Power out to half of Trailer

[brianguy132]

I have a 50 amp service in my trailer. I ran an electrical tester and verified that the incoming feed before the breaker is only feeding half of the two-pole breaker for a total of 110 going in. The red feed is not supplying power properly.

To troubleshoot, I checked the park power post and confirmed that each of the legs is supplying 110 and 220 properly where you plug in at. I then checked the connection at the back of the trailer and it also properly has 220 feeding the trailer. The 110 black leg is working and the 110 red leg is working and combined they show 220. The power from the red connection never reached the breaker panel.

Does the main power feed go anywhere other than the main breaker panel before distribution? Is there any place I should look for a short? Any idea why the power doesn't reach the distribution panel?

Since the power is not feeding half of the panel board one of the GFCI's also doesn't have power so the GFCI can't be reset.

Thanks for your help, any advice is appreciated.

I am running a 2010 Western Big Sky 5th Wheel Trailer.

[flybouy]

Where did you "check the connection at the back of the trailer"? At the cable that connects to the trailer or inside at the back of the plug that the cable connects to? Do you have an EMS or Surge protection device mounted inside? Do you have an automatic transfer switch for a generator? Need to know these things before knowing if there are any more connections between outside and the distribution panel inside.

BTW, it sounds like you are looking for an "open circuit" and not a "short".

[brianguy132]

Originally Posted by flybouy

Where did you "check the connection at the back of the trailer"? At the cable that connects to the trailer or inside at the back of the plug that the cable connects to? Do you have an EMS or Surge protection device mounted inside? Do you have an automatic transfer switch for a generator? Need to know these things before knowing if there are any more connections between outside and the distribution panel inside.

BTW, it sounds like you are looking for an "open circuit" and not a "short".

Responses to each of your questions shown below:
1. Where did you "check the connection at the back of the trailer"?

I put the tester on the back of the outlet box where the trailer wires connect to the hookup connection.

2. Do you have an EMS or Surge protection device mounted inside?

I have a surge protector mounted to the pole but I'm not aware of another inside the trailer.

3. Do you have an automatic transfer switch for a generator?
My unit did not come with a generator so I don't think there is an automatic transfer switch. But admittedly I haven't looked for it to be sure.

Thanks again for your help!

[flybouy]

Sounds like a "straight shot" from the outside connector to the panel inside. Do the simple thing first. Cycle the main breaker in the camera's distribution panel off then back on. If one phase is still out then unplug from shore power, remove panel access cover and check where the electric line comes in and make sure that connection is tight.

"The power from the red connection never reached the breaker panel.'" How did you determine this?

[brianguy132]

Originally Posted by flybouy

Sounds like a "straight shot" from the outside connector to the panel inside. Do the simple thing first. Cycle the main breaker in the camera's distribution panel off then back on. If one phase is still out then unplug from shore power, remove panel access cover and check where the electric line comes in and make sure that connection is tight.

"The power from the red connection never reached the breaker panel.'" How did you determine this?

During my troubleshooting I replaced the 2 pole breaker which also had the same issue so I'm pretty sure it's not a loose connection at the panel.

1. "The power from the red connection never reached the breaker panel.'" How did you determine this?

I put my tester on the red leg and then bypassed the breaker to the back of the panel which showed no power. I also connected the tester to both the 110 legs and thought that it should have showed 220 which only showed 110. It did show 220 on the back of the trailer between the red and black cables. I also connected the tester to the red cable and ground which showed no power.

I'm stumped. My only idea is pulling the red cable out of the hookup connection at the back of the trailer, inspecting it, and re-connecting it ensuring it has a full connection. I did tighten the screw and tested to make sure the screw securing it was hot but I didn't inspect the cable to verify if I was just crimping wire insulation. The probablility of this helping is pretty slim but it's the only weak point I can think of unless the cable itself has an issue.

[flybouy]

"I'm stumped. My only idea is pulling the red cable out of the hookup connection at the back of the trailer, inspecting it, and re-connecting it ensuring it has a full connection. I did tighten the screw and tested to make sure the screw securing it was hot but I didn't inspect the cable to verify if I was just crimping wire insulation. The probablility of this helping is pretty slim but it's the only weak point I can think of unless the cable itself has an issue."

This would be logical, after you disconnect the power. The other "test" would be to check the continuity of the red wire inside with an ohmmeter and the power off. Disconnect both ends of the red wire. Take a length of wire (size not important) of sufficient length to reach each end. Connect the smaller wire to one end of the red wire and to the meter. Take the other test lead from the meter and touch it to the other end of the red wire. The resistance should be zero or near zero depending on the meter setting.

