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05-14-2012, 06:31 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Texas
Posts: 343
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Schematic's on plunbing and electric
Will Keystone give you the schematic's on plumbing and electric for your particular RV. I know that Hitchhiker, Jayco, and Dutchman will, not sure about Keystone. It's a nice feature for tracing problems and mod's. Thanks
__________________
Sandy & Ann
2019 Alpine 3401RS
2011 Ford F350 Diesel
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05-14-2012, 06:43 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Northville NY in the Adirondacks
Posts: 2,128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sandy43
Will Keystone give you the schematic's on plumbing and electric for your particular RV. I know that Hitchhiker, Jayco, and Dutchman will, not sure about Keystone. It's a nice feature for tracing problems and mod's. Thanks
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You can certainly contact Customer Service and see what they'll provide and whether it is free or at a price.
I don't recall anyone ever saying that they had these kinds of documents for Keystone products.
Let us know what you find out, please.
__________________
'11 Cougar 326MKS loaded with mods
'12 Ford F250 SuperCab 6.7 PowerStroke Diesel
Amateur Radio: KD2IAT (146.520) GMRS: WQPG808 (462.675 TPL 141.3)
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05-15-2012, 04:40 AM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: North Texas
Posts: 1,000
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Sandy43 -
I, like several others, tried to contact Keystone about this shortly after our purchase of the Alpine. Basically, these trailers are put together similar to houses. "There's a duplex plug over there, now run this wire to it". I would suspect other manufacturers are the same even with blueprints. I know that there are other 3640 owners who have minor differences in their wiring, such as where the ATS is located. You should certainly contact Keystone and ask, just don't be surprised. It would be nice to have a standard wiring/plumbing pattern and published schematic.
Ron
__________________
2011 Alpine 3640RL (Beauty)
(Gone! Now replaced by Beauty3)
2016 Ford F-450 (The Beast)
Diesel 4x4, DRW, LB, CC
Comfort Ride Hitch
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05-15-2012, 06:00 AM
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#4
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,846
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To my knowledge, Airstream, Avion, Silver Stream/Silver Streak and the "old" Holiday Rambler genre of trailers were the last to include electrical and plumbing prints in their owner's manual. I've not seen any trailer with a published blueprint of those systems since the early 80's. I'd guess part of it is the cost to maintain the standard and the realization that as things get more complex, the cost of being "exact" goes up. Allow the assembly to "ad lib" and costs go down (profits go up)....
As Geo said, there are slight differences in many of the same model trailers, so for the factory to provide an "exact blueprint" would be impossible.
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John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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05-15-2012, 06:21 AM
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#5
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Permanent User Ban
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Bartlesville, Oklahoma
Posts: 1,124
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I know that most RV companies do not include schematics of their professional, well thought out plumbing systems. Perhaps this is to protect the intellectual property of their skilled designs.
As a courtesy, I drew up a simple diagram to show how most RV water systems are laid out.
Hope you find this helpful.
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05-15-2012, 06:51 AM
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#6
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,846
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SAD,
Now that you've let the cat out of the bag........
SADly (pun intended) I think you are probably more correct than anyone wants to admit
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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05-15-2012, 07:05 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Tucson AZ
Posts: 616
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lol, that reminds me of drawing with a etcha sketch.
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05-15-2012, 07:08 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Texas
Posts: 343
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Just talked to Robyn at Keystone. Their are NO schematic's concerning plumb & elec.. She admitted to a little "ad-lib" without actually saying it. She did say they can help anyone get to any part of the RV to correct most problems. I told her, I don't have much faith in dealers dealing with most problems. She said she hears that often, but she or the Keystone techs will help in anyway they can to resolve most situations, good to know.
I made a copy of SAD's schematic, it will definitely become part of my Keystone Manual.
