Truck/Trailer Decisions

[Ironheadchop]

Hello all. We are in the market for a new 5th wheel camper for a family of 5. I am wanting a Montana or a Bighorn that sleeps at least 8 people and this thing would be loaded down with all our stuff as we pack everything but the kitchen sink. I was originally looking to get a 23' F-350 with the 7.3 gas motor but after looking at the GCWR's the 7.3 is only good for 28,600 or 29k depending on what trim you get vs. the 6.7 TD HO coming in at 35,200lbs. I really do not want a DRW or a Diesel but if I was to have to get one or the other I would get the 6.7 to stay with a SRW truck. Does anyone here pull a large 5th with a SRW F-350? I'm sure with the SRW I would be legally over weight regardless.

[jsb5717]

Welcome aboard! You’ve got the right train of thought but focused on the wrong thing. The truck’s tow rating isn’t the real issue. Payload (cargo capacity) is going to be the gotcha.

Since you don’t have the trailer you’ll have to calculate hitch weight based on 23% of the trailer’s GVWR. If you’re a looking at a 16,000 lbs GVWR rig, for instance, then you’ll be looking at a calculated hitch weight of 3680 lbs. Add to that the weight of hitch, gear, and people. That will put you in the ball park of 4300 lbs. That might be more than you’ll actually load onto the truck but it will point you in the right direction. At those weights you are in dually territory.

When looking at trucks, open the driver door and look at the stickers there. One of them will tell you what that truck’s cargo capacity (payload) rating is. Something like “Cargo and occupants not to exceed xxxx lbs). That number is your truck’s payload rating. It should be a higher number than the weight you’ll be loading.

FWIW, at those weights I wouldn’t even consider a gas motor. Diesel all the way. YMMV

[chuckster57]

Welcome to the forum

IMHO you’re doing yourself and everyone else a disservice if you don’t get at least a 1 ton DRW. It’s not all about being “legal” it’s about being SAFE.

I had a rear truck tire blow out with my previous 5er hooked up. I was able to safely pull over and change the tire. Can’t imagine what would have happened if I had a flat with only 1 tire on each end of the axle.

Again JMHO, YMMV.

[Ironheadchop]

The one on the door of the truck im looking at says GVWR 11,500. Is that the sticker you are referring?

[Ironheadchop]

Sorry. I see it now. The chart says for a 7.3 it would be 3,990.

[JRTJH]

There are two stickers on the driver's door jamb.

Don't go by a chart in any brochure !!!!! Ford (and all the others) use an XL truck "properly equipped" to get that "maximum cargo capacity"... Then when you buy an XLT or a Lariat or King Ranch, the extra 1000 pounds of options comes directly off that 3990 capacity of the XL. So you could easily special order a Lariat with all the options and wind up with a payload capacity of 2000-2500 pounds rather than that 3990.... Read the footnotes at the bottom of that chart, it will say something like, "Capacity based on properly equipped truck with no optional equipment" or something like that .....

Here is the statement cut and pasted from the 2015 SuperDuty brochure:

"Maximum capabilities shown are for properly equipped vehicles with required equipment and a 150-lb. driver. Weight of additional options, equipment, passengers and cargo must be deducted from this weight. For additional information, see your Ford Dealer." The diesel is "optional equipment" the 4x4 drive is optional, the leather seats are optional, carpet is optional (base XL has rubber floor mats and minimum sound insulation) and don't forget those wheels and better/bigger tires, console, rear inverter package and USB chargers, seat warmers, heated steering wheel, B&O sound system, sub-woofer, electric passenger seat, and especially the Underbed fifth wheel hitch system. All that comes directly off the brochure "maximum payload capacity"...

One is silver, black and white and has the axle ratings, paint codes, etc. There is also a yellow/white sticker with the tire sizes, tire inflation pressure. That yellow sticker, at the top, gives the payload. It will have a statement, "Combined weight of Cargo and passengers should never exceed XXXX".

It'll look like this:

[jsb5717]

Originally Posted by Ironheadchop

Sorry. I see it now. The chart says for a 7.3 it would be 3,990.