[brianguy132]

Completing the loop sounds like a great idea. I'll try that out and let you know how it works. Thanks again for the idea and your help!

[flybouy]

We had someone here recently that had a short from one line to ground that was making a "hot skin" condition. Aluminum sided trailer that would shock you if you touched any metal on the outside of the camper.

They had a mobile tech out and found the main feed to the inside panel had a staple thru the wire under a cabinet. Hope you find an "easy fix" for yours. Let us know.

[+Ruff Rider]

STOP before you go any further!!!
First of all your rig only uses 110 volts on a 50 amp service. There is nothing in your rv that uses 220 volts. There are 2 circuits in your RV, a 12 volt and a 110 volt. Even your AC unit only runs on 110 volts. Now you may ask why I know this is because I hooked mine to a 220 service and blew up my inverter. I almost did it twice. They are only $300. You have a 110 volt on a 50 amp service. You only have 3 wires to hook up. White, Black and a green. White is common. Black is hot. Green is ground. Do not get the wires crossed. IMPORTANT. If you hook up 220 to your RV you will damage something. I found this out the hard way. Learn from my mistake and ONLY run 110 volts to your RV.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by +Ruff Rider

STOP before you go any further!!!
First of all your rig only uses 110 volts on a 50 amp service. There is nothing in your rv that uses 220 volts. There are 2 circuits in your RV, a 12 volt and a 110 volt. Even your AC unit only runs on 110 volts. Now you may ask why I know this is because I hooked mine to a 220 service and blew up my inverter. I almost did it twice. They are only $300. You have a 110 volt on a 50 amp service. You only have 3 wires to hook up. White, Black and a green. White is common. Black is hot. Green is ground. Do not get the wires crossed. IMPORTANT. If you hook up 220 to your RV you will damage something. I found this out the hard way. Learn from my mistake and ONLY run 110 volts to your RV.

You need to double check. You have 3 wires on a 15/20A service as well as 30A. You have 4 wires on a 50A service - 2 hot 120VAC legs, grd and neutral. So in essence you have THREE circuits in your RV; 1 12vdc and 2 120vac legs.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by +Ruff Rider

STOP before you go any further!!!
First of all your rig only uses 110 volts on a 50 amp service. There is nothing in your rv that uses 220 volts. There are 2 circuits in your RV, a 12 volt and a 110 volt. Even your AC unit only runs on 110 volts. Now you may ask why I know this is because I hooked mine to a 220 service and blew up my inverter. I almost did it twice. They are only $300. You have a 110 volt on a 50 amp service. You only have 3 wires to hook up. White, Black and a green. White is common. Black is hot. Green is ground. Do not get the wires crossed. IMPORTANT. If you hook up 220 to your RV you will damage something. I found this out the hard way. Learn from my mistake and ONLY run 110 volts to your RV.

Originally Posted by sourdough

You need to double check. You have 3 wires on a 15/20A service as well as 30A. You have 4 wires on a 50A service - 2 hot 120VAC legs, grd and neutral. So in essence you have THREE circuits in your RV; 1 12vdc and 2 120vac legs.

Maybe I'm missing something in Ruff Rider's post, but it's my understanding that ALL 50 amp RV input is ALWAYS two 120Volt legs, a neutral and a common ground. That ALWAYS provides for the potential for 240 volts (depending on where you put the multimeter leads). When measured between L1 and L2, you'll ALWAYS read 240 volts, between either L1 or L2 and neutral or ground will ALWAYS read 120 volts....

CONVERSELY, in a 30 amp circuit, you can wire it with one hot, one neutral and one ground (120 volt RV outlet) or you can wire it with two hots and one neutral/ground (240 volt "dryer" outlet)....

There's ALWAYS 240 volt potential in every 50 amp RV shore power cord/power center and you can ALWAYS read 240 volts in an operational and properly functioning RV shore power cord/power center (if you measure between L1 and L2).

Since wires don't "change position on terminals" without assistance, if the trailer was working previously, AND if the OP has not "rewired" his power center, then the loss of one leg (half of the dual connector strip terminals) has to be either an issue with a loose connection or a bad circuit breaker (if in the shore power cord or inside the trailer) or a bad power input at the campground plug.