__________________
Sandy & Ann
2019 Alpine 3401RS
2011 Ford F350 Diesel
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05-18-2012, 02:50 PM
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#9
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Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Pioneer, CA
Posts: 48
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I tried to get the schematics from both Dutchman and Keystone. Both declined to send them. But when I had a Fleetwood Tioga SL, class C, They sent: plumbing for water (hot and cold), LP, grey and black, wiring for 120v and 12v. Boy were those helpful
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Me-Danny
DW-Lynn
BigDog-Kelley
LittleDog-Kroozer
LittleCat-Dottie
NewCat-Billie
'98DodgeRam1500/ClubCab/4X4
'14Springdale202QBWE
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05-18-2012, 03:01 PM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Bismarck, AR
Posts: 133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtas
I tried to get the schematics from both Dutchman and Keystone. Both declined to send them. But when I had a Fleetwood Tioga SL, class C, They sent: plumbing for water (hot and cold), LP, grey and black, wiring for 120v and 12v. Boy were those helpful
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They are a must with Fleetwood! ; )
__________________
2011 Avalanche 340TG
2001 Silverado 2500HD Crew Cab
B&W Companion Fifth Wheel Hitch
Had
2008 Hornet Retreat 38BHDS (Good camper)
2006 Terry 320DBHS (POS)
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05-18-2012, 03:19 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Ottawa Valley
Posts: 329
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SADly that is too funny and absolutely correct from what I have seen on my Cougar......I couldn't believe my eyes, when trouble shooting a tailight out.
Unfortunately I believe the same poor workmanship is everywhere, up to and including new houses......all in the name of flatrate $, so gettir done fast.
__________________
2011 325SRX , Mor-Ryde Pinbox
2004 Ram 3500DRW 6spd,4x4,QC.LB ,340L aux tank
1999 Concours
2014 FJR
2014 Jetta TDI
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05-20-2012, 03:04 PM
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#12
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Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Oregon
Posts: 68
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Wiring
Your diagram's not complete SAD - the "pump" isn't connected to anything. HAHAHA......but it's a crude, but probably quite accurate drawing otherwise. Probably better than what you'll get from Keystone. I wanted one for the TV cable installed - and it's not available. One of the more "perfect" uses for the rubber flab on the slide out.......as long as I'm careful!!!
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05-20-2012, 05:06 PM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 4,179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pappydude
Your diagram's not complete SAD - the "pump" isn't connected to anything. HAHAHA......but it's a crude, but probably quite accurate drawing otherwise. Probably better than what you'll get from Keystone. I wanted one for the TV cable installed - and it's not available. One of the more "perfect" uses for the rubber flab on the slide out.......as long as I'm careful!!!
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Are you sure yours is?
I plan on cleaning up some of the plumbing on my Copper Canyon, the routing waste a lot of space in the bath vanity.
__________________
Russ & Paula and Belle the Beagle.
2016 Ram Laramie 3500 DRW 14,000# GVWR (New TV)
2005 Copper Canyon 293 FWSLS 32’ GVWR 12,360
Visit and enjoy Oregon State Parks
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05-30-2012, 04:39 PM
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#14
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Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Kingston WA
Posts: 93
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Sad,
Loved your schematic - got a good chuckle out of it. Heck, we didn't even get an owner's manual that was specific to our trailer, let alone a wiring or plumbing diagram. You would think that when you're spending the kind of money these things cost that they could at least provide you with a useful, model-specific owner's manual. Love the trailer, though.
__________________
Bill Stuart
2012 Alpine 3555RL
2015 RAM 3500 Laramie Limited Mega Cab Dually 4X4 Cummins, Aisin trans, 4.10 gears
Andersen Ultimate 5th Wheel Connection
Previous RV's:
1992 Prowler 35' Bunkhouse
1986 Fireball 30'
1978 Nomad 24'
1963 Kenskill 19.5'
1972 Dyna Cruiser Camper on '72 F-250
A Tent
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08-28-2012, 10:46 AM
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#15
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Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Corona, CA
Posts: 11
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I tried to get the wiring info because the bathrom (and living room to a lesser extent) decorative 6" strip of wall paper was curling. I wanted to put a 3/4" strip of flat molding over the edges to hold them down. Called keysone so I could find out if I had enough clearance from wiring so I could use a brad gun to make it easy. They said they had no clue (not even the thickness of the wall!) and had no access to blueprints that either I or they could look at for the answer. Just like the quality control "inspectors", seems like they run the company as a Moe, Larry and Curly operation!!