If you’re looking at a chart online then you’re getting a best-case number for that line of truck. You’ll need to check the specific truck you’d buy to get’s it’s actual payload. There are variables and each truck receives its specific label when it’s produced and based on which accessories are installed by the OEM.

A diesel truck will have less payload available than gas, but the torque benefits far outweigh the difference. Those long, steep hills feel a lot better with a diesel.

[wiredgeorge]

Charts and brochures are typically sales material. You see that big super heavy duty truck pulling a huge 5th wheel in the commercial and the narrator says that the so and so heavy duty has a tow capacity of 45000 lbs? NOT REALLY. The fine print will say "as equipped" and that would be towing a specially constructed sled with no wind resistance on a closed course to establish "tow rating" and the special truck will be a standard cab base model with 8' bed and big tires and a tow package... etc.

Payload is the short pole in the tent in most cases. The yellow/white placard in the door frame saying "the combined weight of occupants and cargo should not exceed..." that is the payload. That is the pin weight of the fully loaded trailer (23% or gross weight of the camper) plus the weight of the hitch and the weight of stuff in the truck plus the weight of the passengers and anything else you added to the truck such as step rails, brush guard, fancy diamond plate whatever, headache rack.... all eat your payload.

Best payload on a stripped srw one ton is around 4K pounds. Gross weight of any camper over 13K lbs will pretty much take you over your payload capacity. Don't try the airbags and loading light thing because if you have a bunch of kiddos w/friends you will be loading the new trailer. You want a bigger trailer? DUALLY time.

[rhagfo]

Well gas or diesel you are still in DRW territory. My Ram 3500 Cummins, DRW Laramie trim has a payload of 5,411#.

[dutchmensport]

For the size of trailer you are considering, you'll want a dually for the stability. For the number of people you are transporting, you want a crew cab. For all the camping equipment and toys for the kiddo's, you'll want a long bed. For the power to pull all of this, you'll want a diesel. If you are considering the camper under question, you are in the big-boy territory. You have just moved from riding ponies to pulling wagons with Clydesdale draft horses!

[bill59]

With that big of a trailer and a gas engine, means you will have to use gasoline pumps. Most gas stations are not big rig friendly. Some Flying J's and Maverick's have dedicated RV lanes.

[Blueswede]

I agree with everything said so far....with that size 5th wheel you are definitely going to want a diesel dually. It's always better to have more truck...

[firestation12]

And still we haven’t addressed the trailer’s unladen weight vs the stuff that gets added i.e. propane, fresh water, equipment, bedding, clothes, camping gear, tools, food, weight of 5th wheel hitch, generator, shore power cord, EMS, and ????
Then there’s the crummy factory tires! Happy trails!

[JOontheGO]

I speak from experience...dont look at anything but a DRW for an XL 5th wheel. I would call what you described in your post as XL. Yes a srw can and will do it and people do it everyday, but take it from me its not safe. It's not worth your family's and everyone else around you safety. I have a 21 Fuzion 419, it's a 44' toy hauler, Shipping weight ~15,500#/3,500#Pin weights Gross weight is 20K. Dealer assured me the 21 F350 XL SRW 6.7TD Crew cab Long bed I HAD was more than enough truck. It was not...Towing the trailer home from the dealer EMPTY I realized I didn't have enough truck, every moderate bump felt like it was hitting the stops. I added 7,500# airbags and it "helped" mask the overloaded situation but we found out the hard way it was not safe, luckily we avoided an accident and any real damage, could have been a very hard and expensive lesson. Your paying 80-100K for a trailer dont skimp on what moves it safely. Deisel vs gas is personal preference, but the point about being big rig friendly is very valid and with the exception of Buc-ees most gas stations are not. I am 13'6" tall according to specs and most covers at the gas stations say they are 13'6" Keep in mind the mpg on the gas truck will also be lower than the a TD so your stops will also be more frequent. Sounds like you are shopping for Fords, if you are looking at F350 DRW trcuks look hard at a F450 before you make a decision. That is what we stepped up to and it is an amazing truck, turns on a dime compared to the 350 and they are virtually the same $$$$.