Sourdough is correct, you'll always have two 120 volt incoming circuits in a "properly wired" 50 amp RV circuit and the "potential between them is no different than a 50 amp "stove plug" in a S&B house". It's 120 volts on each leg (to ground or neutral) AND always 240 volts between those two legs.

[bobbecky]

Depending on the park, and there are some that you will not get 240 volts from hot to hot but will only get 208 volts, but you will still get 120 volts from either hot leg to the ground or neutral, so don’t panic if you run across this situation.

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by bobbecky

Depending on the park, and there are some that you will not get 240 volts from hot to hot but will only get 208 volts, but you will still get 120 volts from either hot leg to the ground or neutral, so don’t panic if you run across this situation.

That's dependent on how the transformer from the utility company is wired. Typically Delta, Y, or Delta Y. Receiving a 208 V reading is typically not found in "modern" residential use.

[Customer1]

Originally Posted by +Ruff Rider

STOP before you go any further!!!
First of all your rig only uses 110 volts on a 50 amp service. There is nothing in your rv that uses 220 volts. There are 2 circuits in your RV, a 12 volt and a 110 volt. Even your AC unit only runs on 110 volts. Now you may ask why I know this is because I hooked mine to a 220 service and blew up my inverter. I almost did it twice. They are only $300. You have a 110 volt on a 50 amp service. You only have 3 wires to hook up. White, Black and a green. White is common. Black is hot. Green is ground. Do not get the wires crossed. IMPORTANT. If you hook up 220 to your RV you will damage something. I found this out the hard way. Learn from my mistake and ONLY run 110 volts to your RV.

The post quoted is darn near 100% wrong. Ruff Rider should not be giving this incorrect info and I hope no one believes it.

[chuckster57]

Originally Posted by Customer1

The post quoted is darn near 100% wrong. Ruff Rider should not be giving this incorrect info and I hope no one believes it.

Ok, I’ve sat back and watched this thread. Can you explain what is “wrong”?

[sourdough]

Chuck,

"You have a 110 volt on a 50 amp service. You only have 3 wires to hook up. White, Black and a green. White is common. Black is hot. Green is ground."

I'm sleepy too....

[chuckster57]

Originally Posted by sourdough

Chuck,



"You have a 110 volt on a 50 amp service. You only have 3 wires to hook up. White, Black and a green. White is common. Black is hot. Green is ground."



I'm sleepy too....

Yeah 50A service will have 4 physical conductors, but in the end it’s still 2 legs of 110, not 220.

These type of threads can get people “amped up” with 110/220 arguments. There isn’t any appliance in an RV that uses 220 and in that regard he is 100% correct.

30A service will have 3 physical conductors.

[flybouy]

Maybe this will help. The 50 AMP is 120 v per conductor, is is also 240 v between the 2 lines. This is because the 2 lines are "out of phase" from each other. Below is the proper 30 and 50 amp RV services wire diagram.

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by chuckster57

Yeah 50A service will have 4 physical conductors, but in the end it’s still 2 legs of 110, not 220.

These type of threads can get people “amped up” with 110/220 arguments. There isn’t any appliance in an RV that uses 220 and in that regard he is 100% correct.

30A service will have 3 physical conductors.

Sorry Chuck, My Cheap heat system uses 220v to give 5,000 watts of heat. I tapped the main and have a 30 amp, 220 v disconnect within 10' of the main panel. I plan on replacing my main with a double half size breaker that will be 50/30.

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by +Ruff Rider

STOP before you go any further!!!
First of all your rig only uses 110 volts on a 50 amp service. There is nothing in your rv that uses 220 volts. There are 2 circuits in your RV, a 12 volt and a 110 volt. Even your AC unit only runs on 110 volts. Now you may ask why I know this is because I hooked mine to a 220 service and blew up my inverter. I almost did it twice. They are only $300. You have a 110 volt on a 50 amp service. You only have 3 wires to hook up. White, Black and a green. White is common. Black is hot. Green is ground. Do not get the wires crossed. IMPORTANT. If you hook up 220 to your RV you will damage something. I found this out the hard way. Learn from my mistake and ONLY run 110 volts to your RV.

Ruff Rider, you have been called out on this, but you are soooo wrong!
You likely only have a 30 amp service on your RV, and 30 amp services and pedestal 30 amp outlet is only 110v and 30 amps, three wire.

The 50 amp outlet on the pedestal provides 220v and 50 amps. The breaker panel in the RV is designed differently than the one in your house. The two buss bars go different directions rather than parallel like a house.