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08-30-2012, 05:05 PM
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#16
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Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Elk Grove, CA 95624
Posts: 11
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Wouldn't it be nice
I would sure like one for our trailer but have been told that they are not available. For entertainment some day when you don't have much else to do, go watch the repair technicans try to trace and fix an electrical fault. More art form and grizzled experience than anything else. Oh, by the way, it isn't entertaining unless your aren't the one paying for the repair.
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10-14-2012, 05:31 AM
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#17
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Round Rock
Posts: 218
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Found this thread, after calling Keystone in hopes of getting a plumbing diagram of my Springdale 247FWRLLS. What I read just now, was what I was fearing, that nothing would be available.
Pin weight on the 247 is on the light side. Tows better with gray and black tanks somewhat full. I suspect the black and bathroom gray tanks are forward of the axles. During my call with Keystone, lady I spoke with made conflicting statements as she tried to decipher something she was looking at on her computer screen.
Looks like I have a project this winter, mapping out the plumbing (and if I get ambitious enough, the electrical) in the trailer. In college (early '80s), an assignment for cadets in the Texas A&M / Texas Maritime Academy's Marine Engineering program was to map out the various water, steam and oil systems in the engine room of the Texas Clipper ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_Clipper). Looks like I can put some old skills to good use!
__________________
2013 Silverado 3500HD - Duramax/Allison - CC, long bed, SRW, 2WD
2013 Springdale 247FWRLLS - 1st 5er sold - 1 July 2016
2017 Grand Design Reflection 303RLS
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10-14-2012, 04:25 PM
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#18
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 478
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I wish you luck with the wiring once you open a panel and see that Rats Nest of wiring. As far as I know, Keystone does not use any wiring diagrams, each assembler does their own thing and more than likely there are no two Keystone wired the same. Plumbing isn't as bad, kind of hard to tie those lines into knots.
__________________
2011 Chevy Silverado 3500HD Ext Cab LT DRW Duramax/Allison pulling a 2012 SOB (still Thor, but not a Keystone), Dual ACs, 4 Door Fridge, Fireplace, Sleep Number Bed, Level-Up Auto Levelers, Disc Brakes, Winegard DirecTV SlimLine Auto Dish, Onan 5.5K, Splendide Combo Washer/Dryer, GY G114s on HiSpec 17.5 wheels, TrailAir Tri-Glide Pin Box, Mor/ryde IS.
Michelle & Ann Sullivan and 4 American Shorthairs
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10-26-2012, 05:15 AM
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#19
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAD
I know that most RV companies do not include schematics of their professional, well thought out plumbing systems. Perhaps this is to protect the intellectual property of their skilled designs.
As a courtesy, I drew up a simple diagram to show how most RV water systems are laid out.
Hope you find this helpful.
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How old are You?lol Bushman
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10-26-2012, 10:10 AM
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#20
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sandy43
Just talked to Robyn at Keystone. Their are NO schematic's concerning plumb & elec.. She admitted to a little "ad-lib" without actually saying it. She did say they can help anyone get to any part of the RV to correct most problems. I told her, I don't have much faith in dealers dealing with most problems. She said she hears that often, but she or the Keystone techs will help in anyway they can to resolve most situations, good to know.
I made a copy of SAD's schematic, it will definitely become part of my Keystone Manual.
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I don't believe that Keystone do not have wiring diagrams for their units. They would need to do this in the design process. It may have to change once the prototype is built but they will have them. Let's face it. Most of those people on the floor couldn't figure where a wire needed to go without guidance.
As for Robyn saying "she or the Keystone techs will help in anyway they can to resolve most situations". Not true. I had an issue and contacted Customer Service for information. When I informed Robyn that I would address the issue myself rather than take it to a dealer, she refused any further help and would not supply the information. I had to write the President of Keystone to get the information.
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