walk on roof" ????
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Old 08-05-2020, 09:14 AM   #30
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I did not. Excellent point. They did not specify either.
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Old 08-05-2020, 12:17 PM   #31
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I did not. Excellent point. They did not specify either.
...And the plot thickens... (Keystone will now get a rash of calls from new Passport owners with a VIN in hand.)
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Old 08-06-2020, 10:45 AM   #32
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I asked... the answer still doesn’t seem definitive.

Hi Paul
I have been told the roof ladders hold 250#, so I would use that as a guide line.





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Old 08-06-2020, 11:05 AM   #33
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I asked... the answer still doesn’t seem definitive.

Hi Paul
I have been told the roof ladders hold 250#, so I would use that as a guide line.





John Thomas
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[email protected]
Desk: 574-535-1492


Aside from the question about the roof being walkable or not, which is still questionable to me, the above comment that Mr. Thomas "has been told" the ladder will support 250lbs. is problematic to me.

My roof ladders (including the one on this new MHC) came from the factory. I wouldn't let 250lbs. get near a rung on it. I had the dealer do a roof mtce. on my previous trailer. The tech doing it (saw him upon pick up) weighed maybe 180. Got home and the top handles were bent and EVERY single screw on every mounting bracket was loose. If he had been 250 who knows what would have happened.
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Old 08-06-2020, 11:10 AM   #34
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It’s insane!! Amazes me that you cannot get a straight answer on something that is completely reasonable to ask. Obviously, the reason nobody wants to answer definitively is to reduce or remove liability.
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Old 08-06-2020, 11:36 AM   #35
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According to the doc’s balance scale last week I’m in at 216, so if I carry the new a/c across the roof I’ve overloaded it with each footstep... guess I’ll pick up some plywood and make myself a walkway from the side or rear. Rear is easier in this instance for me. Thanks for the additional information from Keystone. Much appreciated, sir.
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Old 08-06-2020, 12:06 PM   #36
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OK, let's make it "really confusing".....

First, Keystone uses "less than grade 1 plywood (cheapest bid, probably CDX, which is grade C face, grade D inner layer, grade X bottom layer)...

If we're "lucky" all of our roof trusses are 16" on center without any deviations... Think about how wide the space is for the air conditioner, and you get the idea some of them may be further apart than 16"...

Here's the APA Load Span Tables for plywood: http://www.pacificwoodlaminates.com/...SpanTables.pdf Look at Table 3: 3/8" grade 1 sanded plywood is rated at 79 pounds per square foot when installed on trusses 16" on center....

Now, let's look at our "feet in shoes"... Most men wear shoes that are around 12" long, 4" wide, which is 48 square inches... That's 1/3 of a square foot... We have 2 feet, but when we walk, our ENTIRE body weight is applied to one foot (the other one is in the air)....

So, if you weigh 200 pounds, when "walking on the roof, wearing shoes" you are applying roughly 200 pounds to 1/3 of a square foot of "cheaper than the Grade 1 rating" plywood... So, the potential to damage the roof by walking on it is increased based on "cheaper (inferior) materials, walking with 1 foot in the air, twisting on the TPO (which causes stretching) and if you're carrying anything, you're going to increase the weight above that 200 pounds per 0.33 sqft....

Now, if your trailer is an "ultralight" model with 1/4" plywood sheet decking, you can imagine why we say, "USE RIGID FOAM TO SPREAD YOUR WEIGHT"...

Is it any wonder why nobody at Keystone will tell you, "Sure, you weigh 226 pounds, you're safe to walk on your roof, but if you weigh 227, you can't walk on it"... Then, when the claim comes in that you were "relying on what Tom told me yesterday in your CS department" and I was carrying a new air conditioner across the roof and my foot broke through the plywood... You owe me a new roof because I was doing what Tom said I could do.....

Ain't gonna happen.... You also won't find anyone at Ford that will tell you that it's OK to sit on the hood of your new SuperDuty.... Although it's probably designed to hold 300 or 400 pounds, but not in "every location on the hood"....
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Old 08-06-2020, 01:51 PM   #37
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I think I am getting a headache! Bhwhahahahaha Bill-2020... to get the new A/C on the roof, DO NOT use the Keystone roof ladder but use a ladder on the side of the camper adjacent to where the A/C install is to occur. Make sure you have a nice long ladder and put the base out from the camper a little farther than if you were just climbing. Anyway, get up on top; use a tie down strap(s) around the A/C and pull it up the ladder once you are on top with a GOOD friend below walking it up the ladder from below as best he can. Don't repeat don't try and muscle the A/C on your shoulder going up the camper's ladder. I suspect if you do you should have that friend video tape the thing as it will be a great youtube video!
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Old 08-06-2020, 07:07 PM   #38
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I think I am getting a headache! Bhwhahahahaha Bill-2020... to get the new A/C on the roof, DO NOT use the Keystone roof ladder but use a ladder on the side of the camper adjacent to where the A/C install is to occur. Make sure you have a nice long ladder and put the base out from the camper a little farther than if you were just climbing. Anyway, get up on top; use a tie down strap(s) around the A/C and pull it up the ladder once you are on top with a GOOD friend below walking it up the ladder from below as best he can. Don't repeat don't try and muscle the A/C on your shoulder going up the camper's ladder. I suspect if you do you should have that friend video tape the thing as it will be a great youtube video!
Take two aspirin for that brain pain. I don't have a ladder on the passport (less holes to worry about!). Yes, I already have a 20' extension ladder, a plywood "sled" with 2x4 rails constructed to pull the new a/c up the ladder and slide the old one down. I remember huffing packs of shingles over my shoulder and up a ladder in my early 20s on my mothers house... August, ABQ... hot as all get out. But it was a dry heat! An a/c is just too bulky to try that.
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Old 08-06-2020, 08:22 PM   #39
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Not sure why anyone would want to add the cheap a## factory ladder, there are much better ladders to access the roof, whether it's walkable or not. If it's to be able to strap stuff to then that's not advisable either, eventually that crap tied to it will just break it off.
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